CHRIS:: Hello Ray and welcome back to Herp Daily, we just wanted to give the community an update on the first Gecko store in the world. The last time we spoke you were in the preliminary stages of developing the store. A few months have passed since then and we are all definitely interested on the progress of the store itself. Can you give us a little detail about the current stage that the store is in?

RAY: Hi, and thanks again for your interest in our new gecko store venture.  The store is now finally set up and operating for business.  We have all permits and licenses in place, the store is stocked with gecko-related supplies, terrariums, etc., and we now have several racks in place that are functioning and full of wonderful little lizards!  We have limited hours of operation due to our extremely busy schedules, but if business warrants, we will be increasing our hours of operation. We are also open by appointment on an as requested basis.

CHRIS: How has the community around the store and in your area of operations reacted to the arrival of the store?

RAY:  The store is located very close to Boulder and Longmont, CO, in a very quaint and friendly little town known as Hygiene.  It is a very traditional, old-fashioned kind of place, with country stores, a diner, a fire hall, post office, and some other small businesses….kind of like Mayberry!  (It is a very safe and well-protected town, so if you visit the area, don’t speed, or you just may get pulled over by Andy or Barney Fife!)  Our store has gotten a huge amount of press in several Colorado newspapers, and the story has been syndicated so it has gone in various papers around the country which is great for our store, and for leopard geckos in general.  Needless to say, we are the talk of the town and the main topic at the local diner….our goal is to get them all talking about gecko morphs.  Imagine the folks sitting around having their morning breakfast and talking about Enigmas and Sunglows!

CHRIS: Can you give us a little bit more detail about the structure and design of the store itself? ( the pictures that you sent will be included here: ) ).

RAY:  This is not a traditional store by any means.  When you walk in, it has a very relaxing appearance, with plants, a comfy leather couch, coffee table, desk setup, etc.  To one side we have a staging and work area, photo setup, examination lighting, and storage.  The back of the store is the production area, with racks, work carts, shelf racks for supplies and equipment, incubators, and lotsa geckos!  We also have a nice rest room, a fridge and feeder area, and a back store room for shipping supplies.  So it is a small store, but very functional and well laid out.  Outside the store is spectacular scenery, lakes, trails, horses, and more.  Our building is currently being landscaped, including a beautiful, peaceful, rock waterfall.  All in all, it’s a very nice office space and a great place to have a gecko store.

CHRIS: When will your store be officially open to the public? Do you plan on keeping the store open late considering the fact that Leopard Geckos are more active at night?

RAY:  The store does have regular hours, albeit limited at this time until we see how the business goes.  Carol and I work regular day jobs as well, so we’re quite busy, and balancing all this is a challenge.  We want it to be successful, but we also want to be sure we have fun and enjoy what we are doing.  So far we are juggling it all well and we are having a lot of fun, and enjoyable times with our customers talking about all things gecko.  As for geckos being nocturnal, they are fine being bothered and picked up during daylight hours.  Once out they do quite well and seem to enjoy the day.  I have some that I take in the car, take to my day job, walk on my road with, etc.  They like the daylight times actually.  The albino geckos however are light-sensitive, so I am careful in not exposing them to bright sunlight, waiting till evening hours to take them outside for a walk when the weather permits.

CHRIS: What are some of the challenges you have faced since moving forward with the stores creation?

RAY:  Well, for those who have not owned a store business, it is a HUGE amount of work setting things up.  Planning boards, regulations, permits, licenses, insurances, accountants, etc. all requires an immense amount of time and effort, and it all must be done properly.  Then you need to set up your various vendors, distributors, utilities, leases, and logistics.  This is something that requires intense organizational capabilities.  Luckily we have a great group that has worked with us to make it a manageable process, but it is not for someone who doesn’t have the background or time to take on an endeavor  like a business and a store.  It is very much more complex and difficult than an online store you can do from home.

CHRIS: Now that you are more involved in the stores development, have you delegated some of the reptile husbandry to other people or are you still just as involved with the animals themselves?

RAY:  We do have wonderful people working with us.  My wife Carol, and I of course carry the brunt of the work on our shoulders, but we have a highly skilled and fantastic person helping us who is a certified vet tech.  We couldn’t have done this without Lynne’s help!  We also have Brittney Gougeon from Reptile Creative taking care of the complexities of our website, and we’ve had incredible support from Exo Terra, Central Pet (Zoo Med and Zilla), Rep Cal, Fedex, and our great feeder vendors who keep our geckos fed and healthy. We also have had immense help from our gecko advisors who have been just amazing in helping us work through this process and have provided us with excellent animals…folks like Ron Tremper, Garrick DeMeyer, Jeff Galewood, and Steve Sykes, among others.  They have been truly amazing and we couldn’t have pulled all this off without their help and expertise, so my hat goes off to them.

CHRIS: What are your plans for the store for the next 3 months? 6 months? 1 year?

RAY:  Hmmm, let’s see.  One thing I’ve learned in life, especially in these very challenging economic times, is to take things a day at a time and put forth your very best effort possible.  We have already been approached twice about franchising Designer Geckos stores around the US.  We prefer to move very slowly at this time, but we are flattered that a few think we might be onto something.  Let’s face it though, the failure rate for new small businesses is extremely high, and while we are keeping a positive attitude and an optimistic outlook on things, the reality is that we are up against quite a challenge these days.  We have been able to set up this business without financing, so the monetary pressures on us are minimal.  Building up a customer base locally, and elsewhere, will take time.  Our goal is to provide high quality, socialized geckos at reasonable prices, and to provide the very best customer service we can.  We get many repeat customers, so I think people appreciate us and like the way we conduct our business.  We also refer customers  to other gecko breeders if they are looking for something specific that we do not carry ourselves.  The gecko business is very much like a family, where everyone knows everyone and we try to help each other out.  So, we’re setting the groundwork now, and when the economy turns around, as it always does, I’m confident that the gecko business in general will do well.  The Hawaiian people believe that geckos bring good luck, and nowadays we all need all the luck we can get!  We’d like to place a gecko in every household….and who knows…maybe have a few Designer Geckos franchise stores popping up in towns near you someday.  Hey, you just never know.

Thank you Ray for giving us an update on your store. Having a gecko in every household would surely be an amazing feat and would not be possible without your efforts. We wish you the very best and look forward to the events that unfold for the first gecko store in the world!

Please continue to support Ray and Designer Geckos. If you would like to know more about them please visit www.designergeckos.com

CHRIS: To start off, can you tell us a little bit about your background in the hobby? How did you get involved in the reptile businesses? What prompted you to transform from normal hobbyist into the celebrity breeder you are today?

JUSTIN: I never considered it as a career until my sophomore year of college. Even then, it just seemed like a pipe dream! I was keeping a couple carpet pythons and my first King snakes, in my dorm room… hiding them from the dean and RA’s. That worked for about a year, but eventually the school caught me. They were really cool and gave me an entire room of their Biology department to keep my growing collection! Shortly after that I started have success in producing my first clutches of colubrids and Ball Pythons. Everyone who knew me back then will tell you that all I ever talked about was being a professional reptile breeder someday.

Super Pastel Het Pied

CHRIS: Was it your childhood dream to do what you are doing today?

JUSTIN: Oh not really, I had no idea such an opportunity existed!

CHRIS: On your website you mention that you are a director of marketing for a medical group, Are you a full time breeder that works part-time as a marketing director or is it the other way around? How do you manage both lives all while having a family at the same time?

JUSTIN: That’s one part of my website that needs to be updated… I actually resigned my position as marketing director in Nov. 2009 to focus full time on J. Kobylka Reptiles. Now I do a very limited amount of freelance work for several companies.

But I did juggle it for years – full time job, family and growing reptile business. It was a challenge, but not something I minded. The snakes have never felt like work and it was very relaxing to clean cages at the end of the day! I had to quit the day job when I felt that there was no way I could continue to offer my JKR customers world-class service.

