Comments for Green Oasis http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis One Mormon boy’s iconoclastic quest to remix and rectify his notions of truth, mind, myth, love, life, and transcendence. Thu, 02 Jul 2009 17:27:03 -0400 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8 hourly 1 Comment on Five Things by Jonathan http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/2009/07/01/five-things-26/comment-page-1/#comment-10974 Jonathan Thu, 02 Jul 2009 17:27:03 +0000 http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/?p=1711#comment-10974 I love you, too. (You do realize that you took a vow of poverty when we got married, right?) I love you, too. (You do realize that you took a vow of poverty when we got married, right?)

]]> Comment on Five Things by Lacey http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/2009/07/01/five-things-26/comment-page-1/#comment-10973 Lacey Thu, 02 Jul 2009 00:12:33 +0000 http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/?p=1711#comment-10973 I'm glad you think our house is clean. I just think it's <i>cleaner</i> than it has been. Plus, I like to hear that people put a lot of trust in you at work. I hope it's dealing with work things and not just personal things, but this is your wife who would like you to get a higher paying position. Just so you know I'm grateful for the lifestyle you provide for us and I hope you can find something that you enjoy and makes more money so we can have an even more secure future, but if not I can get rid of the baby clothes and give us some space! I love you babe! I’m glad you think our house is clean. I just think it’s cleaner than it has been.

Plus, I like to hear that people put a lot of trust in you at work. I hope it’s dealing with work things and not just personal things, but this is your wife who would like you to get a higher paying position.

Just so you know I’m grateful for the lifestyle you provide for us and I hope you can find something that you enjoy and makes more money so we can have an even more secure future, but if not I can get rid of the baby clothes and give us some space!

I love you babe!

]]> Comment on Mr. Deity was Mormon? by Jonathan http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/2009/06/26/mr-deity-was-mormon/comment-page-1/#comment-10972 Jonathan Tue, 30 Jun 2009 22:35:08 +0000 http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/?p=1707#comment-10972 Yeah, basically human beings function irrationally and always will to some degree. I think we'll always have superstitions of one form or another. I don't think we should be satisfied with that though. If we can have a president who invades Iraq because he thinks God told him to, that's not some harmless quirk of human nature. Life would be safer and healthier if we could root out such harmful superstitions. I sympathize with your thoughts about prayer. I never could figure it out either. I tried praying harder, smarter, humbler, more often, etc. Never got any clear answers. It felt like praying to a stone idol. After years of trying with no success, I decided to stop wasting my time. Yeah, basically human beings function irrationally and always will to some degree. I think we’ll always have superstitions of one form or another. I don’t think we should be satisfied with that though. If we can have a president who invades Iraq because he thinks God told him to, that’s not some harmless quirk of human nature. Life would be safer and healthier if we could root out such harmful superstitions.

I sympathize with your thoughts about prayer. I never could figure it out either. I tried praying harder, smarter, humbler, more often, etc. Never got any clear answers. It felt like praying to a stone idol. After years of trying with no success, I decided to stop wasting my time.

]]> Comment on Mr. Deity was Mormon? by outclassed http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/2009/06/26/mr-deity-was-mormon/comment-page-1/#comment-10970 outclassed Tue, 30 Jun 2009 18:28:27 +0000 http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/?p=1707#comment-10970 @Jonathan, That is a very good explanation, although I must admit that humans tend to simply function this way. Nobody likes to be told they are wrong. Is it such a bad thing to be so irrational? Prayer is another one of those things that deals with "how ordinary experiences with natural explanations can be misinterpreted and become the source of faith-promoting stories of divine intervention." I have had a difficult time with prayer/praying my entire life. It just doesn't make sense. When people say their prayers' have been answered it drives me crazy. Why yours and not mine? Then the grand-wizards tell you, "it is because you are not praying for the right things....you must pray to know what to pray for." What the hell does that mean, it is easy to see how this is a never-ending cycle, I mean how does one 'pray harder'? Who am I really even talking to, myself? Anyway, sometimes all these disagreements seem silly. Either you have faith or you do not. Obviously most Churches simply function off of faith and faith is so difficult to refute with any zealot. Why do you need evidence if you have faith and so on... What I cannot reconcile is how +one-billion people could be so wrong or duped for so long? Are all souls not created equal, are some just smarter than others, are we all so easily mislead? @Mr. D Can't wait for the Joseph episode...my KJV is marked-up and falling apart as well. OC @Jonathan,
That is a very good explanation, although I must admit that humans tend to simply function this way. Nobody likes to be told they are wrong. Is it such a bad thing to be so irrational?

