How to discuss Islam with Muslims

In honor of South Park

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Sat, 24 Apr 2010 01:15:00 +0000

As I'm sure all readers know, South Park producers Trey Parker and Matt Stone had their latest episode censored due to some nutty Muslims who threatened them with murder. Yes, I know, the nuts denied the threat, but just happened to included the address of the South Park production studio, showed a disgusting picture of the murdered Theo Van Gogh (caption: "Theo Van Gogh - Have Matt Stone And Trey Parker Forgotten This?") and said that they would "probably wind up like Theo Van Gogh for airing this show." Looks like a threat, smells like a threat and, well, it is a threat.

An interview with the Younus Abdullah Mohammed of the website, Revolution Muslim, revealed that he thought, "Islam will take over the world." That comment should be no surprise to anybody who understands Islam. It is a cult fixated on converting all (or killing those that won't). He also said that America is made up of, "Darwinist faggots who are as despicable as the rest, walking around eating your Triscuits." I can't explain this last comment, but it is quite funny.

Anyway, in honor of South Park, I would like to post a great interview of Ayaan Hirsi Ali by Anderson Cooper:

For further fun, here are the famous Denmark Muhammad cartoons:

And, finally, here's the image that was posted on the hacked Revolution Muslim website:

The crooked judges of Amsterdam

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 09:30:00 +0000

Another great video from Pat Condell. It stands on its own.

George Galloway's Muslim Bias Exposed

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Fri, 15 May 2009 02:01:00 +0000

Hilarious. Watch Georgie squirm in his seat. He tries to counter attack, but resorts to the tu quoque ("you too!") fallacy. The great part is that the interviewee turns it around on him.

What's so funny is that Galloway is completely blind to his bias. He can't tell the difference between facts and what he wishes were fact.

Islam 101 from Geert Wilders

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Fri, 06 Mar 2009 18:05:00 +0000

Just came across this intro to Islam from Geert Wilders on FaithFreedom.org It is definitely worth a read:

Allow me to give you a brief Islam 101. The first thing you need to know about Islam is the importance of the book of the Koran. The Koran is Allah’s personal word, revealed by an angel to Mohammed, the prophet.

This is where the trouble starts. Every word in the Koran is Allah’s word and therefore not open to discussion or interpretation. It is valid for every Moslem and for all times.

Therefore, there is no such a thing as moderate Islam.

Sure, there are a lot of moderate Moslems. But a moderate Islam is non-existent. The Koran calls for hatred, violence, submission, murder, and terrorism. The Koran calls for Moslems to kill non-Moslems, to terrorize non-Moslems and to fulfill their duty to wage war: violent jihad. Jihad is a duty for every Moslem, Islam is to rule the world - by the sword. The Koran is clearly anti-Semitic, describing Jews as monkeys and pigs.

The second thing you need to know is the importance of Mohammed the prophet. His behavior is an example to all Moslems and cannot be criticized. Now, if Mohammed had been a man of peace, let us say like Ghandi and Mother Theresa wrapped in one, there would be no problem.

But Mohammed was a warlord, a mass murderer, and a pedophile. Islamic tradition tells us how he fought in battles, how he had his enemies murdered and even had prisoners of war executed. Mohammed himself slaughtered the Jewish tribe of Banu Qurayza. He advised on matters of slavery, but never advised to liberate slaves.

Islam has no other morality than the advancement of Islam. If it is good for Islam, it is good. If it is bad for Islam, it is bad. There is no gray area or other side.

Koran as Allah’s own word and Mohammed as the perfect man are the two most important facets of Islam. Let no one fool you about Islam being a religion. Sure, it has a god, and a hereafter, and 72 virgins. But in its essence Islam is a political ideology.

It is a system that lays down detailed rules for society and the life of every person. Islam wants to dictate every aspect of life. Islam means ’submission’. Islam is not compatible with freedom and democracy, because what it strives for is sharia.

If you want to compare Islam to anything, compare it to communism or national-socialism, these are all totalitarian ideologies. This is what you need to know about Islam, in order to understand what is going on in Europe.

Now you know why Winston Churchill called Islam “the most retrograde force in the world,” and why he compared Mein Kampf to the Koran: Mein Kampf, he said, is “the new Koran of faith and war.”

Pat Condell on Netherlands, Wilders and Fitna

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Mon, 26 Jan 2009 01:23:00 +0000

Again, Pat Condell expresses exactly what I feel in a very funny and eloquent video. Also, for a reminder, here's the Wilders movie Fitnah:

Hamas-their own violent, hateful, dishonest words

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Sat, 17 Jan 2009 18:53:00 +0000

I've been asked in a number of emails to discuss Israel's Operation Cast Lead against Hamas, but have been personally busy with my real life work. However, it occurred to me that it would be easy enough to just let Hamas and their supporters speak for themselves. [After completing the post, I noticed that it ended up quite long. It is sectioned so you can read in pieces]

Here's a video of Hamas commentary before the recent Gaza war. Since it's based on material before the war, they are not reacting to the retaliation. Instead, they are more "forward-looking"...

Another video:

This last video can be summarized in one picture:

Is this just rhetoric? Well, let's look at their Hamas charter (http://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/hamas.asp):

From the Preamble: "Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it."
From Article 7: "The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree, (evidently a certain kind of tree) would not do that because it is one of the trees of the Jews." (related by al-Bukhari and Moslem)."
From Article 13: "Initiatives, and so-called peaceful solutions and international conferences, are in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement." and "There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors."
From Article 15: "The day that enemies usurp part of Moslem land, Jihad becomes the individual duty of every Moslem." and "The bond of one day for the sake of Allah is better than the world and whatever there is on it. The place of one's whip in Paradise is far better than the world and whatever there is on it. A worshipper's going and coming in the service of Allah is better than the world and whatever there is on it." (As related by al-Bukhari, Moslem, al-Tarmdhi and Ibn Maja).

"I swear by the holder of Mohammed's soul that I would like to invade and be killed for the sake of Allah, then invade and be killed, and then invade again and be killed." (As related by al-Bukhari and Moslem)."

Notice the reliance on the Quran and Hadith as justification for violence and hate.

HUDNAS (temporary cease-fires)

Let's examine the words in Article 13 about peaceful solutions being in contradiction to the movement and how any such initiatives are a "waste of time." For newcomers to Islam, this philosophy does not contradict the numerous ceasefires or hudnas as explained by Umdat as-Salik, a medieval summary of Shafi'i jurisprudence:

Hudnas with a non-Muslim enemy should be limited to 10 years: "if Muslims are weak, a truce may be made for ten years if necessary, for the Prophet made a truce with the Quraysh for that long, as is related by Abu Dawud" ('Umdat as-Salik, o9.16).

So you see a "hudna" is completely different to a true peaceful solution. In 2004, Hamas was very clear, again, in their own words (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hudna),

In January 2004, senior Hamas leader Abdel Aziz al-Rantissi offered a 10-year hudna in return for complete withdrawal from all territories captured in the Six Day War, and the establishment of a Palestinian state in the West Bank and Gaza. Rantissi said the hudna was limited to ten years and represented a decision by the movement because it was "difficult to liberate all our land at this stage; the hudna would however not signal a recognition of the state of Israel."

Note the "ten years." Also, as recently as June 2008, you can hear the same point being made.

When asked if he could envision a 50-year hudna (cease-fire) with Israel, Hamas leader Nizar Rayyan responded, "The only reason to have a hudna is to prepare yourself for the final battle. We don't need 50 years to prepare ourselves for the final battle with Israel. Israel is an impossibility. It is an offense against God."

Remember, that the June 2008 hudna is the hudna that directly preceded Operation Cast Lead. The hudna was also violated by Hamas and an extension was rejected by Hamas. It was the violation, extension rejection, and violence escalation that caused Israeli retaliation.

HATE INDOCTRINATION
What does Hamas say to it's children? Let's go to the videotape...

Is it just the tv? No, it gets worse. It starts in the schools. Yes, the UNRWA schools funded by tax dollars. Let's take a look what Palestinian children are being taught:

“...Oh you who are Jews ...long for death if you are truthful... for the death from which you flee, that will surely overtake you ...” and “Those [Jews] who were charged with the Torah, but did not observe it, are like a donkey carrying books...” [Reading the Koran, grade 6. p.20, 23, 78].

“One must beware of the Jews, for they are treacherous and disloyal.”
[Islamic Education for Ninth Grade p. 79, these and below from CMIP report]
“I learn from this lesson: I believe that the Jews are the enemies of the Prophets and the believers.”[Islamic Education, Part Two, for Fourth Grade p. 67]
“Remember: “The final and inevitable result will be the victory of the Muslims over the Jews.” [Our Arabic Language for Fifth Grade p. 67]
“The clearest examples of racist belief and racial discrimination in the world are Nazism and Zionism. “ [The New History of the Arabs and the World, P. 123]

TAQQIYAH (lies as a means to an end)

While any civilian deaths are a tragedy, it nonetheless says quite a bit when lies and disinformation are used by Hamas at such a great scale. Contrast Hamas with the IDF and their fact-based Youtube site. When comparing Hamas and Israel, the above cartoon keeps coming back as one of those pictures that says a thousand words. I'll hold off in this post from a heavy analysis, and stick to Hamas's own words.

With Muhammad's endorsement of lying as a means to an end, it's no wonder that there is so much doublespeak when Hamas members speak to the press. In this video, you'll see the BBC interviewer struggling to understand the answers as he points out contradictions (and, btw, it should be noted that this is the same BBC who conducted an investigation into its own anti-Israel bias and then spent an estimated £200,000 in an effort to withhold the report - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Balen_Report):

There are three parts, so watch all three if you can stomach the bull.

There's more. In the Hamas effort at disinformation, Hamas got France 2 to participate in it's second case of blood libel against Israel. In this second, sickening case, Hamas redistributed video from 2005 that showed horrible civilian deaths in Gaza during a Hamas celebration. Without regard for the value of civilian lives, Hamas brought live ordinance to the rally. When that live ordinance exploded, many people died or were injured. Since Fatah thwarted Hamas's 2005 attempt to blame the Israelis for their own violence, they saved the tape and reused it in 2009 thanks to the ever-cooperative France 2:

Israel Gaza point 13h00 sur F2 et Images de 2005
by ReadyHdFull

One more example of Taqqiyah and I'll stop. In this next case, they have made the same BBC as well as CNN complicit. This video at Liveleak, takes a detailed examination of Hamas's propaganda from a medical perspective:

Additional military analysis will tell you that Israeli drones to not fire missiles that target children and leave such little damage (clothes even hanging on the line). Also, note the contradictions in the story from this report(http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/asiapcf/01/08/hamas.boy/index.html) that says, "Just a short time earlier, Mashharawi had been filming other, less personal images of the war-- scenes like incoming missiles and the damage they do. Then, he got a phone call." and this report (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/from_our_own_correspondent/7819819.stm) which says "Ashraf rushed upstairs and took the boys to hospital, but it was hopeless. They were buried the same day." So was he out filming or at home? Also, you'll notice that the CNN report talks about being "hit by a rocket" while the BBC report talks about " two small rockets" - is it one rocket or two. Finally, the key actor here is Mads Gilbert, noted anti-Israel Norwegian who supported the 9-11 attacks. There's more, but I think it's now obvious that this is staged Pallywood...Taqqiyah.