CHRIS: Does your job as a Marketing director help you with your job as a reptile breeder? If so, how?

JUSTIN: Absolutely. The techniques were different than what I use with JKR, but it reinforced the need for good marketing as well as giving experience in creating materials, taking good pictures, etc.

Dream

CHRIS: What advice would you give to a struggling breeder having difficulty marketing his/her quality animals?

JUSTIN: A reptile breeder is an entrepreneur and small business owner; although the product is very unusual, the same marketing rules apply. Your customers have to know who you are, that your business is trustworthy and that your snakes are of the highest quality.

You can choose to run your business locally or worldwide via the Internet. If you’re focusing on local shows, you need a quality booth, good business cards, etc. Everything from how you dress to how your snakes are displayed is crucial to making your customer feel that investment in your animals is a good choice. Many breeders make incredible animals, but don’t package or present them well.

If you want to ship your reptiles to customers throughout US or internationally, you are now have an Internet-based business and need a top-notch website. Since you’re removed from your potential clients, pictures that look as good as your animals are a must. “Looks better in person” just doesn’t cut it any more!

CHRIS: For your own business, do you have a marketing plan laid out on paper or do you just go with the flow?

JUSTIN: I go with the flow. Always looking for new ideas or rejecting ideas that just don’t work. As soon as you’ve found something that works, you need to be looking for another way to connect with new customers, breeders and hobbyists.

Personally, I like email… but I try to connect with people wherever they are, such as YouTube, Facebook, Twitter, forums and text messaging. These sites are not about marketing to me, it’s about a relationship and interaction. That is why I’ve started my Pro Tips video series on YouTube. I would have loved to have had some of these tips when I was first starting out. Hopefully other hobbyists can use this information and when they are looking to purchase a new animal, I won’t be too far from their mind.

Pastel Pied

CHRIS: What kind of tips can you give our readers about marketing themselves online? How about marketing themselves in real life?

JUSTIN: Forums is a great place to start. Most people hang out on forums and other online places while they are learning and building their collections. Like I said before, forums are not about marketing, but they are a crucial place to show other hobbyists that you are a sane, normal person who is interested in furthering knowledge within the hobby. If you are selling a snake later on, there is a relationship of trust already established there and hundreds, if not thousands of people who will attest that you seem like a “good guy”.

The same thing goes for face-to-face encounters. I remember early on when I first met several of the “big boys” of the industry. What was amazing to me, was that some of them acted dismissive and even unfriendly until you got to know them better. That was fine back then, but as more and more people are working with these sought-after animals, those who are helpful, friendly and have excellent customer service are catching up quickly.

CHRIS: What are your future plans for Jkobylka Reptiles?

JUSTIN: I’m not looking to be the biggest out there. For me it’s all about quality and creating new combos with these awesome Ball Pythons. I’ve been fortunate that a lot of hard work has paid off with some amazing snakes hatching here. Hopefully in the next few years I can branch out into a couple other species that interest me personally. I’ve always wanted to give geckos a go, but I want to do it right, so I’ve tried to be patient.

FireFly

CHRIS: How big is your ball python collection? Do you keep any other types of animals?

JUSTIN: Smaller than you think! I like to think I’m the smallest, well-recognized breeder, that’s a good spot for me. I’m focusing on quality, cleanliness and techniques to ensure solid production. I have a growing number of blood pythons and I’m loving them too.

Thank you very much Mr. Kobylka for sharing your useful knowledge with us today. We are very big fans of your Youtube channel, beautifully designed website, and of course, your amazing animals!

If you would like to know more about Justin Kobylka please visit his website at

www.jkobylkareptiles.com and check out his Youtube channel: Jkobylka

CHRIS: Hello Mr.DeMeyer, we would like to start the 2nd portion of this series with the question: where do you see the Leopard and Crested Gecko industries in the next 5 years?
GARRICK:The leopard gecko market has seen some huge changes over the past few years. There have been so many new morphs introduced- raptors, diablos, embers, enigmas, snows, and all of the crosses. There were a lot of people that jumped into the market when these morphs became available. Many of these breeders found out the hard way just how quickly the prices of most leopard gecko morphs can drop- especially dominant and co-dominant morphs. Leopards just have such a short generation time. A breeder can turn a single individual dominant morph into hundreds, or even thousands of them in just a couple years. However, the demand for leopard geckos is as high now as it has been in years, at least for the lower-end geckos. They are just such a great introductory species. I feel they are one of the key reptiles to help bring in new hobbyists, which keeps our industry thriving. I see some breeders getting out of leopard geckos for the same reasons as the ball pythons.: lots of competition and overall pricing being lower than what they expected. Those that stick with it should see prices stabilize a bit, although at a lower level for most morphs.
The crested gecko marking is doing well, too. There are a lot of breeders working with them now, compared to 1998 when I got my first geckos. There are so many color and pattern morphs being developed. I just set up another dozen breeding groups of them yesterday. I couldn’t believe the colors of some of the geckos I was putting into groups. They are like nothing I’ve ever seen before! Brilliant reds, oranges, creamsickles, extremely harlequins, and pinstripes. The next 5 years will bring even more incredible morphs. Prices for more common types will stay pretty low, probably around where they are now. The top-notch individuals will always command a high price, though.

CHRIS: For aspiring Crested Gecko, and Leopard Gecko breeders all over the world on a tight budget: what 4 animal morphs would you suggest a person start with and why?
GARRICK: Crested Geckos are very polymorphic, so I don’t think I have any specific individual morphs I recommend. I would get a group of babies of nicer, mixed colors and patterns including reds, oranges, yellows, fires, harlequins, pinstripes, etc. Raise those up, keep all the females as well as a male to go with every 3 females. Use those as your breeders. Purchasing ready to breed young adults is the quickest way to start breeding, but it is a lot more expensive than buying a group of babies.
There are so many leopard gecko morphs, many of which are excellent sellers. I don’t know if I could give you just 4. The strategy I would take is to set up at least 4 breeding groups, each of a different morph. That way, you can offer a variety of physical appearances. As pretty as solid yellow geckos are, you don’t want to produce a hundred of those and nothing else. Variety is key.
CHRIS: What are your favorite Crested and Leopard gecko morphs?
GARRICK: For crested geckos, it’s a difficult decision, because each individual, even within a particular morph, can be so variable. I think a really bright red flame with bold pin-striping is probably the most attractive to me. My answer about a favorite leopard gecko morph will probably surprise you, I know there are a lot of incredible morphs out there, but a really bright high yellow with bold black spotting is probably my favorite. After all, that’s how the species got their common name. Most geckos nowadays don’t look too “leopard-like”. I love animals with bright colors and bold contrast.
CHRIS: Do you plan on breeding any new and groundbreaking morphs for any of the species you work with in 2010 and if so, do you mind sharing with us? ☺
GARRICK: For crested geckos, we’ll mostly be trying to produce more extreme versions of what we already have- super red Harlys and pinstripes, brilliant yellows, oranges, etc. We do have a few cool leopard gecko morphs in the works. Super Snow Diablo Blancos, Super Snow Bell Enigmas, Sunglow Raptors, and the brightest, most extreme Sunglows and carrot tails we’ve ever produced!
CHRIS: What kind of advice would you give to a young hobbyist who aspires to become a successful Leopard and Crested gecko breeder?

