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	<title>Comments for Meddling Kids</title>
	
	<link>http://www.meddlingkids.org</link>
	<description>Canadians Advancing Science and Reason</description>
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		<title>Comment on CONGRATULATIONS! by boyinfidel</title>
		<link>http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/CommentsForMeddlingKids/~3/7ymfNdi4uDA/</link>
		<dc:creator>boyinfidel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Sep 2010 20:49:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.meddlingkids.org/?p=1349#comment-1229</guid>
		<description>Thanks Jim! Emma has been brushing up on her Dawkins and Hitchens in preparation for her first meeting with you :) &lt;br&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Jim! Emma has been brushing up on her Dawkins and Hitchens in preparation for her first meeting with you <img src='http://www.meddlingkids.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  </p>

<p><a href="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/S3qQv_N0IW31EAoZzRMwY--VdGM/0/da"><img src="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/S3qQv_N0IW31EAoZzRMwY--VdGM/0/di" border="0" ismap="true"></img></a><br/>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on An Example Of Not Getting It by biguglyjim</title>
		<link>http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/CommentsForMeddlingKids/~3/F2jGs-NZIDk/</link>
		<dc:creator>biguglyjim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Sep 2010 13:34:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.meddlingkids.org/?p=1323#comment-1227</guid>
		<description>Science-based Medicine is one of the most respected blogs on the net. Harriet Hall, the author of the piece, is a fantastic writer and legitimate scientist. The "study" which her article references is an exceptionally well put together study which, humorously enough, was actually thrown at me by pro-home birth militants who had clearly not read it. There is nothing inflammatory about it, and the intention of Science-based Medicine is to report medical findings as non-biased as possible.&lt;div&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div&gt;I have not read the article you provided (I just woke up and have a ridiculously busy day ahead of me) but will attempt to find the time this weekend to do so. If the "study" you've linked to (see how I did that? By putting "study" in quotes it makes it look like a joke without my even having read it! Oh, technology!) is a decent, scientific evaluation of legitimate data, I'll happily express that. Also, I think I'll forward it to Dr. Hall and see if she wants to evaluate it for Science-based Medicine as a means to further the topic.&lt;/div&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Science-based Medicine is one of the most respected blogs on the net. Harriet Hall, the author of the piece, is a fantastic writer and legitimate scientist. The &#8220;study&#8221; which her article references is an exceptionally well put together study which, humorously enough, was actually thrown at me by pro-home birth militants who had clearly not read it. There is nothing&nbsp;inflammatory about it, and the intention of Science-based Medicine is to report medical findings as non-biased as possible.
<div></div>
<div>I have not read the article you provided (I just woke up and have a ridiculously busy day ahead of me) but will attempt to find the time this weekend to do so. If the &#8220;study&#8221; you&#8217;ve linked to (see how I did that? By putting &#8220;study&#8221; in quotes it makes it look like a joke without my even having read it! Oh, technology!) is a decent, scientific evaluation of legitimate data, I&#8217;ll happily express that. Also, I think I&#8217;ll forward it to Dr. Hall and see if she wants to evaluate it for Science-based Medicine as a means to further the topic.</div>

<p><a href="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/JHNqGbj8b1HOiB9clukeRlZ9EgE/0/da"><img src="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/JHNqGbj8b1HOiB9clukeRlZ9EgE/0/di" border="0" ismap="true"></img></a><br/>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on An Example Of Not Getting It by bronwyn</title>
		<link>http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/CommentsForMeddlingKids/~3/levzE-PhKtg/</link>
		<dc:creator>bronwyn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Sep 2010 08:30:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.meddlingkids.org/?p=1323#comment-1226</guid>
		<description>Hey all you people out there reading this,Jim, God bless him, passionate as can be, is hopelessly uninformed about this topic.  Please read the following link.  Unlike the biased and inflammatory article ABOUT a "study" which claims that three times as many babies died at home-births, it is an ACTUAL study done by reputable and highly respected colleagues of mine here in Vancouver.  I have personally worked with 2 of the doctors who designed this study (one of whom is among the most reputable and respected OB's in Canada). &lt;a href="http://www.cmaj.ca/cgi/reprint/181/6-7/377" rel="nofollow"&gt;http://www.cmaj.ca/cgi/reprint/181/6-7/377&lt;/a&gt;The full text article is on this page in PDF format; just click on the menu on the right side of the page and enjoy!The Jury is NOT still out.  </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey all you people out there reading this,Jim, God bless him, passionate as can be, is hopelessly uninformed about this topic. &nbsp;Please read the following link. &nbsp;Unlike the biased and&nbsp;inflammatory&nbsp;article ABOUT a &#8220;study&#8221; which claims that three times as many babies died at&nbsp;home-births, it is an ACTUAL study done by reputable and highly respected&nbsp;colleagues of mine&nbsp;here in Vancouver. &nbsp;I have personally worked with 2 of the doctors who designed this study (one of whom is among the most reputable and respected OB&#8217;s in Canada).&nbsp;<a href="http://www.cmaj.ca/cgi/reprint/181/6-7/377" rel="nofollow">http://www.cmaj.ca/cgi/reprint/181/6-7/377</a>The full text article is on this page in PDF format; just click on the menu on the right side of the page and enjoy!The Jury is NOT still out. &nbsp;</p>