HAMAS SUPPORTERS

As many other bloggers have noted, the pro-Hamas protests have been filled with violence, anti-Jewish invectives[a women screams "go back to the ovens"] and, of course, anti-Jewish violence. They have attacked the police in London, NY and LA, partnered with white supremists, praised Hitler, and attacked Jewish communities. Zombietime has a great compilation of the whole thing. Here's one from Denmark and translations (http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/024366.php):

00:10:00
Alla-hu Akbar, Alla-hu Akbar
00:32:00
Hitler! Heil Hitler! Hitler! Hitler! Hitler! …
00:40:00
We must just kill all those Jews, man! Then we'd be rid of them, man!
00:45:00
All Jews, man, they will never be loved, never loved.
01:15:00
We are prepared for everything! Prepared for everything! It is you [shouting].
01:28:00
[Interrupting] Give us some Jews!
01:29:00
Now listen up. Now you go home, treading [??] where you want. If you meet some Jews.
01:35:00
[Interrupting] We fuck them, man!
01:38:00
Tell them how many they've killed.
01:40:00
Tell them how all Arabs from Copenhagen, how all Arabs from [??], how all Arabs from Hitler, how their punishment will be, for the blood of the Palestinians.
02:00:00
[Assorted shouting, including:] Fucking Jews, man!
02:08:00
Death to Israel.
02:42:00
Kill the Jews.
02:44:00
Allah-hu Akbar
03:08:00
Israel under my foot, Palestine in my blood!
03:18:00
Muhammad Rasul Allah! [Muhammad prophet of Allah!]
05:20:00
Down, down Israel! Down, down Israel!
05:22:00
Down, down USA! Down, down USA!
05:24:00
Viva, viva Palestine! Viva, viva Palestine!
05:25:00
[The banner reads:] Is this defense?
05:30:00
Viva, viva Palestine! Viva, viva Palestine!
05:50:00
Give us some Jews! Give us some Jews! [Explosion heard]
06:10:00
Israel under my foot, Palestine in my blood! Israel under my foot, Palestine in my blood!
06:25:00
[Arabic – probably a Khaybar reference]

Khaybar is a Jewish village that Muhammad and his followers destroyed, massacring inhabitants.

Here's one more video showing Hamas supporters violently attacking the Israeli Embassy. Note the almost useless Dhimmi police.

Finally, here's some leaflets distributed at Copenhagen’s Rådhusplads Wednesday by a nervous man, about 25 years old, who hastily disappeared.
You won't see that reported by the MSM.

SOME HUMOR

Let me end with some words that are not from Hamas, but may help to end on a lighter note. The irony is that the fake news sounds more truthful than what France 2, CNN and BBC publish.

UPDATE
According to Al Jazeera (http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2009/01/200911591418168902.html), Mahmoud Khalil Al-Mashharawi of the CNN video died on Jan 1, well before the Jan 7 date claimed by the CNN/BBC video. (information found by Vilhjalmur Örn Vilhjalmsson of Denmark and translated by Augean Stables).

Mumbai Muslim Terrorists Laughed and Filmed the Dead

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Fri, 05 Dec 2008 21:50:00 +0000

I guess this is what Muslims learn after reciting the Quran and being instructed in Jihad, see the article for more:

Father Apoorva, a 57-year-old builder, is still recovering from his injuries. Still reeling with shock, the family was initially even hesitant to tell their name.

Instead, Parikh’s son Rohan, 22, a business student, recounted his father’s experience in an email.

His father had gone to the Oberoi that night for dinner with two of his closest friends, he said.
The three friends were at a restaurant on the first floor of the Oberoi when they heard gunshots. The hotel staff tried to rush the guests out of the kitchen exit.

‘As the guests tried to rush into the kitchen, one terrorist burst into the restaurant and began to shoot anyone that remained in the restaurant. At this point my father was in the kitchen and, along with his two friends, rushed to the fire exit.

‘They had barely descended a few steps when they were trapped from both ends by terrorists.

‘The terrorists then rounded up anyone alive (about 20 people) and made them climb the service staircase to the 19th floor. On reaching the 18th floor landing they made the people line up against a wall.

‘One terrorist then positioned himself on the staircase going up from the landing and the other on the staircase going down from the landing.

‘Then, in a scene right out of the Holocaust, they simultaneously opened fire on the people. My father was towards the centre of the line with his two friends on either side. Out of reflex, or presence of mind, he ducked as soon as the firing began.

‘One bullet grazed his neck, and he fell to the floor as his two friends and several other bodies piled on top of him. The terrorists then pumped another series of bullets into the heap of bodies to finish the job.

‘This time a bullet hit my father in the back hip. Bent almost in double, crushed by the weight of the bodies above him, and suffocating in the torrent of blood rushing down on him from the various bodies my father held on for 10 minutes while the terrorists left the area.

‘When he finally had the courage to wiggle his arms he found that there were four other survivors in the room. They communicated to each other by touch as they were too afraid to make a sound.

‘My father moved just enough to allow himself room to breathe and then lay still. The survivors passed over 12 hours lying still in the heap of bodies too afraid to move.

‘They constantly heard gunfire and hand grenades going off in the other parts of the hotel. They feared that any noise would bring the terrorists back.

‘After approximately 12 hours, the terrorists returned with a camera and flashlight and joked and laughed as they filmed what they thought was a pile of dead bodies.

‘They then moved to the landing below where they set up explosives. On their departing, my father decided that it was too risky to remain where they were, due to the explosives.’

The three survivors then climbed the rest of the stairs to reach an air-cooling plant room where they hid, drinking sips of water from the air-conditioning unit, till Friday, November 28, morning when a commando team rescued them and took them to hospital.

Captured Mumbai terrorist talks while Pakistanis claim it was "Hindu Zionists"

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Tue, 02 Dec 2008 18:20:00 +0000

Since the authorities have captured one of the Mumbai Jihadi's, we find out the truth:

“From there, they mandated to kill indiscriminately, particularly white foreign tourists, and spare Muslims split up into five batches. Two of them Ismail and Ajmal took a taxi to Victoria Terminus. Three other batches of two each headed for Oberoi Hotel, Cafe Leopold and Nariman House. The remaining four went to Taj Hotel.”

“Spare Muslims” - why?
Quran 4:93
And whoever kills a believer intentionally, his punishment is hell; he shall abide in it, and Allah will send His wrath on him and curse him and prepare for him a painful chastisement.

Contrast that to:

Quran 9:5
So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them; surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

and

Sahih Bukhari Volume 4, Book 52, Number 177:
Allah’s Apostle said, “The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. “O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him.”

You see, unbelievers are fine to slay, especially those Jews…but don’t touch another Muslim!

Hindu Zionists?!?

While the captured Jihadi was talking, a Pakistani TV show decided to blame the whole affair on Hindu Zionists. Go here for more and a link to the video, if you can understand.

They "accused India, the US and Israel of hatching a conspiracy to defame Pakistan. The program, anchored by Qudsia Qadri, was completely outrageous and reflected the Pakistani mindset towards India."

UPDATE

Just saw this blog post from Patterico. The MSM has been apologizing on behalf of Islam for so long that journalists are fully blind to Islam's promotion of hatred and violence towards Jews:

On Thursday during CNN’s coverage of the Mumbai terror attacks, a CNN security analyst couldn’t understand why the terrorists targeted a Jewish Center:

And we still - but we still do not know a motive. You know, you look at the Jewish center. Why did they hit the Jewish center? You know, and you look at the other places, you know, big icons where there are going to be a lot of people. And that’s what terrorists do. They hit places that they consider soft targets where they can have the most bang for the buck, if you will, and where there are a lot of people - hotels, train stations, those kind of things.

FURTHER UPDATE
Jihadwatch just reported on this article in the Washington Post, which tells us a little more about the captured terrorist:

Bharti, the interrogator, said Kasab has told police that he is from a village called Faridkot, in Pakistan's Punjab province, and that he dropped out of school after the fourth grade. His father owned a food stall. An acquaintance introduced him to an outlawed group called Lashkar-i-Taiba in 2005, Bharti said, and Kasab later trained with the group in Muzaffarabad, the capital of Pakistani-controlled Kashmir.
"He went through different stages of training. At first, it was the recitation of the Koran and lectures about jihad. He was being prepared mentally. Then small-weapons training," Bharti said in an interview. "Then came the hard physical, marine training. At first, Kasab used to vomit. They were taught how to survive at sea, on ground, and how to control thirst and hunger. From a batch of about 25, 10 were handpicked for the Mumbai mission."

Now even the Washington Post understands that Islam had something to do with it. Maybe CNN will realize why they attacked the Jewish Center after all.

ANOTHER UPDATE

New data has come on to confirm that Mumbai attacks were in the name of Islam, and targeted Jews...Phone Transcripts of Mumbai Attacks Indicate Gunmen Not Acting Alone:

The handlers told a team of gunmen who had seized a Jewish center to shoot hostages if necessary.

"If you are still threatened, then don't saddle yourself with the burden of the hostages. Immediately kill them," he said.

Six Jewish foreigners, including a rabbi and his wife, were killed inside the Jewish center.

Later in the night, nearly 24 hours after the attacks began, the handlers urged the gunmen to "be strong in the name of Allah"

"Brother, you have to fight. This is a matter of prestige of Islam," the handler said. "You may feel tired or sleepy, but the commandos of Islam have left everything behind, their mothers, their fathers."

The gunmen were told several times not to kill any Muslim hostages.

UK Sharia - Wife Beating and Inheritance Mistakes

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Wed, 19 Nov 2008 19:12:00 +0000

The woman in black wanted an Islamic divorce. She told the religious judge that her husband hit her, cursed her and wanted her dead.

But her husband was opposed, and the Islamic scholar adjudicating the case seemed determined to keep the couple together. So, sensing defeat, she brought our her secret weapon: her father....The judge promptly reversed himself and recommended divorce.

UK Sharia law in action - the beaten wife has to bring a man into the mix to get justice. She barely has a voice.

What an awful site, yet it continues. I wish the politicians that instituted Sharia simply read a few paragraphs from the Quran, like this one (4:34):

Men are the maintainers of women because Allah has made some of them to excel others and because they spend out of their property; the good women are therefore obedient, guarding the unseen as Allah has guarded; and (as to) those on whose part you fear desertion, admonish them, and leave them alone in the sleeping-places and beat them; then if they obey you, do not seek a way against them; surely Allah is High, Great.

If you fear desertion, admonish them, leave them alone in bed and beat them. Oh, and the husband is both judge and jury. It's verses like this and the supporting Hadith that bring about this kind of counseling:

If the husband beats her, she should go to the police and have a divorce, Qurashi said. "But if he's slapped her only once or something like that," she said, "and he admits he has made a mistake and promised not to do it again, then we say, 'You have to forgive.' "

Clearly, Qurashi didn't talk to the first woman who got more than a few slaps. That's because Qurashi is an "unofficial" counselor - after all, she's not a man. BTW, since when is it ok to slap once "or something like that"? Tell us Qurashi - what if the one and only slap injures the woman? Explain to us where you draw the line. Does anybody else see the insanity here?

Then, of course, there's the unfairness in inheritance distribution, never mind all the inheritance mistakes. Well UK Sharia has an answer for that:

Three months ago, for example, a wealthy Bangladeshi family asked Dr. Raza's council to resolve an inheritance dispute. It was resolved according to Shariah, he said. That meant the male heirs received twice as much as the female heirs.

How about this quote - wife beating, child abuse and Jew hating all rolled into one:

A Pakistan-born 33-year-old mother of five explained that her husband would beat her and her children. "He threatens to kill us," she said, as her daughter translated from Urdu. "He calls me a Jew and an infidel."

Isn't Islam great? Go here for more:
http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/11/19/europe/19shariah.php

Islam's cult of Allah and Muhammad's terror - 3

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Sun, 20 Apr 2008 19:17:00 +0000

This is the third in a series of posts that has less to do with discussing Islam with Muslims, and more to do with non-Muslim ignorance to the vicious cult of Islam.

In Parts 1 and 2, I demonstrated that Islam means "submission" not "peace," and that the Quran is extremely violent when you understand verse abrogation, and the history of Muhammad.

Here, I will point out the fallacy of Islam's supposed tolerance of other faiths and of atheists. Let's start with the great Ayaan Hirsi Ali educating the uneducated on Dhimmitude and on Muslim intolerance

Dhimmis and "People of the Book"

So what is Ayaan Hirsi Ali referring to, and do 1000 year old churches and synagogues tell the full story? What about the apologist retort that Muslims protect "People of the Book" (Jews and Christians)? Well, first here is the Quran verse referenced by Ayaah Hirsi Ali:

9:29 Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Messenger have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the (Jizya) tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.