GARRICK: The first thing is to start out with healthy stock. Go for quality over pricing, especially when you are getting future breeding stock. That also goes for equipment. High-quality rack systems and thermostats are very important. Make sure to have enough housing for your breeders as well as your expected offspring. Have all the baby racks and cages ready when the babies start to hatch. I recommend starting with several different color morphs so you have a good variety to offer customers. You don’t generally want to produce a huge number of one particular type, because your customers’ tastes will vary. If you are only going to produce a small number of high-quality geckos, make sure to raise them up to a sub-adult or young adult size. Those fetch a much higher price than selling them as babies.
CHRIS: What makes the Leopard Gecko community different from other reptile communities? What about the Crested Gecko community??
GARRICK: There are certainly differences in each reptile species communities. Honestly, I am so busy every day- answering emails, phone calls, packing shipments, collecting eggs, cleaning cages, etc., etc., etc., that I really don’t get too involved in online forums. I like to occasionally post photos of new and exciting animals I’m producing, but I don’t get too involved in the day-to-day activity of forums. There just aren’t enough hours in the day to do everything and still have a family and personal life. I think forums, if used properly, are an excellent way to give/find advice, especially for more novice hobbyists. One thing I really get tired of seeing is the “market is crashing” type of posts. It happens in every community, but I see it the most in leopard geckos and ball pythons. Some people that really don’t understand how the market works like to predict the end of the market and the crash of prices. Leopard geckos in particular have had a large market for many years now, having up years and down years. It’ll continue to do so. Overall, I think both the leopard gecko community and the crested gecko community is mainly comprised of some great individuals, with a lot of expertise and love for the species they work with. I see a lot of dedication out there!

CHRIS: What do you think is the minimum capital investment ( in US$) to start a successful leopard gecko breeding business? Crested Gecko breeding business?
GARRICK: That is a really tough question. It really depends on the scale the breeder wants to achieve. If the goal is to produce a small number of high quality geckos, they may only need a couple racks and only a handful of geckos to start out with. I think a couple thousand dollars may cover a couple racks, thermostat and a small group of nicer geckos. Keep in mind that there are other costs in addition to the initial setup costs- mealworms, supplements, electricity, etc. If a breeder wants to produce large numbers of geckos for the pet trade, mostly being wholesaled, he or she will have to have multiple rack systems and may have to purchase 100 or more geckos to raise up for breeders. That kind of setup would require several thousand dollars at the very least. It would also take an entire room or more to fit an operation of that size in. Our gecko room houses about 500 adult breeder leopards, 300 breeder crested geckos, and at least 1500 babies and juveniles at any given time. It is just under 1000 square feet and probably has around 40 rack systems in it. It is a full time job to maintain that room. Between all the expenses including employee costs, I spend about $100,000 per year operating the gecko part of our business. Of course, I didn’t just start out that big overnight. I spent years building up the collection to that size. The best advice I can give is to start out small, get the experience, and grow gradually. You have to grow into being able to handle a large collection. I see some hobbyists get too big, too fast, and either go broke or burn out trying to keep up. Good planning, both short-term and long-term, is mandatory to running a successful breeding business.
We would again like to thank Mr. DeMeyer for his valuable insight, this time concerning  Leopard Geckos and  Crested Geckos. If you would like to know more about Garrick DeMeyer please visit his respective websites at:

www.crestedgecko.com
www.royalconstrictordesigns.com

His amazing videos can be found on YouTube channel name: thecrestedgecko

CHRIS: Hello Mr. DeMeyer and thank you for giving us the opportunity to learn more about you and your business. Can you start off by giving us a little bit of a background about yourself:  when and how did you get involved with the reptile industry?

GARRICK:  I have been interested in reptiles and amphibians my entire life.  As a child, I spent most of my Summers in the swamps and forests, finding and catching almost anything I could.  This was back in the 70s and 80s.  Here in WI, there really weren’t stores that sold reptiles, other than anoles.  I had to get my herp fix from the wild.  I did get a group of green anoles when I w as about 6.  From then until I graduated high school, I probably kept over 75 species of herps- mostly lizards.  My dad would buy me a couple exotic lizards like flying geckos, tokay geckos, red-headed agamas, etc.  Really helped fuel the fire for me when I was a kid.  Snakes weren’t allowed in the house, though.  I finally talked my parents into letting me get a ball python when I was a sophomore in college.  Lots of snakes came along once I got the first one in the house.  When I went to college at UW-Stevens Point, I didn’t know what I wanted to get a degree in.  I loved herps, but I didn’t think there were any good career choices for me.  In ‘93,  I went on a 3 week school trip with UWSP’s  Natural Resources department to Costa Rica.  During that time, I realized that I absolutely had to have a career working with reptiles.  I started working towards a Biology Degree.  I also got a pair of Giant Day Geckos and started to breed them.  Leopard Geckos came soon after.  The next year, I got a part-time job at a pet store in Wausau, WI.  It was only a 40 minute drive from school, so I’d work there on the weekends and one night a week during the school year, and full-time in Summer.  Working there showed me there was a market for high-quality, captive-bred herps.  I started acquiring a lot of different species.  I can’t even remember all the different projects I worked on- countless gecko species, chameleons, frilled lizards, bearded dragons, etc.  It took me years to figure out which ones to work with- species I had a talent for, were consistent-producers, and were marketable.  I did two Christmas break internships- one at the Sedwick County Zoo in Wichita, KS, and the other at the Houston Zoo.  Those experiences were incredible.  I learned how the pros managed large collections.  I also got to work with species I never thought I’d even see including Fiji Island Iguanas!  I graduated in ‘96 with a degree in biology.  I also took several computer courses and small- business management.  I knew there would be a lot more to running a successful reptile-breeding business than knowing how to breed reptiles!  I kept working at the pet store full-time until 2000.  I bascially worked on my animals all morning, then worked at the store all afternoon and evening.  I had a pretty tight schedule and not a lot of free time.  I hoped that wouldn’t last forever.  It took a lot longer than I thought, but once I figured out what species to work with and how to market thing, things progressed very quickly.  In 2003, I had pretty well filled up my house with reptiles and needed to expand.  My wife Sheila and I purchased a house outside of Wausau, WI and had a facility built for us.  At this point, my brother-in-law, Adam Eberle, became a partner.  He does a lot with the website, uploading our video clips, sending out our newsletters, making sure things are running as smoothly as possible, and manages our finances.   I also have help with the animals now.   Art Turnquist manages the gecko collection and Kyle King manages our rodent colony and does a lot of the snake work.  It is so nice to not have to do everything all by myself.  The business just got too big for me to be completely hands on with everything.  Of course, this only works if you have someone helping that really knows what they are doing!  It’s hard to find that special person who will do the kind of work that needs to be done here.

An Amazing Male 2009 Killer Clown

CHRIS: How has the industry changed over the years?

GARRICK:  When I really started getting into this, the internet was just starting to be used.   I’d go online and search for reptile sites and pretty much just find pricelists.   Nowadays, there is so much information out there.  Care info, genetics info, videos, photos, etc.  Nobody ever took individual photos of animals they had for sale- at least not back in the early to mid 90s.  Now, I take photos of over 1000 individual animals a year.  It’s crazy how much time I have to spend doing that.  No matter how many photos I take, some customers want additional photos, photos using a different background, photos with something in it for size-comparison, etc.  I even have people requesting videos of each animal now.  All of that can take up so much of my time that it keeps me away from doing the part of this business that I love the most- working with the animals.

CHRIS:  Where do you see the Ball Python industry in 5 years?

GARRICK:  The Ball Python industry has had, and will have its ups and downs, but it is very healthy in my opinion. Most ball python morphs have really dropped in price over the past few years.  I paid almost $18,000 for my first male spider and I now sell them for $200.  That is hard to swallow when you really think about it, but I’m still really glad I did it.  I’ve produced probably 200 animals from that project over the years.  It’s just a case of supply and demand.   Many ball morphs are very easy to reproduce, notably the dominant and co-dominant morphs.  It is very easy to take one or two and turn them into dozens in just a few years.   There are very few morphs now that command the same kind of money that most morphs did 5-7 years ago.  However, even at lower prices, say an average of $200-500 each, they are still very profitable.  A breeder just can’t make a living off of a rack or two of breeders anymore.  I geared my entire ball python strategy towards producing a large number of the most popular morphs, and smaller numbers of as many others as I could.  The nice thing about most of these morphs being lower-priced now is they are affordable to so many more people.   I’m glad that customers can afford many of the morphs they could only dream about a few years ago.  I see the ball python industry as being very healthy in the future.  Some breeders will probably get out of them, because they can’t get the kind of money they could in the past, and it may not be worth it to them anymore.  For me personally, I absolutely love ball pythons.  Every day during the hatching season is like Christmas to me, when I can see what pops out of the incubator.  I think ball pythons are still very  profitable at a few hundred dollars each (less for some, more for others) and the demand for them is definitely there.   We sell out every  year.