Prayer is another one of those things that deals with “how ordinary experiences with natural explanations can be misinterpreted and become the source of faith-promoting stories of divine intervention.” I have had a difficult time with prayer/praying my entire life. It just doesn’t make sense. When people say their prayers’ have been answered it drives me crazy. Why yours and not mine? Then the grand-wizards tell you, “it is because you are not praying for the right things….you must pray to know what to pray for.” What the hell does that mean, it is easy to see how this is a never-ending cycle, I mean how does one ‘pray harder’? Who am I really even talking to, myself?

Anyway, sometimes all these disagreements seem silly. Either you have faith or you do not. Obviously most Churches simply function off of faith and faith is so difficult to refute with any zealot. Why do you need evidence if you have faith and so on…

What I cannot reconcile is how +one-billion people could be so wrong or duped for so long? Are all souls not created equal, are some just smarter than others, are we all so easily mislead?

@Mr. D
Can’t wait for the Joseph episode…my KJV is marked-up and falling apart as well.

OC

]]> Comment on Mr. Deity was Mormon? by Jonathan http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/2009/06/26/mr-deity-was-mormon/comment-page-1/#comment-10969 Jonathan Mon, 29 Jun 2009 04:38:06 +0000 http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/?p=1707#comment-10969 I don't know why, but knowing that you were Mormon makes the episodes funnier to watch. That Joseph Smith episode sounds great! Can't wait. I don’t know why, but knowing that you were Mormon makes the episodes funnier to watch.

That Joseph Smith episode sounds great! Can’t wait.

]]> Comment on Mr. Deity was Mormon? by Mr. Deity http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/2009/06/26/mr-deity-was-mormon/comment-page-1/#comment-10968 Mr. Deity Sun, 28 Jun 2009 23:56:31 +0000 http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/?p=1707#comment-10968 Outclassed is correct. I am a Formon. And that was my extremely marked-up KJV Bible from my Mormon days. People have written me, disappointed that I didn't have a quad (I saw too many of the bindings not hold up). If I had a prize to give away, you would get it. The only other Mormon reference I've made in the series is in part one of this two-part series (Mr. Deity and the Book). We have an episode coming up later in season three where Joseph Smith pitches his ideas for the Latter-Day to an awe-struck Mr. Deity. I think you'll love it! B Outclassed is correct. I am a Formon. And that was my extremely marked-up KJV Bible from my Mormon days. People have written me, disappointed that I didn’t have a quad (I saw too many of the bindings not hold up). If I had a prize to give away, you would get it. The only other Mormon reference I’ve made in the series is in part one of this two-part series (Mr. Deity and the Book).
We have an episode coming up later in season three where Joseph Smith pitches his ideas for the Latter-Day to an awe-struck Mr. Deity. I think you’ll love it! B

]]> Comment on Mr. Deity was Mormon? by Jonathan http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/2009/06/26/mr-deity-was-mormon/comment-page-1/#comment-10967 Jonathan Sun, 28 Jun 2009 21:52:47 +0000 http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/?p=1707#comment-10967 Ding! Ding! Ding! Ding!!1! 50 points to outclassed. Interesting question. I think there are many reasons for these stories. And I have my reasons for not putting too much stock in them. People have experiences that confirm in their minds their beliefs. I don't think the original story tellers are lying about them. I think they are telling the truth as they see it. Then, of course, the stories get amplified in the retelling until we have a full blown urban legend. I question the the original story teller's interpretation of the facts. Their interpretations seem rife with <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias">confirmation bias</a>, the tendency to focus on evidence that confirms our beliefs while neglecting evidence that refutes them. QualiaSoup has an <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPqerbz8KDc">excellent video</a> about how ordinary experiences with natural explanations can be misinterpreted and become the source of faith-promoting stories of divine intervention. <object width="320" height="265"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/NPqerbz8KDc&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/NPqerbz8KDc&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="320" height="265"></embed></object> Ding! Ding! Ding! Ding!!1! 50 points to outclassed.