Sounds almost exactly like her words in the video, except worse. Fight against them until they pay the Jizya tax acknowledging inferiority and live in a state of subjection. The word to describe people in such a state is "Dhimmi." How does it look in practice? (from Al-Maghili, a fifteenth century Muslim theologian)

On the day of payment {of the jizya} they {the dhimmi} shall be assembled in a public place like the suq {place of commerce}. They should be standing there waiting in the lowest and dirtiest place. The acting officials representing the Law shall be placed above them and shall adopt a threatening attitude so that it seems to them, as well as to others, that our object is to degrade them by pretending to take their possessions. They will realize that we are doing them a favor in accepting from them the jizya and letting them go free. (Al-Maghili, quoted in Bat Ye'or, The Decline of Eastern Christianity under Islam, 361.)

Here's more from Sufi theologian and jurist al-Ghazali:

…the dhimmi is obliged not to mention Allah or His Apostle…Jews, Christians, and Majians must pay the jizya …on offering up the jizya, the dhimmi must hang his head while the official takes hold of his beard and hits [the dhimmi] on the protruberant bone beneath his ear [i.e., the mandible]… They are not permitted to ostentatiously display their wine or church bells…their houses may not be higher than the Muslim’s, no matter how low that is. The dhimmi may not ride an elegant horse or mule; he may ride a donkey only if the saddle[-work] is of wood. He may not walk on the good part of the road. They [the dhimmis] have to wear [an identifying] patch [on their clothing], even women, and even in the [public] baths…[dhimmis] must hold their tongue….

Dhimmis were also prohibited from building churches, proselytizing or openly practicing their religion. Sounds like modern day Saudi Arabia, correct? Well, this is one reason why Wahabi Muslims in Saudi Arabia think they have the purest version of Islam. Dhimmitude was and is not pleasant, and it was also not the rule. In many cases, Jews and Christians were just made into slaves or killed. Find a full history here from Bat Ye'or and other scholars.

What about those that were not perfect in their Dhimmitude or did not want to live in a state of subjection:

…the whole Gaza region up to Cesarea was sacked and devastated in the campaign of 634. Four thousand Jewish, Christian, and Samaritan peasants who defended their land were massacred. The villages of the Negev were pillaged…Towns ...were isolated and closed their gates. In his sermon on Christmas day 634, the patriarch of Jerusalem, Sophronius, lamented…that the Christians were being forcibly kept in Jerusalem: ‘…chained and nailed by fear of the Saracens (Muslims),’ whose ‘savage, barbarous and bloody sword’ kept them locked up in the town…

Sophronius, in his sermon on the Day of the Epiphany 636, bewailed the destruction of the churches and monasteries, the sacked towns, the fields laid waste, the villages burned down by the nomads who were overrunning the country.

In a letter the same year to Sergius, the patriarch of Constantinople, he mentions the ravages wrought by the Arabs. Thousands of people perished in 639, victims of the famine and plague that resulted from these destructions.

According to [the Muslim chronicler] Baladhuri (d. 892 C.E.), 40,000 Jews lived in Caesarea alone at the Arab conquest, after which all trace of them is lost...

The above is only from the history of Palestine. In Moorish Spain, churches were turned right into mosques. In a strange irony, Muslims in Spain are now asking for equal rights to the Church of Cordoba. This church had been Christian, was turned into a mosque by the Moors, then turned back into a church. Destruction or alteration of Dhimmi property continues until today - Iran destroyed seven ancient synagogues just last week.

What about those that were not "People of the Book"? Well, let's start with the estimated millions of Hindus killed during the Muslim conquest of India. K.S. Lal estimates up to 80 million killed, and, while others have criticized this number, most scholars concede of a death toll in the many millions.

Of course there are the 1/4 million Armenians murdered by the Turks. Then there were the original non-Muslims who lived in the core of today's Islamic strongholds: Iran, Iraq, Syria, Egypt...was that a peaceful conversion? Well, it wasn't called "Muslim conquest" for nothing.

More in the next post...

Reaction to Fitna - Pat Condell

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Tue, 01 Apr 2008 10:05:00 +0000

There have been a number of reactions to Fitna:

From Muslim countries: Seething, with threats of violence.

From Western nations: Condemnation and cowardice. The freedom of speech that we hold dear is discarded at the slightest threat.

No political body seems to speak for me. Internet bloggers and Youtubers are the only ones that are being honest and direct. My favorite...Pat Condell:

Fitna : Geert Wilders' film

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Fri, 28 Mar 2008 01:33:00 +0000

Click and watch.

So the movie is finally out. Finally...after the Dutch parliament requested that Dutch MP Geert Wilders not show it, after the EU went to censor it, and after Network Solutions prevented even an announcement that the film was coming.

Watch it. In its entirety. You'll have to do it on the Internet because the MSM will try to hide this film, even though it's only 15 minutes. You'll join the 1 million viewers who saw it in only the first 30 minutes of its release!

Then watch for the seething violence that will follow.

Update:
Apparently, Sarkozy has “officially declared that France would provide every necessary support to aid the Netherlands in the suppression of any Muslim violence” that may result from the release of Dutch MP Geert Wilders’ controversial documentary film called “Fitna.”

Further update:
After threats of violence, LiveLeak was forced to take down the film. The great thing is that through their death threats, Muslims have demonstrated exactly what Geert Wilders is trying to prove. Islam is clearly a violent, sick religion whose followers have lost their ability to reason.

The good news is that the Youtube link is still working, and I've added that at the top of the page. Watch the LiveLeak version underneath to hear the official statement from the company.

Another update:
LiveLeak decided not to cower in the face of violent Islam. The video is back up!

Wafa Sultan vs. Islamists on Al-Jazeera

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Fri, 07 Mar 2008 22:26:00 +0000

Nothing needs to be said. This words of this brilliant woman are enough.

Update - Al-Jazeera apologizes
Al-Jazeera apologized ( also YNET) because their male Muslim speakers got their collective asses handed to them by a woman, an atheist woman no less. Hilarious.

Update - Wafa Sultan in hiding
Still embarrassed by Wafa Sultan's amazing performance on Al-Jazeera, Muslims have issued enough death threats for Wafa Sultan to go into hiding. Don't you love discussing Islam with Muslims?

The following are excerpts from a debate between Arab-American psychiatrist Wafa Sultan and Egytian Islamist Tal'at Rmeih, which aired on Al-Jazeera on March 4, 2008. Egyptian Islamist Tal'at Rmeih: "The West only understands the language of force. Contacts with the West which are not based on real force are futile. One day, America declared that the North Korean nuclear dossier would be referred to the U.N. Security Council. North Korea issued a one-line declaration: 'Korea will consider this to be a hostile act of war.' The Americans bit their tongues, and that was it. The West understands nothing but the language of force, and attacks nobody but the weak. Therefore, our nation – with all its people, and organizations, institutions, rulers, and subjects – is required to adopt a resolute stand of resistance and confrontation in the face of these criminal and hostile acts. The West, in this confrontation, which is not divorced from the massacres that are taking place in Palestine and Iraq…The embassies of Denmark, Holland, France, and the U.S. are not more precious to us than Iraq, which has been destroyed, or than Palestine, which is experiencing a real – not fabricated – holocaust. These countries are subject to a holocaust and a massacre. How can we confront this? By Allah, if we issued a communiqué, signed by all the Arab and Islamic organizations and institutions, the West would bite its tongue and stop all this. By Allah, if the Arab summit decided to boycott Denmark, they would all be disgraced. By Allah, if the masses of the nation would gather for one hour only around the embassies of Denmark, those despicable lowlifes would be in a position of retreat, not attack." […] Arab-American Psychiatrist Wafa Sultan: "All religions and faiths, throughout the history of humanity, have been subject to criticism and affronts. With time, this has helped in their reform and development. Any belief that chops off the heads of its critics is doomed to turn into terrorism and tyranny. This has been the condition of Islam, from its inception to this day. Islam has sentenced [its critics] to prison, and whoever crosses the threshold of that prison meets his death. The Danish cartoons have managed to break down the first brick in the wall of that prison, and to open up a window, through which the sunrays enter, after a lengthy darkness. The Danish newspaper exercised its freedom of speech. Liberties are the holiest thing in the West, and nothing is more important. But if Islam were not the way it is, those cartoons would never have appeared. They did not appear out of the blue, and the cartoonist did not dig them out of his imagination. Rather, they are a reflection of his knowledge. Westerners who read the words of the Prophet Muhammad 'Allah has given me sustenance under the shadow of my sword' cannot imagine Muhammad's turban in the shape of a dove of peace rather than in the shape of a bomb. The Muslims must learn how to listen to the criticism of others, and maybe then they will reexamine their terrorist teachings. When they manage to do so, the world will view them in a better light, and consequently, it will draw them in a better light. The reactions of the Muslims, which were characterized by savageness, barbarism, and backwardness, only increased the value of these cartoons, and gave them more importance than they merited, simply because they proved that these cartoons were true, and that the message they were conveying was true. The Muslim is an irrational creature ruled by instincts. Those teachings have deprived him of his mind, incited his emotions, and reduced him to the level of an inferior creature that cannot control himself or react to events rationally." […] Tal'at Rmeih: "God help me. First, Islam is too great to be harmed by the publisher of the cartoon, or by that woman who is talking over there. The truth is that everything she said is 100% false, I'm sad to say. It seems to me that the American and Zionist intelligence agencies have begun to produce people who are hostile to their own nation." […] Dr. Faysal Al-Qassem, Moderator: "How come freedom of expression in the West is sacred only when it comes to degrading the Muslims? Are they allowed to talk about the Holocaust? Are they allowed to talk about Christianity? That is the question. Cinemas were burned down in the West when they talked about Christ." Wafa Sultan: "I live in America, and I never heard of a single cinema that was burned down here. Where do you get your information from? It sounds as if you are living in America, not me." Moderator: "In France." Wafa Sultan: "This is completely baseless. You should criticize your own beliefs just as Christians criticize their beliefs." […] Moderator: "Don’t you think that you are treating the viewers like fools? You present some trivial reactions as barbaric. Have you forgotten that the country in which you live destroyed Iraq in its entirety, killing 1.5 million Iraqis and driving five million out of their homes? Didn't you see the dozens of children annihilated in Gaza, in a holocaust, as Israel itself admits? When a man blows himself up, he becomes a terrorist, but when you annihilate an entire people, whole countries, it is considered a humanitarian act?! Who are you kidding?" […] Wafa Sultan: "Why are they upset about what is going on in Gaza, while the Koran says to them: 'They shall kill and be killed.' So here they are – killing and being killed. What's wrong with that?" Tal'at Rmeih: "Leave the Koran out of it. If you want to talk politics, go ahead." Moderator: "I beg you to stick to politics. He talked only about politics." Wafa Sultan: "Dr. Faysal, you know that you cannot separate Islam from politics. Islam is not a religion, but politics. You must let me express my views the way I want. When you called me, you didn't say I was not allowed to discuss Islam or the Koran. Islam says to them that they will 'kill or be killed', and here they are—killing and being killed. So what's wrong with that? They want to be martyred and to meet their black-eyed virgins, and Israel is merely helping them get what they want. What's wrong with that? If you want to change the course of events, you must reexamine your terrorist teachings, you must recognize and respect the right of the other to live, you must teach your children love, peace, coexistence, and productive work. When you do that, the world will respect you, will consider you in a better light, and will draw you in a better light." Moderator: "Can you denounce the Zionist massacres in Gaza? That's a simple question. Do you have the courage to do so?" Wafa Sultan: "I can denounce the Palestinians and the Israelis alike. Hamas chose this path, and you have to pay the price for your choices. When you decide you want peace – I am sure that Israel wants peace, but as long as you keep reciting those teachings, which are full of hatred, rancor, and terrorism, you will be unable to make peace with others. You must recognize and respect Israel's right to live. You must teach your children love, peace, and coexistence. Only then will there be peace." […] Moderator: "Do you dare to say that the number of people who died in the Jewish Holocaust is even one less [than what they claim]? Do you dare to say that? Why don't you dare to even touch on Jewish history – let alone on Jewish religion and sanctities? Why do you flex your muscles only against the oppressed Muslims?" Wafa Sultan: "Why do you want me to deny historical documents that confirm that the Holocaust took place? If there was no proof, I would deny it. But I cannot deny history, knowledge, and documents confirming that the Holocaust indeed took place. Why do you want me to deny the facts?" Moderator: "From what she says, it is clear that she has no problem denying the holy books, but she is adamant about not denying historical documents." Wafa Sultan: "Can you as a Muslim deny the massacre of the Jews of the Bani Qureyza tribe, by Muhammad and his followers?" […] Tal'at Rmeih: "There is a gang that controls [the West], and you are not allowed to criticize Israel or the Holocaust. Anyone who criticized the Holocaust was placed on trial. Noam Chomsky wrote one line about the Holocaust in a book, and the book was recalled from the market. Bernard Lewis – that great philosopher – said something about the Holocaust and was placed on trial. What did the American president say to the U.S. forces sent to the Philippines? He gave them two orders: 'Kill all people above the age of ten, and convert [the rest] to Christianity.'" […] Wafa Sultan: "Did you invite me to the show to hear hollow speeches, which have been around for 1,400 years?" Tal'at Rmeih: "Allah be praised, we have an identity and a culture." Wafa Sultan: "How can someone who believes in killing people who do not pray possibly criticize liberties in the West? This is a farce. What past is he defending? Is he defending the invasions and lootings?" Tal'at Rmeih: "I am defending the past of the Islamic nation, which was the beacon of knowledge for the entire world…" Wafa Sultan: "…polygamy, beheadings, chopping of heads and feet on alternate sides, accusing people of heresy, and drinking camel urine, as a cure for all ailments – is this the past he is defending?" Tal'at Rmeih: "No, I am defending a magnificent past of a magnificent nation, which was the cradle of knowledge and civilization, at a time when the most that people in the West could do was to catch a rabbit and scurry back to their caves. This nation has made the greatest contribution to civilization and humanity. Our religion is not complete without recognition of other religions. We are the ones who have called for tolerance and respect for religions."