Spinner Blast 2009

CHRIS: For aspiring Ball Python breeders all over the world on a tight budget: what 4 animal morphs would you suggest a person start with and why?

GARRICK:  I always recommend aspiring breeders to work with what they like the best.  You want to be happy with the work you are doing, so why not produce the morphs you like?  Chances are, if you like a particular morph, so do a lot of other people.  For ball pythons,  I think the morphs that always draw people are bumblebees, piebalds, and albinos.  Those are the clear-cut top three that almost everyone likes.  I guess if I had to pick a fourth, I’d probably go with blue-eye leucistics, but those seem to be a little polarizing.  Most people love them, but a few people get creeped-out by them for some reason.  There are so many ball morphs out there, that it is really hard to narrow it down.  There are many ways to start breeding ball morphs on a budget.  If you have more time than money, like I did when I was starting, you can get het recessive males, breed them to normal females, hold back the female offspring (50% possible hets) and breed them back to a het male.  Back when I started, het males for most morphs were about $1000 each, so even that way wasn’t too cheap.  I did produce my first caramel albinos and axanthics that way, though.  For dominant or co-dominant morphs, the best strategy is to get a large group of captive born normals, raise them up for a year.  Then, buy some males (spiders, mojaves, lessers, pastels, etc.) to breed with them.  Males mature a year faster than females, so they’ll all be ready to breed at about the same time.  Once you produce babies, start holding back as many of the babies as you can afford to, and start crossing morphs to create new ones (leucistics, bumblebees, pastaves, etc.).

CHRIS: What is your favorite Ball Python morph and why?

GARRICK:  All of these questions are really hard to answer, because I can’t pick just one!  I guess if I had to pick a ball morph, I’d say the bumblebee.  A bright, vibrant, super clean bumblebee can hold its own against pretty much any other morph, as far as I’m concerned.

CHRIS: Who have been your major influences in the industry?

GARRICK:  There’s been a lot of people that have given me a lot of advice over the years.  I got to visit Ron Tremper in1997.  I saw my first large-scale gecko operation then.  I modeled a lot of what I do after his setup and techniques.  Dave and Tracy Barker welcomed me to tour their facility in 1997 as well.  That was really eye-opening for me.  Their facility is really top-notch.  It gave me a lot of ideas about my own future facility.  I also saw a lot of ball morphs in person for the first time- clowns, albinos and piebalds were extremely rare back then!  Ty Park was also very influential for me.  I worked at his reptile wholesale business for awhile in 1998.  It was located in Chicago at the time.  I only worked there for a few months, because the job was so demanding that I would have had to give up my dreams of running my own reptile breeding business if I were to stay there.  There just wasn’t enough hours in the day for both.  I learned a lot about how to set up a large operation, manage various breeding colonies, and fill orders, send out shipments, etc.  That experience was critical for getting me to where I am now.

CHRIS: What kind of advice would you give to a young hobbyist who aspires to become a successful breeder?

GARRICK:  Keep what you like and like what you keep.  Don’t get into a species for the money.  Work with species you enjoy.  Ideally, we are all doing this because we love it.  Do a lot of research on a species before investing in it.  Buy top-notch caging and equipment, instead of trying to save money by purchasing inferior products.  You’ll regret it later and end up buying the higher-quality products anyway.  Caging, thermostats, temp-guns, and other supplies are a big expense and need to be considered when setting up a breeding project.  Another important thing to remember is to have a lot of patience.  I see many breeders invest in a collection, then they decide they don’t have the patience to see a project through. In terms of snake breeding, most snakes take several years. That can seem like a really long time to wait.  Another piece of advice is to have patience when it comes to selling reptiles.  Most of them don’t sell overnight.  Some of our nicer balls can stay here for up to a year before they sell.  I’m not going to slash the prices on them just to move them out quick, only to not have anything available later.  Everything sells eventually.  Keep your prices at a reasonable market level and you’ll come out ahead when you do sell them.  The last thing I want to emphasize is quality.  So many people buy their animals based on price.  Sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn’t.  I know most of my animals, especially my ball pythons, are not the cheapest out there in the market.  They are super-clean, extremely healthy animals, though.

Hypo Mojave

CHRIS: Is there anything you feel that needs to be fixed in the reptile industry whether it be pricing, legislation etc.?

GARRICK:  You can’t really fix pricing.  It is a free-market system.  Supply and demand.  I always knew the prices would drop on a lot of the animals I produce.  Some dropped quicker than I anticipated, but I knew it was coming.  Most species/morphs level off eventually, once the demand and the price finds an equilibrium.  It can fluctuate from time to time as more people get into or get out of a particular type.

The legislation issue has obviously become pretty big over the past 5  years.  I highly recommend everyone to become a member of PIJAC and USARK.  There is strength in numbers.  If the reptile hobby/industry’s voice is loud enough, people will have to listen.  We need to develop responsible reptile ownership and make sure the rest of society sees us that way.  “Reptile people” are stereo-typed to some degree.  We have to show everyone that we are responsible and professional and our industry and hobby is very important to us.  Other people don’t have to understand why we love reptiles, but they do need to accept that we do and we have a right to.

CHRIS: Do you plan on breeding any new and groundbreaking morphs for any of the species you work with in 2010 and if so, do you mind sharing with us?

GARRICK:  I don’t hide anything up here in Wisconsin and I never mind sharing what I have going on here.  I don’t think we have any brand new ball python morphs coming this year, but we will be producing some pretty rare ones, such as caramel albino spiders, pastel lesser calicos, mystic potions, super mystics, crystals, albino pinstripes, and at least a couple dozen others.

Thank you very much for sharing your wisdom with us Mr.DeMeyer. If you would like to know more about Garrick DeMeyer please visit his respective websites at

www.crestedgecko.com
www.royalconstrictordesigns.com

He also has a very informative and entertaining Youtube channel: Thecrestedgecko . I suggest you check it out for more nuggets of wisdom!

For Part 2, Garrick DeMeyer tackles Leopard and Crested Gecko Breeding!

CHRIS: Hi Steffe, we are so glad that you have decided to share your time with you. To get the ball rolling can we ask when you first started attending reptile expos? How did you hear about it? What got you to attend?

STEFFE: I attended my first NARBC show in October of 2009 (Tinley park show) but I have been regularly attending the Wheaton All Animal Expo since January of 2009. Ball-pythons.net has clued me in on the shows in my area. It doesn’t take much to get me to go to these shows, tons of cool animals to look at and to purchase! Plus, large quantities of frozen rats save a lot of money.

CHRIS: Can you describe in the most detail what a reptile expo experience feels like “the first time”

STEFFE: It was kind of overwhelming. I was looking down at the tables the whole time and often forgot to look where I was going. There were so many tables I would be walking around in circles and then find a new aisle of tables I hadn’t even looked at. The amount of great looking animals was amazing!

CHRIS: How does the experience change each time you go to another expo?

STEFFE: NARBC is still very exciting to attend since it only comes around once a year. The local show is just more of an errand to get rats. I always walk around just to check things out but I rarely go looking to buy an animal.
CHRIS: Can you describe the sights ,sounds, smells , and feelings associated with Tinley Show

STEFFE: Lots and lots of people! Lots and lots of beautiful animals! It smells…normal? Not bad or anything, haha. It’s definitely an experience that is hard to describe, especially to people who don’t really like reptiles that much. Its just awesome to turn a corner and see the most beautiful animal you have ever seen only to turn another corner and see an animal you have never even heard of.