Interesting question. I think there are many reasons for these stories. And I have my reasons for not putting too much stock in them.

People have experiences that confirm in their minds their beliefs. I don’t think the original story tellers are lying about them. I think they are telling the truth as they see it. Then, of course, the stories get amplified in the retelling until we have a full blown urban legend.

I question the the original story teller’s interpretation of the facts. Their interpretations seem rife with confirmation bias, the tendency to focus on evidence that confirms our beliefs while neglecting evidence that refutes them.

QualiaSoup has an excellent video about how ordinary experiences with natural explanations can be misinterpreted and become the source of faith-promoting stories of divine intervention.

]]> Comment on Mr. Deity was Mormon? by outclassed http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/2009/06/26/mr-deity-was-mormon/comment-page-1/#comment-10966 outclassed Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:53:03 +0000 http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/?p=1707#comment-10966 I believe it is the edition of the bible that Mr. Deity keeps swinging around that might prove he may have been Mormon. Do I win? Anyway, I have not dug too deep into your blog but I think I understand a bit where you are coming from. My question/comment for you revolves around stories that where always told to me growing up or shared in Church regarding faith and miracles etc. Were these stories simply made? For example, I was told about a male member whose house was on fire but he did not burn because he was wearing the special underwear...he lost everything else. Or what about all of those other stories from faithful members in the service during WWII who didn't smoke or drink coffee or whatnot and everything seemed to turn out well? And on and on... Do these stories not provide empirical evidence of some type of higher power....or are they simply manifestations of the human psyche - a person's way of interpreting or expressing their experiences? I am not really sure where I am going with all this, but just wondering. It is difficult for me to swallow that normal experiences from by grandpa or every other day people where all just a bunch of lies. I agree that Church history is rife with misleading and whitewashed information. Just curious, Thanks Outclassed and rethinking everything... I believe it is the edition of the bible that Mr. Deity keeps swinging around that might prove he may have been Mormon. Do I win?

Anyway, I have not dug too deep into your blog but I think I understand a bit where you are coming from. My question/comment for you revolves around stories that where always told to me growing up or shared in Church regarding faith and miracles etc. Were these stories simply made? For example, I was told about a male member whose house was on fire but he did not burn because he was wearing the special underwear…he lost everything else. Or what about all of those other stories from faithful members in the service during WWII who didn’t smoke or drink coffee or whatnot and everything seemed to turn out well? And on and on…

Do these stories not provide empirical evidence of some type of higher power….or are they simply manifestations of the human psyche – a person’s way of interpreting or expressing their experiences?

I am not really sure where I am going with all this, but just wondering. It is difficult for me to swallow that normal experiences from by grandpa or every other day people where all just a bunch of lies. I agree that Church history is rife with misleading and whitewashed information.

Just curious,
Thanks

Outclassed and rethinking everything…

]]> Comment on Lessons Learned During a Week Without Blogging by Jonathan http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/2009/06/25/lessons-learned-during-a-week-without-blogging/comment-page-1/#comment-10965 Jonathan Sun, 28 Jun 2009 14:45:32 +0000 http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/?p=1685#comment-10965 It's hard to find that balance. So far, so good. All those times that I have an urge to read more blogs, I have to find something else to do with my time. I'm missing some things, but it feels like a good trade off so far. It’s hard to find that balance. So far, so good. All those times that I have an urge to read more blogs, I have to find something else to do with my time. I’m missing some things, but it feels like a good trade off so far.

]]> Comment on Lessons Learned During a Week Without Blogging by chanson http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/2009/06/25/lessons-learned-during-a-week-without-blogging/comment-page-1/#comment-10964 chanson Sun, 28 Jun 2009 13:36:40 +0000 http://www.blakeclan.org/jon/greenoasis/?p=1685#comment-10964 I know how you feel. I love being motivated to write regularly, but I hate how it cuts into the time I might be spending on other things. I know how you feel. I love being motivated to write regularly, but I hate how it cuts into the time I might be spending on other things.

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