Islam's cult of Allah and Muhammad's terror - 2

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Mon, 04 Feb 2008 06:50:00 +0000

From the previous post, it is clear that the Quran is full of violent, vicious verses. Moreover, these verses abrogate (replace) the earlier, peaceful verses that they contradict. With this in mind, it is clear that the Quran is violent, hateful book.

Many apologists will often take another next ignorant step. They commit the tu quoque fallacy by comparing the Quran to the Bible. As an atheist, I can ignore the fallacy and see the violence in both books as abhorrent.

For the sake of argument, they are both violent - The Bible has 871 verses of cruelty and violence while the Quran has 512, but, since the Quran is much shorter, you can see that the Quran has about 3 X as violent percentage-wise: 8.2% vs. 2.8%. We can take this one step further, in light of abrogation, and realize that the Quran is much more than 3 times as violent. Unfortunately, there is more. If we add in verses that may not direct violence, but demonstrate hatred or viciousness towards unbelievers, the Quran shows its true ugly self:

By far the greatest portion, however, over 60% of the text of the Koran, is devoted to polemics against unbelievers, justifications for placing them in submission or killing them, on rewards for those who believe in Allah (especially for those who war against unbelievers), and punishment for unbelievers on earth and in the hereafter.

However, counting verses is not enough. There is more.

It is important to understand the differences between Islam and the other two Abrahamic religions. These differences explain why the Quran's violent words are much more dangerous:

1. Muslims consider the Quran to be the word of Allah, NOT the inspired word of Allah. Thus the Quran is considered perfect in the eyes of Muslims. No mistakes. Thus, there is no doubt on what to do when it says "beat your wife" if you fear disloyalty or "slay the unbeliever wherever you find them."

2. The Quran's words are considered timeless and universal, regardless of the context from which they came.

3. Islam is considered more than just a religion. It is considered a prescriptive guide to life, law, politics, warfare,...many have called Islam a "political religion" or even a socio-political system with religion as just an element.

Now, these points together, you have a violent, racist, misogynist guide to life that is timeless, universal and infallible. At this point, it pays to just list some of these horrible verses in the guide:

Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits, for Allah does not love transgressors. 2:190

And slay them wherever you catch them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out, for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter. 2:191

And fight them on until there is no more tumult or oppression, and let there prevail justice and faith in Allah; but if they cease, let there be no hostility except to those who practice oppression. 2:193

Fighting is prescribed for you, and you dislike it. But it is possible that you dislike a thing which is good for you, and that you love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knows, and you know not. 2:216

Let those fight in the cause of Allah who sell the life of this world for the Hereafter. To him who fights in the cause of Allah, - whether he is slain or gets victory – soon shall We give him a reward of great value. 4:74

Of the Unbelievers: "seize them and slay them wherever you find them: and in any case take no friends or helpers from their ranks." 4:89

Allah has granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit at home. 4:95

…"for the Unbelievers are open enemies to you." 4:101

For the Unbelievers, Allah has prepared a humiliating punishment. 4:102

O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion: nor say of Allah anything but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was no more than a Messenger of Allah… Do not say "Trinity": desist: it will be better for you: for Allah is One God: Glory be to Him: far exalted is He above having a son. 4:171

From those too, who call themselves Christians, We did take a covenant, but they forgot a good part of the Message that was sent to them: so We estranged them, with enmity and hatred between one and the other, to the Day of Judgment. And soon will Allah show them what they have done. 5:14

In blasphemy indeed are those that say that God is Christ the son of Mary. 5:17

O you who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors: they are but friends and protectors to each other. And he among you that turns to them for friendship is of them. 5:51

They do blaspheme who say: "God is Christ the son of Mary." They do blaspheme who say: God is one of three in a trinity: for there is no God except one God Allah. If they do not desist from their word of blasphemy, verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them. Christ the son of Mary was no more than a Messenger; many were the Messengers that passed away before him. 5:72- 73, 5:75

Of the Jews: ‘When in their insolence they transgressed all prohibitions, We said to them: "Be you apes, despised and rejected."’ 7:166

"Many are the men We have made for Hell…" 7:179

Remember your Lord inspired the angels with the message: "I am with you: give firmness to the Believers: I will instill terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers: you smite them above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them." 8:12

Against them make ready your strength to the utmost of your power, including steeds of war, to strike terror into the hearts of the enemies of Allah. Whatever you spend in the cause of Allah shall be repaid to you and you shall not be treated unjustly. 8:60

O Messenger! Rouse the Believers among you to the fight. If there are twenty amongst you, patient and persevering, they will vanquish two hundred: if a hundred, they will vanquish two thousand of the Unbelievers: for these are people without understanding. 8:65

…Then fight and slay the Pagans wherever you find them, seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem of war…9:5

Fight them and Allah will punish them by your hands, cover them with shame, help you to victory over them, heal the breasts of the Believers. 9:14

Fight those who do not believe in Allah … until they pay the Jizya with willing submission and feel themselves subdued. 9:29

… Allah will send His punishment from Himself or by our hands. 9:52

Therefore, when you meet the Unbelievers in fight, smite at their necks; at length, when you have thoroughly subdued them, bind a bond firmly on them… He lets you fight in order to test you, some with others. But those who are slain in the way of Allah, - He will never let their deeds be lost. 47:4

It is He Who got out the Unbelievers among the People of the Book from their homes at the first gathering of the forces. Little did you think that they would get out: and they thought that their fortresses would defend them from Allah! But the wrath of Allah came to them from quarters from which they had little expected it, and cast terror into their hearts, so that they destroyed their own dwellings by their own hands and the hands of the Believers. 59:2

That is because they resisted Allah and His Messenger: and if any one resists Allah, verily Allah is severe in punishment. Whether you cut down O you Muslims the tender palm-trees, or if you left them standing on their roots, it was by leave of Allah, and in order that He might cover with shame the rebellious transgressors. 59:4,5

They will not fight you even together, except in fortified townships, or from behind walls. Strong is their fighting spirit amongst themselves: you would think they are united, but their hearts are divided: that is because they are a people devoid of wisdom. 59:14

Truly Allah loves those who fight in His Cause in battle array, as if they were a solid cemented structure. 61:4

More verses (with some repeats) that inspire hatred:

On Jews and Other "Disbelievers"

[Christians, Pagans, and Jews are all castigated as unbelievers, but the Koran's main thrust is against Jews. Unbelievers in Muhammad as a prophet of God and in the Koran as God's word, are depicted not only as infidels, but are reviled as vile liars and deceivers. The theme permeating the Koran is typified by the following verse]:

5.78.. Those of the children of Israel who disbelieved were cursed by the tongue of David and Jesus the son of Mary;... Evil is that which they did... Evil is that which their souls have sent before them, for God's wrath is on them, and in the torment shall they dwell for aye. But had they believed in God and the Prophet, and what was revealed to him, they had not taken these for their patrons; but many of them are evildoers.

[This theme is presented in the Koran over and over again. The contexts change, but the message remains the same. The precepts presented, one must emphasize, are to be taken as the lessons that Allah himself commands to be believed as the means to avoid being boiled in Hell.

2.92. Did not Moses came to you with clear proofs, and yet you worshiped the calf after he left, and you were polytheists and wrong-doers.

2.96. Verily, you will find the Jews the greediest of mankind for life and even greedier than those who ascribe partners [other gods] to Allah.

2.100. Is it not [the case] that every time they make a covenant, some party among them throw it aside? Nay! the truth is most of them believe not.

2.124. And when his Lord tried Abraham with certain words, he fulfilled them. He [Allah] said: "Surely I will make you an Imam of men" . Abraham said: :And [what] of my offspring?" My covenant does not include the unjust, said He [Allah].

3.75. Among the people of the Scripture [Jews and Christians] is he who, if entrusted with a Cantar [a great amount of wealth, etc.], will readily pay it back; and among them there is he who, if entrusted with a single silver coin, will not repay it unless you constantly stand demanding, because they say: "There is no blame on us to betray and take the properties of the illiterates [Arabs]." But they tell a lie against Allah while they know it.

3.78. Among them are those who distort the Book with their tongues, so that you may think it is from the Book, but it is not from the Book. They say: "This is from Allah," but it is not from Allah. They speak a lie against Allah while they know it. Do not make friends of those outside your religion, since they will not fail to do their best to corrupt you. They desire to harm you severely. Hatred has already appeared from their mouths, but what their breasts conceal is far worse...

3.119. Lo! You are the ones who love them but they love you not, and you believe in all the Scriptures while they disbelieve in your Book [Koran]. And when they meet you, they say, "We believe". But when they are alone, they bite the tips of their fingers at you in rage. Say [to them]: "Perish in your rage."

3.120. If a good befalls you, it grieves them, but if some evil overtakes you, they rejoice at it. But if you remain patient and become Al-Muttaqûûn (the pious), not the least harm will their cunning do to you.

4.161. And their taking usury though indeed they were forbidden it and their devouring the property of people falsely, and We have prepared for the unbelievers from among them a painful chastisement.

4.156. And because of their [the Jew's] disbelief and uttering against Mary a grave false charge [that she has committed illegal sexual intercourse].

4.157. And because of their saying [in boast], "We killed Messiah Jesus, son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah," - but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but the resemblance of Jesus was put over another man... For surely; they killed him, not Jesus son of Mary.

4.159. And there is none of the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians), but must believe in him, son of Mary as only a Messenger of Allah and a human being... And on the Day of Resurrection, he [Jesus] will be a witness against them.

4.161. And their taking of Ribââ [usury] though they were forbidden from taking it and their devouring of men's substance wrongfully [bribery, etc.]. And We have prepared for the disbelievers among them a painful torment

4.50. Look, how they invent a lie against Allah...

4.52. They are those whom Allah has cursed, and he whom Allah curses, you will not find for him any helper.

5.51. O you who believe! Do not take the Jews and Christians for friends; they are but friends of one another; and whoever among you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them.