CHRIS: How would the last Tinley show compare to the other reptile expos that you have attended?

STEFFE: This past Tinley show was a bit smaller since it was put on very quickly. There wasn’t as many vendors as the October show but they did have the informational summit talks, which I found very interesting. I also got to meet a few people from ball-pythons.net.
CHRIS: How would you recommend a beginner prepare him/herself for an expo? What should he/she bring with him? what kind of research should he/she do beforehand?

STEFFE: A first timer should bring a camera, money, and a good understanding of how to identify a healthy animal and/or a good example of a particular morph. I like to look at the list of breeders online and go to their websites to see what they might be bringing to the show, although they always bring different stuff and more stuff then what they have “available”.

CHRIS: What is your favorite reptile expo memory?

STEFFE: I really can’t pick one! I have so many Maybe meeting some of the awesome breeders.
CHRIS: What other expos do you plan to attend for 2010?

STEFFE: Tinley park in October since it is only 30 minutes away and the local reptile show to get rats

We would like to thank Steffe for her generous contribution to this article. It definitely shed some light into the reptile expo experience. I cannot wait for  my next one!

If you have an interesting Reptile Expo experiences that you would like to share with everyone feel free to contact me at anytime.

Dan Briere

CHRIS: Hello Mr. Briere. We would first like to sincerely thank you so for sharing this time with the public.  To be honest, for a long time, we felt that the only way to make a livelihood in the reptile business was to produce fantastic animals for sale. However you have shown us a different path. What led you to pursue a profession as a wildlife educator?

DAN:  My work background was working in 4 different pet stores in the metro Detroit area along with being involved with local aquarium and herpetological societies.  While working for Jeff Gee, who formerly owned the Tropical Fish Pond in Michigan I decided to start my own aquarium/vivarium maintenance company called The Little Creatures Co. in 1989.  I gained quite a few accounts and for several years stayed quite busy.  I did continue to work for the pet store for several years while I established a good amount of customers.

That same year I was asked by a friend if I could bring in a few reptiles to the local Boy Scout troop and I saw this as an opportunity! I owned a small collection of beginner reptiles and was also able to borrow a few for the day from my old boss Jeff.  I showed up to the Scout meeting, completely nervous and not quite sure what to do but ended up pulling off a really cool animal show ! Everyone thought I gave good information and liked what they saw.

That following evening I spent several hours at my Dad’s kitchen table designing a new business card which stated ‘Exotic Wildlife Programs’ with ‘The Little Creatures Co’. That was just the beginning.

CHRIS: When and how did you know that this work could be transformed into a career?

DAN: After a few years of doing both tank maintenance and the programming I decided to get more aggressive at promoting my wildlife programs and phase out the maintenance service.  Also, I was learning that I had some competitors out there that have been doing the same work for many years and this inspired me ! I figured if I could do exciting and educational programs, stay consistent and reliable and try to offer competitive rates it was a go. I am now into my 21^st year and hope for many more.  It has been a long and interesting road to be on and did hit some bumps along the way.

CHRIS: From your collection, what are some of your favorite animals to work with?

DAN:My 5 ft Green Iguana and Blue Tongue Skink usually stir up a crowd of kids !  Another favorite is our 8 inch Pixie Frog ! Most parents will say, ‘No, that can’t be real??’.  Another favorite to show people is our 4 ft. Alligator named ‘Captain Crunch’.

CHRIS: Was this profession always something you dreamt about as a child? If you weren’t doing this, what would you be doing for a living?

DAN: As a young kid I admired biologists such as Jacques Cousteau, Jane Goodall and Jungle Jack Hanna. In my teen years I wanted to open a pet shop with an educational twist to it.  Something like a pet shop mixed with a mini-zoo atmosphere.

CHRIS: How large is the demand for your services in the Michigan area? Do you ever travel out of state in order to make presentations?

DAN:My work has become full time, and then some ! I work five to six days a week minimum, 12 months a year.  I have traveled out of state a few times but try to stay local to keep the stress of traveling at a minimum for my animals !

CHRIS: Has the public perception about reptiles changed since you first started this business?

DAN: I believe that I have helped to change many negative perceptions of reptiles into those      more positive. Many schools and libraries, child care centers and scout troops have used so many times to teach their kids that they are not surprised when they see reptiles.  Over time they have seen many of the positive aspects of the animal rather than the negative and seem to get used to the whole thing and it is good rather than scary and weird.

CHRIS:  What advice would you give to other hobbyists who dream of following in your footsteps?

DAN: Like my old friend Brian Barczyk says: Follow your passion ! Get involved in the hobby which ever way you can.  Some of us are good at breeding, some of us build cool caging systems, some supply equipment to this hobby, others create beautiful t-shirts and books, whatever your good at, we are all animal lovers, try to find something that you like and can get paid to do !

CHRIS: What are some of the challenges working in this kind of businesses?

DAN: I maintain close to 50 different species and the work can get overwhelming.  Public speaking is always interesting and sometimes difficult if your dealing with giant groups of young children who haven’t learned how to listen to a speaker, sometimes frustrating, sometimes funny !

CHRIS: Have you ever had any accidents while doing a show? How did you resolve them?

DAN: One of my favorites is Sheldon, a 34 year old Leopard Tortoise who frequently defecates during a program, so we create a paper towel diaper for him just before he is shown. We also carry along some cleaning products just in case.

Recently my White’s Tree Frog got a little boy’s leg a little wet and we walked him to a restroom to rinse off his leg.  I can’t admit much more than that right now, on public record. (LOL)

CHRIS: We know that any legislation pitted against reptiles will affect your businesses drastically, what do you suggest individual hobbyists can do to help the industry as a whole?

DAN: Contact elected officials by mail, email and telephone! We need to be involved and fight for what you love and find important. To many of us this is a lifestyle and there are many newcomers climbing on board. We are here to stay and our government needs to work with us and not against us.

I hope that many of you that read this find it informative and positive !

Thank You for this opportunity Chris!

- Dan Briere

We would like to thank Dan for giving us all the insight into the life of a wildlife educator and shedding light into another way hobbyists can build a career out of the animals we all love! To learn more about Dan please visit his new website at http://www.littlecreaturesco.com/

Small Hide by RBI

CHRIS: Hey Rich we would first like to start by thanking you for devoting some of your time to conduct this interview. We here at Herp Daily have heard a lot of great things about your company especially the wonderful racks you create for reptile hobbyists here in the US.  For the benefit of the general public (as well as hobbyists unfamiliar with your company) can give us a background about yourself and how Reptile Basics Inc. came about?

RICH: I have been in pet retail/wholesale since around 1988 or so.  Mostly full line store and fish wholesale on Long Island.  While I had always had an interest in snakes I only started actively keeping them with breeding as a goal around this time.  Started out with a few Kingsnakes and other colubrids.  Went from there.  Of course, once you produce offspring then they have to go someplace so the next obvious step is to sell them.  Kind of snowballs from there, doesn’t it?

Once I decided I had pretty well had enough of LI I decided to move to North Carolina in 1994.  I opened up a retail reptile store in November of ’94 and kept expanding it until I finally sold it in 2004.

CHRIS: I have read that the shift into focusing exclusively on online sales occurred in 2004. What motivated you to make the change? How difficult was it to become established online?

RICH: Honestly, just burned out on the retail experience.  It is a very tough existence and after close to 16 years of it I was done.  I sold the store and used the funds to move into the online scene full time.  I had actually bought and sold online for a few years at that point and wanted to move into that along with more reptile shows.  While it is still mostly retail it would let me expand my interest in different animals and allow me to move into some other product lines.  Both of which I did.  I purchased a CNC router shortly after that and spent the next few months learning CAD/CAM software and hardware.  I have always had a good mechanical ability; I just needed to add a computer to it.  That’s when the racks and cages got started.