<p><a href="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/jtCOHKdMstNvn11xXGXzQBzQvUQ/0/da"><img src="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/jtCOHKdMstNvn11xXGXzQBzQvUQ/0/di" border="0" ismap="true"></img></a><br/>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on An Example Of Not Getting It by Satan</title>
		<link>http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/CommentsForMeddlingKids/~3/rlweD6BbbzY/</link>
		<dc:creator>Satan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Aug 2010 21:13:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.meddlingkids.org/?p=1323#comment-1217</guid>
		<description>Most women these days just want to squat over the dumpster and get it over with, I find. It's a happy medium for everyone except the McDonalds that happens to own the aforementioned dumpster.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Most women these days just want to squat over the dumpster and get it over with, I find. It&#8217;s a happy medium for everyone except the McDonalds that happens to own the aforementioned dumpster.</p>

<p><a href="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/nXcFJ18_Bw6IhYGuBOmUFri6JlQ/0/da"><img src="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/nXcFJ18_Bw6IhYGuBOmUFri6JlQ/0/di" border="0" ismap="true"></img></a><br/>
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	<feedburner:origLink>http://www.meddlingkids.org/2010/08/an-example-of-not-getting-it/comment-page-1/#comment-1217</feedburner:origLink></item>
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		<title>Comment on Salamanders And Algae: Breaking All The Rules by David Hamilton</title>
		<link>http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/CommentsForMeddlingKids/~3/oAccjUTxpJ8/</link>
		<dc:creator>David Hamilton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Aug 2010 21:18:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.meddlingkids.org/?p=1302#comment-1215</guid>
		<description>For people who think the exception proves the rule, I agree, they don't understand the phrase. If you look it up, its a very old latin phrase, and a more accurate translation (which includes its meaning) would be "If I mention an exception, it means that a rule exists". For example, if a restaurant posts "closed on sundays", that means their rule is they are open all the other days. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For people who think the exception proves the rule, I agree, they don&#8217;t understand the phrase. If you look it up, its a very old latin phrase, and a more accurate translation (which includes its meaning) would be &#8220;If I mention an exception, it means that a rule exists&#8221;. For example, if a restaurant posts &#8220;closed on sundays&#8221;, that means their rule is they are open all the other days.</p>

<p><a href="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/dvqPV46yY3zZcVCpylg40VZkdIk/0/da"><img src="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/dvqPV46yY3zZcVCpylg40VZkdIk/0/di" border="0" ismap="true"></img></a><br/>
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		<title>Comment on Things I Can Do That The Faithful Cannot by David Hamilton</title>
		<link>http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/CommentsForMeddlingKids/~3/G7ZiWT_O88Y/</link>
		<dc:creator>David Hamilton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Aug 2010 21:14:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.meddlingkids.org/?p=1328#comment-1214</guid>
		<description>#5 makes me think of The Incredibles.Helen Parr: "Everyone's special Dash."Dash Parr:  "Which is another way of saying no one is."</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#5 makes me think of The Incredibles.Helen Parr: &#8220;Everyone&#8217;s special Dash.&#8221;Dash Parr:&nbsp; &#8220;Which is another way of saying no one is.&#8221;</p>