5.58. And when you call to prayer they make it a mockery and a joke, because they are a people who will not understand.

5.60. ...Those Jews who incurred the Curse of Allah and His Wrath, some of whom He has transformed into monkeys and swine...

5.62. You see many of them [Jews] hurrying for sin and transgression, and doing illegal things [bribes and usury]. Evil indeed is that which they have been doing.

5.63. Why do not the rabbis and the doctors of law prohibit them from their speaking of what is sinful and their consuming what is unlawfully acquired? Certainly evil is that which they work...

5.66. ...As for most of them, evil is what they do.

7.40. ...The doors of heaven shall not be opened for them, nor shall they enter the garden until the camel pass through the eye of the needle.

7.41. They shall have a bed of hell-fire... thus do We reward the unjust.

8.55. Surely the vilest of animals in Allah's sight are those who disbelieve.

8.56. Those with whom you make an agreement, then they break their agreement every time...

62.5. The likeness of those who were charged with the Torah, then they did not observe it, is as the likeness of the ass bearing books, evil is the likeness of the people who reject the communications of Allah.

Regarding Christianity

[Many references to Jesus appear in the Koran. The Gospel is accepted as a holy book to be followed, and Jesus is cited as a prophet, but Jesus's divinity is denied]:

23.91. Never did Allah take to Himself a son, and never was there with him any (other) god -- in that case would each god have certainly taken away what he created, and some of them would certainly have overpowered others; glory be to Allah above what they describe!

Fighting "Unbelievers"

[Slaughtering unbelievers is authorized with some nominal"limits." Killing unbelievers becomes an obligation under many circumstances. Unbelievers are to be spared if they become subject to believers, and pay an obligatory tax].

2.190. Fight in the Way of Allah those who fight you, but transgress not the limits.

2.191. And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief and worshiping of other gods along with Allah) is worse than killing.

2.193. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah and worship is only for Allah..

2.216. Jihad (holy fighting in Allah's Cause) is ordained for you, though you dislike it, and it may be that you dislike a thing which is good for you and that you like a thing which is bad for you.

2.243. Did you [O Muhammad] not think of those who went forth from their homes in thousands, fearing death? Allah said to them, "Die!" Then He restored them to life.

3.12. Say [O Muhammad] to those who disbelieve: "You will be defeated and gathered together to Hell, and worst indeed is that place to rest."

[The following passages refer to two battles against Jewish communities, one at Badr, in which the Islamic forces were victorious, and the other at Uhud, in which they were defeated]:

3.13. There has already been a sign for you, O Jews, in the two armies that met [at Badr]: One fought in the Cause of Allah; the others were disbelievers. The believers saw the disbelievers with their own eyes [as] twice their number, although they were thrice their number.

3.139. So do not become weak against your enemy, nor be sad, and you will be victorious if you are indeed believers.

3.141. So does Allah test [or purify] the believers [from sins] and destroy the disbelievers.

3.142. Do you think that you will enter Paradise before Allah tests those of you who fought [in His Cause]?

3.143. You wished for martyrdom before you met it. Now you have seen it openly with your own eyes.

[The Koran then turns to the battle of Uhud. The exhortations are rationalizations of the ignominious defeat of the Muslim forces]:

3.155. Those of you who turned back on the day the two hosts met, it was Shaitâân [Satan] who caused them to backslide[run away from the battlefield] because of some [sins] they had earned. But Allah, indeed, has forgiven them.

3.156. O you who believe! Be not like those who disbelieve and who say to their brethren when they go out to fight: "If they had stayed with us, they would not have died..." It is Allah that gives life and causes death.

3.157. And if you are killed or die in the Way of Allah, forgiveness and mercy from Allah are far better than all that they amass [of worldly wealth, etc.].

3.158. And whether you die or you are slain, verily to Allah shall you be gathered.

3.166. And what befell you on the day when the two armies met was with Allah's knowledge, that He might know the believers.

3.167. And that He might know the hypocrites. It was said to them: Come, fight in Allah's way, or defend yourselves. They said: "If we knew fighting, we would certainly have followed you." They were on that day much nearer to unbelief than to belief. They said with their mouths what is not in their hearts, and Allah best knows what they conceal.

3.168. Those who said of their brethren whilst they [themselves] held back: "Had they obeyed us, they would not have been killed." Say [to them]: "Then avert death from yourselves if you speak the truth."

3.169. Think not of those who are killed in Allah's way as dead. Nay, they are alive with their Lord are provided sustenance from their Lord.

3.170. They rejoice in what Allah has bestowed upon them of His Bounty, rejoicing for those who have not yet joined them, but are left behind [not yet martyred] that on them no fear shall come, nor shall they grieve.

3.172. Those who answered [the Call of] Allah and the Messenger after being wounded; for those of them who did good deeds and feared Allah, there is a great reward

4.74. Therefore let those who would trade this world's life for the Hereafter fight in the cause of Allah.. Whoever fights in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, We shall grant him a mighty reward.

4.75. . What reason have you for not fighting in the cause of Allah and of the weak among the men and the women and the children..

4.76. Those who believe, fight in the Cause of Allah, and those who disbelieve fight in the cause of Satan. Fight therefore against the friends of the Satan; surely the strategy of the Satan is weak.

4.89. They desire that you should disbelieve as they have disbelieved, so that you might be like them; therefore take not from among them friends until they fly [follow] in Allah's way. But if they turn back [to disbelief], then seize them and kill them wherever you find them, and take not from among them a friend or a helper.

4.91. You will find [those hypocrites] who would like to be safe from you and [also] secure from their own people. As often as they are sent back to the mischief they get thrown into it headlong. Therefore, if they do not withdraw from you, offer you peace, and restrain their hands, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them; against these We have given you a clear authority.

8.17. You did not slay them, it was Allah Who slew them, and you did not smite when you smote [the enemy], but it was Allah Who smote, and that He might confer upon the believers a good gift from Himself.

8.41. And know that whatever of war-booty that you may gain, verily one-fifth of it is assigned to Allah, and to the Messenger [Muhammad], and to the near relatives [and also] the orphans, the poor, and the wayfarer...

8.57. Therefore if you gain the mastery of them in war, then punish them severely in order to disperse those who are in their rear, that they may learn a lesson.

8.65. O Prophet! urge the believers to war; if there are twenty steadfast ones of you they shall overcome two hundred, and if there are a hundred steadfast of you they shall overcome a thousand of those who disbelieve, because they are a people who do not understand.

8.66. Now Allah has lightened your burden, for He knows that there is weakness in you. So if there are a hundred steadfast of you they shall overcome two hundred, and if there are a thousand they shall overcome two thousand by Allah's permission

8.67. It is not fit for a prophet that he should take captives unless he has fought and triumphed in the land; you desire the frail goods of this world, while Allah desires [for you] the hereafter.

8.69. So enjoy the booty you have gained in war, lawful and good, and be afraid of Allah.

9.5. So when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush. But if they repent and perform prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them.

9.13. What! will you not fight a people who broke their oaths and aimed at the expulsion of the Apostle, and they attacked you first; do you fear them? But Allah is most deserving that you should fear Him, if you are believers.

9.14. Fight them so that Allah will punish them by your hands and bring them to disgrace, and bring you victory over them, and heal the hearts of a believing people.

9.29. Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the Last Day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.

Women in the Koran

2.223. Your wives are a tilth [fertile ground or "receptacle for your seed"] for you, so go into your tilth when you like, and do good beforehand for yourselves, and be careful (of your duty) to Allah, and know that you will meet Him, and give good news to the believers.

4.34. Men are the protectors and maintainers of women because Allah has made some to excel others and because they spend out of their property. Good women are therefore devoutly obedient, guarding their chastity and their husband's property. Those [women] on whose part you fear disobedience, first admonish them, then refuse to share their bed, and last, beat them. Then if they obey you, do not seek a way against them.

22.31. Say to the believing women that they cast down their eyes and guard their private parts and do not display their ornaments; let them wear their head-coverings over their bosoms, and not display their ornaments except to their husbands or their fathers, or the fathers of their husbands, or their sons, or the sons of their husbands, or their brothers, or their brothers' sons, or their sisters' sons, or their women, or those whom their right hands possess, or male servants not having need [of women], or the children who have not attained knowledge of what is hidden of women; and let them not strike their feet so that what they hide of their ornaments may be known

--------------------------------

I know I've missed a lot, even for the Quran. Also, the violence continues in a much more prescriptive way in the Had, and there is a lot more prescriptive violence in the Hadith for those interested. Here are some links to lists of vicious Quran and Hadith passages:

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/quran/cruelty/long.html
http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/peacefulreligion.htm
http://answering-islam.org/Terrorism/peace-loving.html
http://answering-islam.org/Bailey/jihad.html
http://www.answering-islam.org/Silas/apostasy.htm
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Pages/Myths-of-Islam.htm#islammeanspeace

Islam's cult of Allah and Muhammad's terror

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Mon, 04 Feb 2008 06:36:00 +0000

This next series of posts has less to do with discussing Islam with Muslims, and more to do with non-Muslim ignorance to the vicious cult of Islam. I decided to write this post after receiving many questions by non-Muslims and seeing many lies and obfuscations by Muslims.

Most non-Muslims will often repeat the Muslim propaganda that Islam means "peace." They will often follow that up with Quran quotes that make the "peaceful" point or a paraphrase of said points. I admit that I did the same thing immediately after 9-11...before I spent the time to read the Quran. Then, I spent some time reading the Hadith, and my mistakes became even more clear. Both "religion of peace" propaganda points are false.

Meaning of Islam

The first point is a plain old lie. Islam means "submission." You can check this anywhere on the web, and two simple sources are the Wikipedia for Islam and an Islamic site called submission.org. Here's Wikipedia:

The word Islām is derived from the Arabic verb Aslama, which means to accept, surrender or submit.

Muslims are those people that have agreed to submit to Allah. They also want the rest of the world to join them (violence quite ok):

9:29
Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.

Does the Quran promote violence or peace?

The short answer - the Quran appears to promotes both, but really promotes violence. When listening to Muslims, you will often hear them only quote the peaceful passages. However, they are practicing Taqqiyah - misleading with dishonesty for the greater purpose of promoting Islam. Unfortunately, the peaceful passages are abrogated by the later more violent passages. Let me quote from JihadWatch.org:

The principle of abrogation -- al-naskh wa al-mansukh (the abrogating and the abrogated) -- directs that verses revealed later in Muhammad's career "abrogate" -- i.e., cancel and replace -- earlier ones whose instructions they may contradict. Thus, passages revealed later in Muhammad's career, in Medina, overrule passages revealed earlier, in Mecca. The Quran itself lays out the principle of abrogation:
2:106. Whatever a Verse (revelation) do We {Allah} abrogate or cause to be forgotten, We bring a better one or similar to it. Know you not that Allah is able to do all things?

Now let's put everything together by first giving an extremely brief history of Muhammad and Islam:

Mohammad started Islam in Mecca while under the protection of his wealthy, much older wife, Khadija and his uncle Abu Talib. Muhammad was inspired by the monotheistic Jews and Christians, whom he met during trade and travel. Although protected, Muhammad and his followers were in a relatively weak position while in Mecca. Thus, the Meccan verses of the Quran show humility and are relatively peaceful (e.g., 2:256: "there is no compulsion in religion").

In 619, both Khadija and his powerful uncle died, leaving the Meccan Muslims without protection. Muhammad moved to Medina a few years later with just a few hundred followers, and found a more receptive audience. After gaining more converts (and marrying a child named Aisha), Muhammad realized the power of a politically-driven religion. He decided to grow at a more rapid pace by raiding Meccan caravans, and sharing the spoils with his followers (e.g., Chapter 8 of the Quran is titled "Spoils of War; Booty," detailing how to divide the wealth). His vengeance against the Meccans that had persecuted him and his followers did not cease until he defeated and converted them, murdering his remaining, unconverted enemies. He also reversed his view of fellow monotheists, Jews and Christians, because of their disbelief and aloofness to his new religion. New, vicious verses in the Quran were "revealed" to justify the destruction, murder and enslavement of entire Jewish communities (the male Jews of Banu Qurayza were massacred while the females and children were banished or became slaves). In this Medina period, Muhammad's "revelations" take a turn to the violent.