Getting established was actually pretty easy.  While not in its infancy the online scene was still reasonably new, sort of a pre-teen age.  Kingsnake.com was really starting to take off as well as other outlets.  Shows began to expand exponentially both in size and number.  While I got in a bit later than would have been ideal it was still a good time.  I would guess it is a bit harder now. Maybe not?

412L IR Thermometer

CHRIS: What separates RBI from other companies that serve the Reptile Industry?

RICH: I have intentionally added products slowly.  Maybe I am wrong or even crazy but it has always seemed to me a sure way to fail quickly is get in deeper than you thought you would and get there faster.  Once you start down hill it is hard to stop.  With the decreased overhead of being online I could afford to build it more slowly and methodically than a retail store where the overhead just constantly eats you alive.  So far it has worked well for me.  There are still many items in the dry good field I simply will not get involved in, just no point to it.   I go where I am strong.

CHRIS: How has the industry changed since the company was re-born in 2004?

RICH: Grown exponentially!  Just the traffic I get is mind boggling.  Most of the same, or similar patterns are still there especially with the animals.  The same price curves are still here, same as with about any discretionary item.  They start high and fall fast.  The Ball Python explosion was one I pretty well missed.  I had handled probably 10,000 of them.  I simply did not see the potential that they had.  Who would have thought the genetics where there?  Well, obviously some did!  I got into them when Albinos were about $1200 or so.  Until you could get some pretty hot looking morphs I really did not care for them all that much.  I have kept it all at one point or another but I have always been more of a colubrid guy at heart.  Now we are seeing a rebirth of many of these really cool animals that were forgotten for a few years.  While it was a bit painful getting back to reality in the reptile world I am glad to see it has come.  There is 1,000 times the variety in animals and morphs available in the hobby now than when I got started.  When I got in an Albino Cal King was a big deal!

CHRIS: What are your top selling products? And why do you feel that those products are in high demand?

RICH: I would say that there are several that run pretty close.  Racks/cages have been a core for awhile but I also go through thermostats and heat tape like there is no tomorrow.  Kind of makes sense- with all of the animals now produced and kept here in the USA we need heating and housing.  Kind of like feeder rodents.  Now that’s what I should have got into 10 years ago.

Iris CB-70 Rack

CHRIS: How do you picture the industry 10 years from now? Do you have any hopes or expectations?

RICH: We are still at the tip of the iceberg on morphs.  Just with the existing BP and Boa morphs out there right now I can not even calculate the number of possible combinations any more.  Seems like how to do that was on the SAT’s but that was a long time ago.  If we can manage to dodge the legislation bullet it will likely grow as much in the next 10 as it has in the last 10.  The number of new hobbyists the BP morphs has brought in is immeasurable and I have seen quite a few of them branch out into other herps once they see what they personally do best with.  Some of us are lizard people, some boa, some python, etc.  Seems like there has been a bit of a rebirth in the Corn and Leopard Gecko fields.  Even most of the “purists” who initially resisted the BP charm have broken down and got into them.  I am one of them J

CHRIS: Out of curiosity, what animals do you have in your collection? Do you have a favorite, if so, why?

RICH: As of this spring I will be pretty much out of the animal end of things for awhile.  No time right now.  I have quite a few new projects I am working on and I started to lose interest, mostly due to too much on my plate.  I will get back into them before long though, a year or two when some of my other ideas come to fruition.  Mean time I have a few Chondros.  Easiest snakes I have ever kept.  Probably my favorite reptile I have owned is my water monitors.  Had a really nice pair and managed to breed and hatch them back when that was still a new idea.  Very, very cool when you find some nice ones.  And now we have morphs of them too!

CHRIS: How has this economy affected your business? Do you foresee a recovery in the near future?

RICH: Actually, not at all.  2009 was substantially better that the year before.  I have seen steady growth since I started on my own in 1994.  It has not always been as good as I might have liked it but always in the right direction.  So far 2010 has been better than 2009.

Something a lot of people do not think about but it makes a fair amount of sense.  When times get tight people may not get the new car, they may not go on vacation, they may not buy a bigger house.  Especially when they are uncertain in their financial position in the coming year.  One thing they will always spend money on is their hobby.  Even if it is just upgrading it slightly or “fixing” what they already have.  I am fortunate, on both sides of the equation, to be involved in a hobby that can actually supplement your income.  There are not that many out there that can do that other than animals.  Pesky critters tend to breed and make more.  Often when we do not even try?   At the very least this hobby can break even.

As far as a recovery- yes.  I think it is already coming.  Business is on the up and if things were still getting worse it would get tighter, even taking the above into account.  It is not a lot of fun for business owners in general to go through a period like this but in the end it makes them a lot stronger.  I have always been pretty conservative with expansion and having some cushion under me but when things get tight we all learn how to do it.  Really, it is the way things should have been all along.  We all got a bit lazy during the peak but there is only one way to go from the top.  We just forget that.

CHRIS: What shows will you be attending for 2010?

RICH: My usual White Plains NY shows and Daytona.  Might go back up to Tinley in October but we will see where I am at as that gets closer.  I have 2 or 3 guys that come here and buy a bunch of hides, thermostats, etc before some of the other shows here on the east coast and they resell.  Between them and myself we hit most of the east coast.  I would like to see the shows thin out a bit over the coming year, especially in the PA/MD/VA area.  Seems like there is a show about every weekend within driving distance around there.  Florida is even worse.  Makes it hard to get good vendors and good customers through the door.  I think the market place will take care of that on its own.  While I have only been to two Tinley shows the NARBC guys seem to have the formula down.  Great job.  Bruce up in White Plains has done a fabulous job of keeping that show really strong.  Bobby and I have been waiting for our “bad” show there for 4 years or so now.  Have not had it yet.  Daytona is, well, Daytona.  Had our best show there ever this past year.  While some vendors were very unhappy, some were extremely happy.  It is still by far the biggest show in town.

Herp Daily would like to thank Rich for the generous information he has shared to all of us here. If you would like to know more about Reptile Basics Inc. or are in the market for a good quality rack for your reptiles, please visit www.reptilebasics.com

As of Feb 26, 2009, Herp Daily officially has a fanpage on Facebook ! Please visit the Facebook link on the right hand side of the website and support our cause by becoming a fan! You will notice that the page does not have any photographs or even a profile picture. The reason for that is I want to showcase 5-7 animals of our readers to best represent the community of this blog. If you are interested at all in showcasing your animals in our Facebook fanpage, please send your favorite pictures to herpdaily@gmail.com for consideration.

CHRIS: Hi Ray, before we get ahead of ourselves can you tell us a little bit about yourself and the history of Designer Geckos?

RAY: Hello, and first off, thanks for taking an interest in our new gecko venture. We are very excited about this and hope the gecko community embraces and supports it. The vast amount of time and effort it takes to run a gecko operation cannot be compensated monetarily…those of us who are involved in raising and selling geckos do it because we love the animals. It is our passion, and we want to spread the word about these amazing little creatures because we know how much joy they have brought to us all on a personal level. With the world as it is today, we all need something that makes us feel good and helps to alleviate our stresses…geckos do just that.

I have been raising reptiles and amphibians since I was five. When I was ten, I had what the Buffalo Museum curator said was the largest and oldest garter snake they had ever heard of. She was a massive 4 foot snake, dark gray in color, and sweet as a snake could be. I had no idea garters could get that big, so despite their assessment, I was somewhat skeptical that she was a garter. Mamba’s identity was confirmed one morning when she had 33 beautiful little striped garter snake babies. I used to walk around my neighborhood with her around my neck. She was a great friend and I miss her to this day. I was hooked on reptiles forever after that wonderful experience with such a magnificent snake.