<p><a href="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/2GajnAXe00fvCccM795p_l3CzRI/0/da"><img src="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/2GajnAXe00fvCccM795p_l3CzRI/0/di" border="0" ismap="true"></img></a><br/>
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		<title>Comment on An Example Of Not Getting It by boyinfidel</title>
		<link>http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/CommentsForMeddlingKids/~3/q-atcTnAndY/</link>
		<dc:creator>boyinfidel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Aug 2010 18:03:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.meddlingkids.org/?p=1323#comment-1213</guid>
		<description>Jim, &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;As you know J and I are about to give birth. We wanted a more comfortable and soothing experience than a hospital birth can provide, and we did consider home birth. Our research led us to the conclusion that a home birth was just too risky. If anything severe was to happen during the labour, a 15 min drive to a hospital is too long for our liking. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;We chose a middle ground: to have our daughter at the birthing centre here in Calgary with the aid of a registered nurse midwife. The location was the deciding factor: it sits within a few blocks of the Foothills Hospital, and the ambulance in even closer. The centre is  fully equipped with all the standard birthing equipment you'd find at the hospital, and they're able to handle most of the risky businesses that comes with childbirth. If something goes horribly awry we can be at the hospital and in an emergency birthing room in 3-5 min.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;One of our requirements was a midwifery that staffed only midwives with previous experience as registered nurses in maternity wards. If we couldn't have found a midwife who was also an experienced nurse we would have certainly chosen a hospital birth. A doula was never an option. As far as i'm concerned putting my baby in the hands of an medically untrained hippie is out of the question. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I have every confidence in our midwife(s) and the birthing centre. These people are a respected part of the medical system in other countries and providing viable alternative to the stark, cold experience of the hospital. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jim, </p>
<p>As you know J and I are about to give birth. We wanted a more comfortable and soothing experience than a hospital birth can provide, and we did consider home birth. Our research led us to the conclusion that a home birth was just too risky. If anything severe was to happen during the labour, a 15 min drive to a hospital is too long for our liking. </p>
<p>We chose a middle ground: to have our daughter at the birthing centre here in Calgary with the aid of a registered nurse midwife. The location was the deciding factor: it sits within a few blocks of the Foothills Hospital, and the ambulance in even closer. The centre is&nbsp; fully equipped with all the standard birthing equipment you&#8217;d find at the hospital, and they&#8217;re able to handle most of the risky businesses that comes with childbirth. If something goes horribly awry we can be at the hospital and in an emergency birthing room in 3-5 min.</p>
<p>One of our requirements was a midwifery that staffed only midwives with previous experience as registered nurses in maternity wards. If we couldn&#8217;t have found a midwife who was also an experienced nurse we would have certainly chosen a hospital birth. A doula was never an option. As far as i&#8217;m concerned putting my baby in the hands of an medically untrained hippie is out of the question. </p>
<p>I have every confidence in our midwife(s) and the birthing centre. These people are a respected part of the medical system in other countries and providing viable alternative to the stark, cold experience of the hospital. </p>
<p></p>

<p><a href="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/jgrrzDLqS9Oropxs4_uO77euEgc/0/da"><img src="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/jgrrzDLqS9Oropxs4_uO77euEgc/0/di" border="0" ismap="true"></img></a><br/>
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		<title>Comment on An Example Of Not Getting It by biguglyjim</title>
		<link>http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/CommentsForMeddlingKids/~3/sWixkchWgGk/</link>
		<dc:creator>biguglyjim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Aug 2010 00:06:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.meddlingkids.org/?p=1323#comment-1208</guid>
		<description>The article is &lt;a href="http://www.theage.com.au/national/toxic-epidural-ravages-mother-20100820-1390i.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;http://www.theage.com.au/national/toxic-epidural-ravages-mother-20100820-1390i.html&lt;/a&gt; and it's about a woman having the wrong chemical injected into her epidural. This is a terrible, tragic accident. Hardly proof that home births are safer than hospital births.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The article is&nbsp;<a href="http://www.theage.com.au/national/toxic-epidural-ravages-mother-20100820-1390i.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.theage.com.au/national/toxic-epidural-ravages-mother-20100820-1390i.html</a>&nbsp;and it&#8217;s about a woman having the wrong chemical injected into her epidural. This is a terrible, tragic accident. Hardly proof that home births are safer than hospital births.</p>