Here is a summary of key Mecca verses and the Medina verses that abrogate them (see FaithFreedom.org for the original source here and be sure to check the next post on Islam's cult of Allah):

When Muhammad was at Mecca

After Muhammad went to Medina

Be careful of what you utter in the presence of the unbelievers; be patient with them.

73:10 And bear with patience what they utter, and part from them with a fair leave-taking. [3, Mecca ]

Slay the unbelievers wherever you find them

2:191 And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they first attack you there, but if they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers. [87, Medina ]

Do not use coercion with the infidels.

50:45 We are Best Aware of what they say, and thou (O Muhammad) art in no wise a compeller over them. But warn by the Qur'an him who feareth My threat. [34, Mecca ]

Make war on the infidels living in your neighbourhood.

9:123 Make ready for them all thou canst of (armed) force and of horses tethered, that thereby ye may dismay the enemy of Allah and your enemy, and others beside them whom ye know not. Allah knoweth them. Whatsoever ye spend in the way of Allah it will be repaid to you in full, and ye will not be wronged. [113, Medina ]

Be patient with the unbelievers; Allah will judge them.

10:109 And (O Muhammad) follow that which is inspired in thee, and forbear until Allah give judgment. And He is the Best of Judges. [51, Mecca ]

When opportunity arises, kill the infidels wherever you catch them.

9:5 Then, when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then leave their way free. Lo! Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. [113, Medina ]

Argue gently with the Jews, the Christians and the infidels.

16:125 Call unto the way of thy Lord with wisdom and fair exhortation, and reason with them in the better way. Lo! thy Lord is Best Aware of him who strayeth from His way, and He is Best Aware of those who go aright. [70, Mecca ]

Kill the Jews and the Christians if they do not convert to Islam or refuse to pay Jizya tax.

9:29 Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture as believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, and forbid not that which Allah hath forbidden by His messenger, and follow not the Religion of Truth, until they pay the tribute readily, being brought low. [113, Medina ]

One is free to practice whatever religion one belongs to.

109:6 Unto you your religion, and unto me my religion. [18, Mecca ]

Any religion other than Islam is not acceptable.

3:85 And whoso seeketh as religion other than the Surrender (to Allah) it will not be accepted from him, and he will be a loser in the Hereafter. [89, Medina ]

Muslims should learn from the Books of the Jews and the Christians.

10:94 And if thou (Muhammad) art in doubt concerning that which We reveal unto thee, then question those who read the Scripture (that was) before thee. Verily the Truth from thy Lord hath come unto thee. So be not thou of the waverers. [51, Mecca ]

The Jews and the Christians are perverts; fight them.

9:30 And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah, and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah. That is their saying with their mouths. They imitate the saying of those who disbelieved of old. Allah (Himself) fighteth against them. How perverse are they! [113, Medina ]

Do not force the infidels into Islam.

10:99: And if thy Lord willed, all who are in the earth would have believed together. Wouldst thou (Muhammad) compel men until they are believers? [51, Mecca ]

Maim and crucify the infidels if they criticise Islam.

5:33 The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom; [112, Medina ]

Show kindness and tolerance towards the infidels.

7:199 Keep to forgiveness (O Muhammad), and enjoin kindness, and turn away from the ignorant. [39, Mecca ]

The infidels are unclean; do not let them into a mosque.

9:28 O ye who believe! The idolaters only are unclean. So let them not come near the Inviolable Place of Worship after this their year. If ye fear poverty (from the loss of their merchandise) Allah shall preserve you of His bounty if He will. Lo! Allah is Knower, Wise. [113, Medina ]

Show forgiveness towards the unbelievers.

15:85 We created not the heavens and the earth and all that is between them save with truth, and lo! the Hour is surely coming. So forgive, (O Muhammad), with a gracious forgiveness. [54, Mecca ]

Be harsh with the unbelievers.

9:73 O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites! Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end. [113, Medina ]

Do not insult the infidels lest they insult Allah.

6:108 Revile not those unto whom they pray beside Allah lest they wrongfully revile Allah through ignorance. Thus unto every nation have We made their deed seem fair. Then unto their Lord is their return, and He will tell them what they used to do. [55, Mecca ]

Punish the unbelievers with garments of fire, hooked iron rods, boiling water; melt their skin and bellies.

22:19 These twain (the believers and the disbelievers) are two opponents who contend concerning their Lord. But as for those who disbelieve, garments of fire will be cut out for them; boiling fluid will be poured down on their heads [103, Medina ]
22:20 Whereby that which is in their bellies, and their skins too, will be melted; [103, Medina ]
22:21 And for them are hooked rods of iron. [103, Medina ]
22:22 Whenever, in their anguish, they would go forth from thence they are driven back therein and (it is said unto them): Taste the doom of burning. [103, Medina ]

Do not dispute with the Jews and the Christians.

29:46 And argue not with the People of the Scripture unless it be in (a way) that is better, save with such of them as do wrong; and say: We believe in that which hath been revealed unto us and revealed unto you; our Allah and your Allah is One, and unto Him we surrender. [85, Mecca ]

The Jews and the Christians are in perpetual hostility to the Muslims

2:137 And if they believe in the like of that which ye believe, then are they rightly guided. But if they turn away, then are they in schism, and Allah will suffice thee (for defence) against them. He is the Hearer, the Knower. [103, Medina ]

Deal kindly with those unbelievers who do not torment the Muslims.

60:8 Allah forbiddeth you not those who warred not against you on account of religion and drove you not out from your homes, that ye should show them kindness and deal justly with them. Lo! Allah loveth the just dealers. [91, Medina ]

Fight the unbelievers vigorously without any exception.

25:52 So obey not the disbelievers, but strive against them herewith with a great endeavour. [42, Mecca ]

Be courteous when you speak with the infidels.

17:53 Tell My bondmen to speak that which is kindlier. Lo! the devil soweth discord among them. Lo! the devil is for man an open foe. [50, Mecca ]

Be stern with the infidels.

66:9 O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites, and be stern with them. Hell will be their home, a hapless journey's end. [107, Medina ]

Tolerate the unbelievers and be at peace with them.

43:89 Then bear with them (O Muhammad) and say: Peace. But they will come to know. [63, Mecca ]

Do not hanker for peace with the infidels; behead them when you catch them.

47:4 Now when ye meet in battle those who disbelieve, then it is smiting of the necks until, when ye have routed them, then making fast of bonds; and afterward either grace or ransom till the war lay down its burdens. That (is the ordinance). And if Allah willed He could have punished them (without you) but (thus it is ordained) that He may try some of you by means of others. And those who are slain in the way of Allah, He rendereth not their actions vain. [95, Medina ]

Do not force the unbelievers to accept Islam—just warn them.

50:45 We are Best Aware of what they say, and thou (O Muhammad) art in no wise a compeller over them. But warn by the Qur'an him who feareth My threat. [34, Mecca ]

The unbelievers are stupid; urge the Muslims to fight them

.
8:65 O Prophet! Exhort the believers to fight. If there be of you twenty steadfast they shall overcome two hundred, and if there be of you a hundred (steadfast) they shall overcome a thousand of those who disbelieve, because they (the disbelievers) are a folk without intelligence. [88, Medina ]

Be friendly with the infidels to remove evil from their hearts.

41:34 The good deed and the evil deed are not alike. Repel the evil deed with one which is better, then lo! he, between whom and thee there was enmity (will become) as though he was a bosom friend. [62, Mecca ]

Muslims must not take the infidels as friends.

3:28 Let not the believers take disbelievers for their friends in preference to believers. Whoso doeth that hath no connection with Allah unless (it be) that ye but guard yourselves against them, taking (as it were) security. Allah biddeth you beware (only) of Himself. Unto Allah is the journeying. [89, Medina ]

The unbeliever’s scriptures are similar to the Qur’an.

46:10 Bethink you: If it is from Allah and ye disbelieve therein, and a witness of the Children of Israel hath already testified to the like thereof and hath believed, and ye are too proud (what plight is yours)? Lo! Allah guideth not wrong-doing folk. [66, Mecca ]

Terrorise and behead those who believe in scriptures other than the Qur’an.

8:12 When thy Lord inspired the angels, (saying): I am with you. So make those who believe stand firm. I will throw fear into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Then smite the necks and smite of them each finger. [88, Medina ]

Muslims should forgive the infidels for their unbelief.

45:14 Tell those who believe to forgive those who hope not for the days of Allah; in order that He may requite folk what they used to earn. [65, Mecca ]

Muslims must muster all weapons to terrorise the infidels.

8:60 Make ready for them all thou canst of (armed) force and of horses tethered, that thereby ye may dismay the enemy of Allah and your enemy, and others beside them whom ye know not. Allah knoweth them. Whatsoever ye spend in the way of Allah it will be repaid to you in full, and ye will not be wronged. [88, Medina ]

Muslim honor killings and Sharia family violence

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Thu, 17 Jan 2008 03:59:00 +0000

With Muslim immigration to the West continuing, Westerners have learned about honor killings the hard way (Aqsa Pervez, 16 in Canada, Amina Yaser Said, 18, and Sarah Yaser Said, 17 in Texas, Ghazala Khan in Denmark, Hina Saleem, 21 in Italy ). Many have asked if they are connected with Islam. Muslims have been quick to deny it. Rather than going through a long explanation, I will leave the reader with two sets of facts: a UN report on the prevalance of honor killings in certain (mostly Muslim) countries and the Quran and Hadith that incite the activity. The reader can then make up their own mind. My final comment is that although Muslims will try to avoid discussing the horrific penalties for lewd activities and adultery, it is interesting to find that my inspiration for this post was comments posted to me by a Muslim supporting stoning and 100 lashes as the correct solution from Sharia law to America's decadent society (check comments to this post on violent sexism and wife beating).

The UN estimates that there are thousands of honor killings every year. They also have some ideas where they are from (United Nations High Commission for Human Rights (2002)):

"The report of the Special Rapporteur ... concerning cultural practices in the family that are violent towards women (E/CN.4/2002/83), indicated that honour killings had been reported in Egypt, the Islamic Republic of Iran, Jordan, Lebanon, Morocco, Pakistan, the Syrian Arab Republic, Turkey, Yemen, and other Mediterranean and Persian Gulf countries, and that they had also taken place in such countries as France, Germany and the United Kingdom, within migrant communities."

Hmm...migrant communities. Now from the Quran and Hadith (thanks to FaithFreedom.org )

Quran- 4:15 “If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, take the evidence of four (reliable) witness from amongst you against them; if they testify, confine them to houses until death do claim them. Or God ordain for them some (other) way.”

Quran-24:2 “The woman and the man guilty of adultery or fornication—flog each of them with hundred stripes: Let no compassion move you in their case, in a matter prescribed by God, if ye believe in God and the last day.”

Quran-17:32 “ Nor come nigh to adultery: for it is a shameful (deed) and an evil, opening the road (to other evils).

Quran-33:33 “stay quietly in your houses, and make not a dazzling display.”