My interest in animals continued, and I achieved a science degree and also became a certified lab animal technologist. My training and education led me into the direction of biomedical research, which has been my vocation all of my working life. The gecko thing was just a natural progression from there. I have always been fascinated with geckos, and the incredible explosion in leopard gecko morphs was very intriguing to me. I studied the work of Ron Tremper, read book after book, networked with many great folks in the field, and before I knew it, I was hooked on leos!

Carol and I jumped in with all four feet and decided to try to raise some of our own leos. We decided to invest in high quality leos, and began to research into who had the best of the morphs we were into, like the tangerines, sunglows, lavenders, and giants. We started to build a collection of beautiful leos, and thanks to Ron Tremper, Garrick DeMeyer, Jeff Galewood, Jason Haygood, Albey Scholl, and others in the business, we put together what we felt was a pretty impressive collection. It just seemed like the right thing to do for us to share the offspring of these beautiful animals with others, and thus, Designer Geckos was formed. Brittney Gougeon of Reptile Creative worked hard with us to put together a respectable website, and things just kind of took off from there.

CHRIS: How important is it to have a wife that not only tolerates this passion of ours but also embraces it fully?

RAY: Great question. I am always amazed at how tolerant Carol is of all this! I think the reason she never complains about me spending many hundreds of dollars on a gecko, or wanting to fly off somewhere for a reptile show, is because she is as into as I am. She loves leopard geckos, and has the same zeal as I do for the hobby. I see it in her eyes when she’s holding a gecko and softly talking to it like mothers do. She has great compassion and love for all animals. When it came to expanding to a store, many wives might have drawn the line. Instead, Carol drew a map….to our new store. We discuss all decisions on the business, and we have a great synergy and balance. We always said that we’d do well if we ever worked together on a business, so maybe this is the one!

CHRIS: How do your and Carol’s roles differ in terms of running the company?

RAY: While I have a lot of animal background, Carol complements that with a tremendous amount of experience in sales, marketing, and customer service. She knows how to market a business, how to provide great customer service, and she also has that intuitive ability to know what works, what doesn’t, and what turns to take at the right times. My role is more in the organizational and financial aspects, the legalities that come with running a business, and the hands on animal care functions. I select the leos we will buy, then bounce my decisions off Carol before we pull the trigger. We almost always agree on our gecko choices, so it all flows very easily for us.

Jason - Tangerine (SHTCTB) (Male)

CHRIS: I noticed that you have a unique and admirable policy towards police officers, firefighters, veterans, and people in the military, what prompted you to conduct this policy?

RAY: Carol and I are very patriotic people, and we deeply appreciate the sacrifice of those who preserve and protect us 24/7. We offer a discount to those folks to show our appreciation for what they do, day in and day out. So it’s just our way to say thank you to them for putting their lives on the line for the rest of us, and to show them how much their service means to us. I recently spoke to someone I knew who was just called up to serve in Afghanistan. He loves our geckos but couldn’t get one because he knew he’d be leaving. I told him when he left, that when he returned we were going to give him a top notch gecko as a gift. He gave me a bear hug that almost broke my ribs….but that’s how much this all means to us. They are all our heroes, and we want them to know that.

CHRIS: Do you keep any other pets? If so, what is it about Leopard Gecko’s that has got you so focused on them?

RAY: Living in the foothills of Colorado, we are surrounded by animals of all kinds. Snakes, lizards, dogs, cats, horses, bears, lions, bobcats, you name it, we’ve got em! Carol and I have two beautiful Paint horses, mother and daughter. They are awesome animals and we have great times with them. The leopard geckos are amazing reptiles in so many ways. They are gorgeous creatures, simple and yet complex, very intelligent, love people, enjoy television (especially sports and American Idol!), and each one has such an incredibly unique and wonderful little personality. We love all the different morphs, and we’re greatly intrigued by the genetic complexities. We have a great appreciation for their purity and child-like innocence. They are uncorrupted by the woes of society, politics, economy, and all the ills us humans need to deal with. They show pure unconditional love, and they bond to us humans in a very special, wonderful way. The more time you spend with them, the more you realize how truly amazing leos really are.

Sunrise- Tremper Albino Sunglow (Male)

CHRIS: Okay, now let’s jump into the main focus of this article, can you tell us what spurred the idea of a store catering exclusively to geckos?

RAY: We were running out of room and we had many breeding projects we wanted to work on. In addition to our own animals, we also carefully select premium leos from other breeders as juveniles, raise them up, and sell them as mature, socialized geckos. So, we needed room. We thought of office space in Boulder and Longmont, Colorado, but we were really lucky to have found a building available close to our home in Hygiene. It is an awesome all brick building, well-insulated and sound proofed, with central heating and air conditioning. So the fit was perfect for what we needed and we went for it. While there are stores that have a few geckos, there were none that had the amazing morphs that we loved, and none that knew how to properly care for geckos. We saw a real need in the community for a store that had expertise in geckos, and one that was interested in the education and humane care aspects that we were so adamant about.

CHRIS: What vision do you have for the store?

RAY: The store is really an ideal layout for a gecko operation. It has a great office area, which we are in the process of setting up as a boutique theme, with a couch, coffee table, TV, fridge stocked with cold drinks, a nice desk set up, and all in all, just a really homey, comfortable atmosphere. We want folks to be able to relax and talk about leos, and feel like they are in their living room talking to friends. As I said, this is not about money, this is about having fun, appreciating leos, and sharing our passion. The store also has a nice staging area, where we have set up incubators, a picture studio setup, shipping area, and an examining area for health monitoring. In addition, it has a great production room that can hold several racks, a store room, rest room, and beautiful mountain scenery right outside the door. It really is a perfect facility for a small gecko operation. Behind it is a large building that we may consider using down the road for gecko shows, seminars, conventions, etc. if demand is there for such a thing.

We are very fortunate to have a highly skilled reptile veterinarian that helps us immensely, and is 100% committed to our gecko venture. We also have a wonderful certified vet technician that works with us, which allows us to take breaks, go on vacations, and catch our breath. She is as into this project as we are, and we couldn’t do it all without her. So we have surrounded ourselves with great people, and great consultants like Ron , Garrick, and others who have provided enormous help as we learn and move forward with our gecko endeavor.

Across the road from the store is a really cool diner, as well as country stores, a post office, gas station, and even the local fire hall. It’s a wonderful little town that hearkens back to the good old days when life was simple and care-free. Hygiene is a magical little town near Boulder and Denver where people used to come to for many years to be healed from awful illnesses like tuberculosis. It is supposed to have some magical, mystical energy, and people swear that there’s something to all that. What better place to raise leopard geckos?!

CHRIS: Right now the store is set for “appointment only”. Do you have plans to open it to the public and if so, when?

RAY: It will take us some time yet to be fully operational. We have racks on order, and geckos to mate. But it is all coming together very nicely, and we hope to have it fully operational by late Spring. We will also continue to sell leos on our website, but some folks might find it nice to be able to come to the store to hand-select the animals they want. Pics don’t always tell the full picture of an animal, so we feel this might be an idea that might appeal to some. We are hopeful that people living in the Front Range area of Colorado will find out about us too. From the initial reactions we’ve gotten from the government planning boards and others we’ve spoken to, we are optimistic, despite the very difficult economy we are in.

CHRIS: What kind of experience can we expect walking into the Designer Geckos store?

RAY: I think the first thing people will feel, is relaxed. This will never be a high pressure sales operation. We want people to feel good, and to come in and enjoy their time there. We obviously cannot disturb each and every gecko for every customer, so we will encourage customers to first view our website so they have an idea of what we have, then we can show them individual animals based on their specific interests and morphs they are looking for. They can sit on the couch, have a drink, see the horses grazing across the road, and relax as we bring out a few geckos for them to check out. Then they can take one home, or just think about it and maybe get back to us. Our prices will be reasonable, and our gecko quality among the best in the field. No obligations, no pressures. That’s what the store will be all about.