<p><a href="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/XgSRawyVfNBI-N81sXmIwJv4SlU/0/da"><img src="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/XgSRawyVfNBI-N81sXmIwJv4SlU/0/di" border="0" ismap="true"></img></a><br/>
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		<title>Comment on An Example Of Not Getting It by Tammy</title>
		<link>http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/CommentsForMeddlingKids/~3/WtqPsSSwDKg/</link>
		<dc:creator>Tammy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Aug 2010 21:38:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.meddlingkids.org/?p=1323#comment-1207</guid>
		<description>The French tend to do things backwards but this time they did it right. Quebec came up with an idea that is working out well. They allow mid-wife birthing at a "birthing center" with no epidural.The mid wife is not some lady who just takes a mid wife class, it is a Doctor that decides to do natural births. So Science first, granola stuff after.The Birthing Center is associated with a Hospital in that area. It is open 24hrs and you have to have registered through your local hospital to give birth there and your pregnancy would have had to be normal and without complications. They will remove you from the list at any sign of danger and you will be made to go to the standard hospital.You call the center, tell them your on your way. The centre is meant to look like a house. There is a private Family room. With a tv, hottub style bath big enough for mom and dad so dad can catch the baby, 4 poster bed ( ladies like to squat and hold the bed?) and exercise balls.They let you have a few more people than the hospital does. You can have food in the room. They are Doctors that care for you they just respect your choice to not give birth in a hospital environment and TRY it without the epidural. You are hooked up to the same machines and monitored in the same way. Same rules apply with changing your mind about the epidural. There is a point of no return.The hospital is on stand bye.So no its not your home and it's not 100% granola but I think its a safe happy medium. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The French tend to do things backwards but this time they did it right. Quebec came up with an idea that is working out well. They allow mid-wife birthing at a &#8220;birthing center&#8221; with no epidural.The mid wife is not some lady who just takes a mid wife class, it is a Doctor that decides to do natural births. So Science first, granola stuff after.The Birthing Center is associated with a Hospital in that area. It is open 24hrs and you have to have registered through your local hospital to give birth there and your pregnancy would have had to be normal and without complications. They will remove you from the list at any sign of danger and you will be made to go to the standard hospital.You call the center, tell them your on your way. The centre is meant to look like a house. There is a private Family room. With a tv, hottub style bath big enough for mom and dad so dad can catch the baby, 4 poster bed ( ladies like to squat and hold the bed?) and exercise balls.They let you have a few more people than the hospital does. You can have food in the room.&nbsp;They are Doctors that care for you they just respect your choice to not give birth in a hospital environment and TRY it without the epidural. You are hooked up to the same machines and monitored in the same way. Same rules apply with changing your mind about the epidural. There is a point of no return.The hospital is on stand bye.So no its not your home and it&#8217;s not 100% granola but I think its a safe happy medium.</p>

<p><a href="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/Ma1w4nFP-ESoT5PW61I09WqLQBY/0/da"><img src="http://feedads.g.doubleclick.net/~a/Ma1w4nFP-ESoT5PW61I09WqLQBY/0/di" border="0" ismap="true"></img></a><br/>
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		<title>Comment on An Example Of Not Getting It by biguglyjim</title>
		<link>http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/CommentsForMeddlingKids/~3/Ww8_o38Gny0/</link>
		<dc:creator>biguglyjim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Aug 2010 21:31:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.meddlingkids.org/?p=1323#comment-1206</guid>
		<description>I love the idea of a home birth. If you read the web sites of their proponents, it's a natural, wonderful experience with less intervention and less infection. But there is clearly another side to that, and one that is quite terrible.

If I was the boss of the world, we'd have birthing centers in hospitals that were a lot more comfortable and more took into account the desires of women to have a "natural" experience, while still being moments away from medical treatment should the need present itself. It's called the Best Of Both Worlds, and it's a good way to compromise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love the idea of a home birth. If you read the web sites of their proponents, it&#8217;s a natural, wonderful experience with less intervention and less infection. But there is clearly another side to that, and one that is quite terrible.</p>
<p>If I was the boss of the world, we&#8217;d have birthing centers in hospitals that were a lot more comfortable and more took into account the desires of women to have a &#8220;natural&#8221; experience, while still being moments away from medical treatment should the need present itself. It&#8217;s called the Best Of Both Worlds, and it&#8217;s a good way to compromise.</p>

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