Now some sahih hadiths:

Bukhari: Volume 7, Book 63, Number 196:
Narrated Abu Huraira: A man from Bani Aslam came to Allah's Apostle while he was in the mosque and called (the Prophet ) saying, "O Allah's Apostle! I have committed illegal sexual intercourse." On that the Prophet turned his face from him to the other side, whereupon the man moved to the side towards which the Prophet had turned his face, and said, "O Allah's Apostle! I have committed illegal sexual intercourse." The Prophet turned his face (from him) to the other side whereupon the man moved to the side towards which the Prophet had turned his face, and repeated his statement. The Prophet turned his face (from him) to the other side again. The man moved again (and repeated his statement) for the fourth time. So when the man had given witness four times against himself, the Prophet called him and said, "Are you insane?" He replied, "No." The Prophet then said (to his companions), "Go and stone him to death." The man was a married one. Jabir bin 'Abdullah Al-Ansari said: I was one of those who stoned him. We stoned him at the Musalla ('Id praying place) in Medina. When the stones hit him with their sharp edges, he fled, but we caught him at Al-Harra and stoned him till he died.
(See also Bukhari: Volume 7, Book 63, Number 195.)

Sahi Bukhari: 8:6814:
Narrated Jabir bin Abdullah al-Ansari: “A man from the tribe of Bani Aslam came to Allah’s Messenger [Muhammad] and informed him that he had committed illegal sexual intercourse; and he bore witness four times against himself. Allah’s Messenger ordered him to be stoned to death as he was a married person.”

Sahi Muslim No. 4206:
“A woman came to the prophet and asked for purification by seeking punishment. He told her to go away and seek God’s forgiveness. She persisted four times and admitted she was pregnant. He told her to wait until she had given birth. Then he said that the Muslim community should wait until she had weaned her child. When the day arrived for the child to take solid food, Muhammad handed the child over to the community. And when he had given command over her and she was put in a hole up to her breast, he ordered the people to stone her. Khalid b. al-Walid came forward with a stone which he threw at her head, and when the blood spurted on her face he cursed her.”

Sahih Al-Bukhari Vol 2. pg 1009; and Sahih Muslim Vol 2. pg 65:
Hadhrat Abdullah ibne Abbaas (Radiallahu Anhu) narrates the lecture that Hadhrat Umar (Radiallaahu Anhu) delivered whilst sitting on the pulpit of Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam). Hadhrat Umar (Radiallahu Anhu) said, "Verily, Allah sent Muhammad (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) with the truth, and revealed the Quran upon him. The verse regarding the stoning of the adulterer/ess was from amongst the verse revealed (in the Quraan). We read it, secured it and understood it. Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) stoned and we stoned after him. I fear that with the passage of time a person might say, ‘We do not find mention of stoning in the Book of Allah and thereby go astray by leaving out an obligation revealed by Allah. Verily, the stoning of a adulterer/ress is found in the Quraan and is the truth, if the witnesses are met or there is a pregnancy or confession."

Al-Bukhari:
The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said, “Whoever guarantees me that he will guard his chastity, I will guarantee him Paradise”.

Al-Bukhari, Muslim, Abu Dawud, An-Nisa’i and others:
Abu Hurayrah reports that the Messenger of Allah said, “No one commits adultery while still remaining a believer, for faith is more precious unto Allah than such an evil act!” In another version, it is stated, “When a person commits adultery he casts away from his neck the bond that ties him to Islam; if, however, he repents, Allah will accept his repentance”.

Al-Bayhaqi:
The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said, “O mankind! Beware of fornication/adultery for it entails six dire consequences: three of them relating to this world and three to the next world. As for the three that are related to this world, they are the following: it removes the glow of one’s face, brings poverty, and reduces the life-span. As for its dire consequences in the next world they are: it brings down the wrath of Allah upon the person, subjects him to terrible reckoning, and finally casts him in hell-fire.”

Update:

Here's a nutty, but scary story from NY about a woman who met an Al Qaeda-connected imam on a Muslim dating site. Already sounds loony, but it gets worse. Notice that the newspaper decides to defend the imam immediately without even researching the matter:

Dr. Yasser Shalaby, editor in chief of Al Zalzala, an Arabic-language paper, said he also ran an article to protect Saleh. "I felt it was very dangerous for someone to come to the mosque and try to get the leader in trouble," he said

The imam dishonored her, and now she's fearing an honor killing:

"This is a dishonor to my entire family, every member. My parents disowned me. Basically, he's ruined my life," she told The Post. "I have to clean my name."
Worst of all, she fears she is now a target for an "honor killing" by al Qaeda, according to court papers. Saleh admitted to The Post that a distant relative is a member of the terrorist organization, but said he has had no communication with him.

Typical of Muslims, the imam uses the adjective "Jewish" freely to insult her without realizing that other non-Muslims don't get it:

sheik sent her an e-mail describing her as "a trashy and lustful woman, a weeping and cursed Jewish woman."

Ezra (Uzair) and the next Quran error

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Sun, 13 Jan 2008 18:52:00 +0000

Let's go to the third Quran (Koran) error I use in my opening with Muslims:

009.030
YUSUFALI: The Jews call 'Uzair a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the son of Allah. That is a saying from their mouth; (in this) they but imitate what the unbelievers of old used to say. Allah's curse be on them: how they are deluded away from the Truth!
PICKTHAL: And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah, and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah. That is their saying with their mouths. They imitate the saying of those who disbelieved of old. Allah (Himself) fighteth against them. How perverse are they!
SHAKIR: And the Jews say: Uzair is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!

The Quran claims that Jews called Ezra (Uzair) "the son of Allah." BTW, you'll notice Yusuf Ali trying to soft-pedal the point by using "a son" instead of "the son." Clearly, this is an attempt to obfuscate the matter because here's the original Arabic:

Waqalati alyahoodu AAuzayrun ibnu Allahi
waqalati alnnasara almaseehu ibnu Allahi

Notice that the phrase referring to the Jews (al yahoodu) and the phrase referring to the Christians (al nnasara) look exactly the same.

It is common knowledge that Jews do not have a specific person who they believe in "the son of God." This is a key contentious point between Jews and Christians, and a blasphemous comment for a Jew to make. The closest you can get in the Bible are references to one of three things (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Son_of_God):

Angels are sometimes referred to as sons - "Benei Elohim"
The real king of Israel -( II Samuel 7: 14, with reference to King David and those of his descendants who carried on his dynasty; comp. Psalm 89:27, 28)
Israel as a people (comp. Exodus 4: 22 and Hosea 11:1)

Remember this quote from the Old Testament:

Do not have any other gods before Me. Do not represent [such] gods by any carved statue or picture of anything in the heaven above, on the earth below, or in the water below the land. Do not bow down to [such gods] or worship them. I am God your Lord, a God who demands exclusive worship

It's blasphemous to refer to any other gods but YHWH. That's it.

Even the coming of Messiah is referred to as God or "king. " Let's even consider the blasphemous thought that maybe, possibly, the Messiah could be referred to as the "son" of God...still, there is no mention of Ezra as either the Messiah or "The Son of God" in modern or ancient Judaism. None. Thus, a clear mistake.

I think Edward Henry Palmer said it best

The Moslem tradition is that Ezra, after being dead 100 years, was raised to life, and dictated from memory the whole of the Jewish Scriptures which had been lost during the captivity, and that the Jews said he could not have done this unless he had been the son of God. There is no Jewish tradition whatever in support of this accusation of Mohammed's, which probably was entirely due to his own invention or to misinformation.

Muslim Apologetics

What do the Muslim apologists have to say? Has anybody found a single Jew in history that said Ezra was the son of God? Funny enough, I can only find one response on the Net: http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Contrad/External/ezra.html

Unfortunately for Muslims, not even this response is able to quote a single Jew referring to Ezra as the son of God. Basically, the best part of this response is just a quote of another Muslim apologist, this one from the 300 years after Mohammad. Apologists quoting apologists do not quite solve a critical mistake made in a supposedly "perfect" book by a supposed infallible God.

Let me take this response apart in more detail:

It opens with a discussion of Ezra's life, and a quote discussing where he might be buried. The point here is that Ezra was a key figure in reforming Jewish law.

G. D. Newby

Next, it continues with a quote from Newby where an attempt is made to place a connection between Ezra, the human, and Enoch, the angel:

It is easy, then, to imagine that among the Jews of the Hijaz who were apparently involved in mystical speculations associated with the merkabah, Ezra, because of the traditions of his translation, because of his piety, and particularly because he was equated with Enoch as the Scribe of God, could be termed one of the Bene Elohim. And, of course, he would fit the description of religious leader (one of the ahbar of the Qur'an 9:31) whom the Jews had exalted

So Newby is trying to explain the verse by equating Ezra to Enoch, and angel. Now, "Benei Elohim" literally means "sons of God," and refer to angels, as described above. Nowhere is he saying that Jews referred to Ezra as "the Son of God." Also, as the reader can easily see, Newby is engaging in a rather convoluted train of thought to help him understand the verse not to assert that "the Jews" believe Ezra is "the Son of God."

Ibn Hazm

Next, we get another quote that appears to be the most damaging at first light:

"H. Z. Hirschberg proposed another assumption, based on the words of Ibn Hazm, namely, that the 'righteous who live in Yemen believed that 'Uzayr was indeed the son of Allah.' According to other Muslim sources, there were some Yemenite Jews who had converted to Islam who believed that Ezra was the messiah. For Muhammad, Ezra, the apostle (!) of messiah, can be seen in the same light as the Christian saw Jesus, the messiah, the son of Allah.[4]"

Let's look at the Quran again:

"The Jews call 'Uzair a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the son of Allah."

It doesn't say some Jews, it says "The" Jews.

Now, let's look at the quote. The quote speaks of Muslim converts not "The Jews"!

OK, even then, the text says "proposed another assumption" - so it is not a well-known conclusion among Jews, but an assumption. Second, it says, "based on the words of Ibn Hazm" - Ibn Hazm was a Muslim philosopher who was born in Spain 300 years after Mohammad. Using the words of a Muslim apologist to prove Islam without a fact basis is called circular reasoning.

George Sale (or Al-Baidawi)

OK, now the last major quote from George Sale, and 18th century orientalist. This quote, funny enough, actually looks to disprove the Quran by saying that it was not "The Jews," but "some ancient heterdox Jews, or else of some Jews of Medina" that declared Ezra were the Son of God. And it gets worse because it is not George Sale declaring this fact, rather he is repeating "the commentators" that "endeavour to support" the charge against the Jews. Who are the commentators? Let's go to the original source to find out who is claiming the Jews declared Ezra the Son of God. In the original source, you will find that George Sale footnotes Al Beidawi (Baidawi) making the claims. Who is Al Baidawi? A 13th century Muslim scholar (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baidawi). This 13th century scholar claims to know "this verse was read to the Jews and they did not contradict it." That's the best he has to offer. So, we are back to circular reasoning again because we see just hearsay by Muslim apologists and no new facts.

The conclusion: an error

So what are we left with? A bunch of smoke and mirrors from Muslim apologists. There is no proof from a single Jew in history that "The Jews" refer to Ezra as "the Son of God." Moreover, there is proof that ancient and modern Jews do not refer to Ezra as the Son of God. Thus, we can only conclude that the Quran is in error again.

Finally, if Allah was all-knowing, he would have created a perfect book. A perfect book would be timeless and always perfect. Thus, even if the Muslim apologists were correct, the Quran should've said, "some Jews at the time of Mohammad believed that Ezra could have been a son of God." The Quran is not perfect for two reasons, 1. It incorrectly asserts that "the Jews" believe Ezra to be "the son of God." 2. It is not timeless in its assertions. The Quran is just a book.

Interesting email from Yahoo

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Wed, 09 Jan 2008 16:56:00 +0000

Taking a break from the usual contradictions, horrors and mistakes in Islamic holy book to discuss a recent email I received from Yahoo.

Here's the background: I was surfing through Yahoo Answers, and saw a question by a 15 year old that was about to convert to Islam. If I remember correctly, the person was female. I immediately thought - oh no, a 15 year old girl is going to subject herself to life as a second class citizen, and risk death if she later decides to deconvert to an apostate (if she lives in the wrong country). So I wrote back to the question with quotes from the Quran and Hadith. So other than a few words here and there, I just quoted from Islamic "holy" books. Well, apparently, Islamic holy books violate Yahoo's terms of service as you'll see below, so Yahoo decided to delete my post. Well, now I know to continue my migration away from Yahoo to their competitors (this won't be hard since their site has been awfully slow lately). Here's the email (with my post included - oh, and the post was in paragraph form when I wrote it, but Yahoo Answers mangles everything):

Hello Silly Allah

You have posted content to Yahoo! Answers in violation of our Community Guidelines or Terms of Service. As a result, your content has been deleted. Community Guidelines help to keep Yahoo! Answers a safe and useful community, so we appreciate your consideration of its rules.