CHRIS: Do you have plans on venturing into other types of Geckos or will the store be focused exclusively on Leopard Geckos?

RAY: Well, for the time being we will specialize in leopard geckos. But we are very interested in cresties and fat tails, so we may branch out depending on how things go. We never want to get too big. We want to concentrate on specific leo morphs. We will also work closely with other affiliated breeders to encourage customers to check out their animals too. We are big on referrals, and feel that this is a brotherhood of sorts. There is plenty of room for all of us. So many morphs, so little time…. The main thing is that we spread around the joy of these wonderful little creatures and have some fun!

For now, American Idol’s about to start, and one of my big tangerine males is ready for some couch time! Thanks all for your interest. We look forward to seeing some of you down the road….in our little town of Hygiene. Come on out and get some gecko energy!

It has truly been a pleasure conducting this interview with Ray and I am definitely going to stop by and check the place out when i’m in the area. I am really excited and I can definitely see the concept of a store catering exclusively to geckos succeeding! Please support Ray’s efforts, check out his website at www.designergeckos.com . This article will be the first part of a continuing series as we follow Ray and Carol in this exciting new venture!

CHRIS: Hello Mr. Wysocki, I want to say thank you for granting us some of your precious time for this interview. In case some of the viewing public does not recognize your popularity in our hobby, please tell us a little bit about yourself.

ADAM: Hi, and thank you for the chance to be on your site! My name is Adam Wysocki and I’m the owner of 8 Ball Pythons. I’ve been keeping ball pythons since I got my first one about 30 years ago. About 15 years ago I had my first “accidental” ball python breeding and I have been hooked ever since as a hobby breeder. Then, about 6 or 7 years ago I decided to breed ball pythons full time. Partly because my collection had grown so large that it was a full time job to take care of them but mostly because it gave me the opportunity to be home with my son as much as I could

CHRIS: Just out of curiosity, what’s behind the name “8 ball pythons”?

ADAM: That one is pure marketing. When I started the company, a lot of websites and swap meets were listing breeders alphabetically. So I wanted a name that started with a number. I bred only ball pythons, so I wanted “ball python” in the name. I also wanted something that people could visually identify with so the name of my company would be easy to remember. “8 Ball Pythons” fit the bill. As it turns out, when I first got into buying mutations to breed and resell, I owned “8” ball pythons… to this day I think it was a sign.

CHRIS: I know that this is indeed a reptile blog, but I can’t help but asking, what was your
experience like serving for the Marine Corps?

ADAM: I loved my time in the Marine Corps. When I graduated high school I wanted to serve my country. The first Iraq war was starting and I felt drawn to service. I love the United States and it was an honor to serve as a Marine for six years. As it turned out, I was selected to work in the computer field for the Marine Corp out of boot camp. I had never seen a computer before and it was a whole new world for me. Computer networks and the internet were just really getting going as the Marine Corps was training me on computers. I went to a lot of schooling and was able to work as a Marine with companies like Microsoft, Sun Microsystems, and Cisco Systems. It was a tremendous experience and provided me with a solid future career in the technology field. I owe the Marine Corps a lot.

CHRIS: With your original goal of producing albinos, how much did you pay for the 1 albino het male and 4, 50% het albino females? Initially, how many albinos were you able to produce from that group?

ADAM: I paid $5,000 for that group in 1996. The male het was a proven breeder. There was also a couple of racks, a thermostat, and two of the most beat up import Emerald Tree boas that you’ve ever seen in that group. It was a package deal and I had to take .
all of it. The first year they bred I ended up producing 9 albinos out of that group

CHRIS: Can you give us a little preview of what you have in store in terms of morphs?

ADAM: Not anything in store really. For the first time in 14 years, we’re not breeding this season. My wife and I are spending so much time with the non‐profit we just don’t want to stretch ourselves too thin. I can’t imagine having the time this summer to take care of hundreds of babies with all of the time I’ve been spending in DC and
traveling in order to help responsible pet owners.

CHRIS: I know you are actively involved in fighting the legislation constantly being lobbied against our hobby, can you give us a little bit of a background about your
organization, the National Pet Association (www.natpet.org)?

ADAM: Back in March of last year I had first heard about HR 669 which was a law that was going to ban tons of different types of pets … fish, birds, lizards, and the animal that I’m most passionate about … ball pythons. After researching a little more about the law I quickly realized how big the problem of anti‐pet legislation is all over the US. Like my service in the Marine Corps, I felt drawn to help. I knew that my background working in the fortune 500 after I got out of the Corps doing technology, marketing, business development, etc would be extremely helpful. We started the website nohr669.com and got about 30,000 people to send emails to Congress in just 18 days. From there, I realized that if there was a national organization that advocated on behalf of pets and responsible pet owners by bringing together the collective voices of the 74 million American households that own pets, that pet owners would be able to fire back at those that seek to restrict their liberties. From there, The National Pet Association was born. We’re in the process of becoming certified by the IRS as a 501(c)(3) non‐profit and not only to we fight laws that restrict the freedom of pet ownership in America, but we have social programs that help pets and pet owners. We’re selling off a large portion of the 8 Ball collection and using personal savings to fund the organization initially. We hope that over time the idea catches on .
and we’ll be able to continue to help for as long as we’re needed

CHRIS: What can the average hobbyist do to help fight for the cause?

ADAM: Be responsible and get involved locally. Submit op‐eds about the joys of reptile ownership to your local paper. Be a regular at local town hall events held by your Congressmen and women so that they get to know your face and the issues that are important to you. Be an advocate for responsible reptile ownership … join or form a local herp society, support a local reptile show, volunteer to show off your animals to a boy/girl scout troop, school, or summer camp.

CHRIS: Do you have any hero’s within and outside of the industry?

ADAM: I certainly do, the problem is that most of those guys are also my friends and they’d probably crack me in the head for calling them a “hero” … lol. People like Peter Kahl, Bob Clark, Brain & Lori Barczyk , Mark & Kim Bell, Eugene Bessette, Trooper Walsh … we all owe them for the industry we have today. There are many more that are responsible for the ground breaking work of figuring out the “hows” and “whys” of captive husbandry, but the names above are the ones I think about when you consider that at some point the gap between that awkward fumbling around figuring things out phase was bridged into a viable commercial industry. There are certainly many others not on my list that deserve just as much credit, but the names
above are people who I consider friends and respect very much.

CHRIS: Now I wouldn’t be a true journalist if I didn’t ask, are there any groups, organizations, or individuals that for one reason or another you just do not get along
with?

ADAM: Great question! … lol … Well, there was certainly a time when I was full of piss and vinegar and really looked down my nose at people who did things differently than I did. It’s almost embarrassing to think about now. I used to get out on internet message boards and forums and thrash away with people on a regular basis. I made some friends, made some enemies, and certainly rubbed a lot of people the wrong way. I’m really over all that now. Within the last couple of years I’ve gotten remarried, bought a great home on a beautiful farm, have gotten back in touch with the church and my faith, quit drinking, started doing volunteer work in my community, and have focused on “real life” instead of arguing with people on the internet. I’m having a lot more fun! These days, I couldn’t care less who does what or how they do it … it’s absolutely none of my business. I just hope that people are having fun with the animals, enjoying the hobby, and making some money. We have one of the greatest hobbies in the world as far as I’m concerned and although there are a bunch of different personalities within our community that may or may not get along, we all share a common bond with what we do. I’m content to just be as helpful as I can be to those who want my help and to stay out of the way of the
people that don’t.

Thank you again for the opportunity! I really appreciate it!

We would like to thank Adam Wysocki for sacrificing some of his precious time to spread the word about this hobby we all love. To learn more about Adam please visit www.8ballpythons.com. And to learn more about the National Pet Association please visit www.natpet.org