Question: Islam related question... Help me...?

Question Details: I am a 15 year old who is going to convert to is lslam in a few days... Cam any1 help me in explaining how to pray and purify oneself B4 praying?? thx a lot...

Deleted Answer: Are you ready to be beaten as a second-class citizen? 4:34 Men are the maintainers of women because Allah has made some of them to excel others and because they spend out of their property; the good women are therefore obedient, guarding the unseen as Allah has guarded; and (as to) those on whose part you fear desertion, admonish them, and leave them alone in the sleeping-places and BEAT THEM; then if they obey you, do not seek a way against them; surely Allah is High, Great. Do you like pedophiles? Sahih Bukhari Volume 7, Book 62, Number 64 Narrated 'Aisha: that the Prophet married her when she was SIX YEARS OLD and he consummated his marriage when she was NINE YEARS OLD, and then she remained with him for nine years (i.e., till his death). Sahih Bukhari Volume 8, Book 73, Number 151 Narrated 'Aisha: I used to PLAY WITH DOLLS in the presence of the Prophet, and my girl friends also used to play with me. When Allah's Apostle used to enter (my dwelling place) they used to hide themselves, but the Prophet would call them to join and play with me. (The playing with the dolls and similar images is forbidden, but it was allowed for 'Aisha at that time, as she was a little girl, not yet reached the age of puberty.) (Fateh-al-Bari page 143, Vol.13) Do you like violence? 9:5 Then when the Sacred Months have passed, then kill the Mushrikun {unbelievers} wherever you find them, and capture them and besiege them, and prepare for them each and every ambush. But if they repent and perform As-Salat (Iqamat-as-Salat {the Islamic ritual prayers}), and give Zakat {alms}, then leave their way free. Verily, Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful. 8:39. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and polytheism: i.e. worshipping others besides Allah) and the religion (worship) will all be for Allah Alone [in the whole of the world]. But if they cease (worshipping others besides Allah), then certainly, Allah is All-Seer of what they do. 8:67. It is not for a Prophet that he should have prisoners of war (and free them with ransom) until he had made a great slaughter (among his enemies) in the land. You desire the good of this world (i.e. the money of ransom for freeing the captives), but Allah desires (for you) the Hereafter. And Allah is All-Mighty, All-Wise. 9:29. Fight against those who believe not in Allah, nor in the Last Day, nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger and those who acknowledge not the religion of truth (i.e. Islam) among the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians), until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.

If you feel this content was removed in error, please contact Customer Care and tell us why.

Regards,
Yahoo! Customer Care

The inheritance mistake in detail - Part 4

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Wed, 09 Jan 2008 16:55:00 +0000

Usual responses to Quran inheritance math mistakes

Inheritance math mistakes are very cut and dry. The apologetic responses are, frankly, not very good here, which is why it's a good place to start in a logical discussion on Islam. Let me go further, I have shown just a fraction of the total math mistakes that exist here (go here for some more: http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Contra/i001.html and http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/sina/inheritance.htm ). Here's a fun one - what do you do for pregnant wife? Anyway, if you have an afternoon free, find some more on your own. I encourage you to do so and comment on this blog post.

Here are the standard responses:

You have not looked at all the verses. This is my favorite response because it actually opens up more issues. The other verses are 2:180-182, 2:233, 2:240, 4:33. None of them go through any math except for 2:240:

002.240
YUSUFALI: Those of you who die and leave widows should bequeath for their widows a year's maintenance and residence; but if they leave (The residence), there is no blame on you for what they do with themselves, provided it is reasonable. And Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise.
PICKTHAL: (In the case of) those of you who are about to die and leave behind them wives, they should bequeath unto their wives a provision for the year without turning them out, but if they go out (of their own accord) there is no sin for you in that which they do of themselves within their rights. Allah is Mighty, Wise.
SHAKIR: And those of you who die and leave wives behind, (make) a bequest in favor of their wives of maintenance for a year without turning (them) out, then if they themselves go away, there is no blame on you for what they do of lawful deeds by themselves, and Allah is Mighty, Wise.

So, if you include this verse in your calculations. You have to make sure that you leave behind one year's provisions for their wives. And now we have another contradiction! Remember, 4:12 is very detailed;

In what ye leave, their share is a fourth, if ye leave no child; but if ye leave a child, they get an eighth; after payment of legacies and debts.

So which is it, one year's provisions or 1/8? What if the 1/8 didn't include enough for even a fraction of a year? What if you had to take away a portion from somebody else to provide that one year provision? Well, you get a contradiction between verse 2:240 and 4:12.

Men should get more than women. This excuse is funny because, you may have noticed already, I don't bring this up as an issue. I just focus on the math mistake. However, I get this one a lot. My theory is that Muslims are just repeating apologetics without even listening to the issue.

Unfortunately for the Muslim, another contradiction pops up when taking this angle. 4:11 states:
as regards your Children's (Inheritance): to the male, a portion equal to that of two females:
So the men always get twice as much as the women according to silly Allah. First of all, I believe all readers can see that this makes no sense as a definitive rule for all times (simple example: the son is wealthy and the daughter is an extremely poor widow with 5 kids). Let's follow on, though, and see if there's another contradiction.

In 4:11, it says, "if only daughters, two or more, their share is two-thirds of the inheritance; if only one, her share is a half." What happens if there are sons? Do they get 4/3 and 2/2? You can quickly see the problems. What happens if there are sons and daughters? Say 1 son and 3 daughters.

3 daughters: 2/3
1 son: twice that of the female or 2 x ( (2/3)/3) = 4/9

Total = 10/9. Another contradiction!

I think you can see that it's possible to do this all day long. What about if it's the reverse, 3 sons and 1 daughter? It's not even clear because the verse seems to specify the split for just daughters, but we know that sons get twice that of daughters. You can clearly see, though, that the daughter will get nothing close to 1/2. More confusion!

Anything left over goes to the nearest male relative. This excuse is also funny because Muslims have stated this is a counterargument when my two simple cases were for situations where the opposite occurred (more than 100% given away). Anyway, this is the law of "Usbah" from the following Hadith:

Sahih Bukhari 8. 80. 724
Narrated Ibn 'Abbas:
The Prophet said, "Give the Fara'id (the shares of the inheritance that are prescribed in the Qur'an) to those who are entitled to receive it. Then whatever remains, should be given to the closest male relative of the deceased."

Before we take one step further, let's immediately recognize that the "perfect" Quran is again imperfect and therefore false. We have to go to the Hadith to find the answer because the Quran can't stand on its own.

If we continue, I'm sure the reader can come up with quick examples of unfairness and contradiction. For unfairness, imagine the widow has 5 children to support and will receive only 1/4 of the inheritance while the distant male relative (maybe even wealthy) receives 3 X that amount or 3/4! For a contradiction, imagine the case where there is only a widower - he should receive 1/2, but now has 2/2 because he also receives the remainder. This is a clear contradiction between the Quran and the Hadith.

You need to interpret properly. This one is a fallacy, and has already been discussed. Either the Quran is a word of a God and, therefore, perfect for all time or it's not. Additionally, in these inheritance verses, the Quran even states, "Allah makes clear to you." So we get one more contradiction...if three Muslims give three different answers and all three answers require changing the text of the Quran to make it work, well, then...Allah didn't make it clear.

The inheritance mistake in detail - Part 3

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Wed, 19 Dec 2007 18:00:00 +0000

The next mistake and more

Second math mistake

How would you split the inheritance if a woman dies, leaving behind a husband and a brother but no children or parents?
Husband: x%
Brother: y%

Let's go to the verses for an answer:
4:12 "In what your wives leave, your share is a half, if they leave no child"
Husband: 1/2

4:12 "If the man or woman whose inheritance is in question, has left neither ascendants nor descendants, but has left a brother or a sister, each one of the two gets a sixth; "
Brother: 1/6

4:176 "Allah directs (thus) about those who leave no descendants or ascendants as heirs. If it is a man that dies, leaving a sister but no child, she shall have half the inheritance: If (such a deceased was) a woman, who left no child, Her brother takes her inheritance"
Brother: 1/1 (100%)

So the final numbers are:
Husband: 1/2 or 50%
Brother: 7/6 or 117%, already over 100 because 176 and 12 contradict each other

One silly discussion I had with a Muslim ended up with him asserting that a wife was different than a woman. So his excuse for the Quran was that verse 12 refers to a wife and verse 176 refers to a woman. Hmmm, so a wife is not a woman in Islam? Seriously, if this were true, then why would it say "If (such a deceased was) a woman, who left no child"? There should be no reason to say "who left no child."

And there's more issue with these set of verses. Verse 176 directly contradicts 12 in that it provides a different inheritance for the brother when the woman has no parents or children...in one case it's 1/6 and in the other it's 6/6 or 100%. This second issue has been formally recognized by Muslims, and has been a source of significant debate(www.muslim.sh/text/hq/comm/mali/4/c4s2.shtml):

Commentators are of opinion that by a brother or a sister here is meant a brother or a sister on the mother’s side and that the case of real brothers and sisters, or brothers and sisters on the father’s side, is dealt with in v. 176 of this chapter. The reason for this is that here as well as in v. 176, the property to be inherited is that of a kalalah, and it is generally supposed that a kalalah is one who has neither parents nor children. But as a matter of fact kalalah bears two meanings. It means the person who has no children whether he has parents or not, and it also means the person who has neither children nor parents. It is derived from kalla which means he became tired or f a t i g u e d, and therefore its primary significance would be the person who has no c h i l d r e n. I‘Ab is reported to have explained this word as meaning one who does not leave offspring whether he leaves parents or not. ‘Umar also is reported to have said that kalalah is one who has no children, that is all; see Ghara’ib al-Qur’an. Hence it is more reasonable to take the kalalah spoken of here as being different from the kalalah spoken of in v. 176. The kalalahin the present case is one who has no children but has parents, and therefore the brothers and sisters are not the only heirs and their share is only one-sixth, while the kalalahspoken of in v. 176 is one who leaves neither children norparents, and therefore the brothers and the sisters take the whole of the inheritance.

Now if you had the patience to follow the apologetics, you will see that this author has decided that the same word, kalalah, has two different meanings for 12 and for 176. In 12, he decides (against all three translations that USC uses) that the prescriptions are for one that has parents and 176 refers only to one that has parents and children. While this has no basis in the translations, it still does not solve the problem that started this blog post.

You may have also noticed another solution proposed in that long bit of apologetics: "Commentators are of opinion that by a brother or a sister here is meant a brother or a sister on the mother’s side and that the case of real brothers and sisters, or brothers and sisters on the father’s side, is dealt with in v. 176 of this chapter. "

However, this solution still does not solve the problem starting the post, and actually causes more problems. Without going through the math, imagine dividing the inheritance among a many sisters from the mother's side and many "real" sisters from the father's side plus spouse and/or parent. You're over 100% pretty quickly.

All of this is quite funny when considering that 176 also states "Allah makes clear to you." Apparently silly Allah has quite a sense of humor.

More debunking of Muslim apologetics on the inheritance mistakes to come in the next post because I ran out of time and space here.

The inheritance mistake in detail - Part 2

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Mon, 19 Nov 2007 03:06:00 +0000

Two historical attempts at the mistake

Now, what happened when Muslims discovered the inheritance math mistake in the Quran? They needed to follow Sharia law in order to divide the inheritance, yet they took the Quran as divine with no mistakes. There could only have been two results: mass deconversion from Islam or "fixes" that allowed for peaceful division of the inherited property.

Al-Awl (or Aul)

Well, it turns out, I wasn't the first to discover this mistake. In fact, the 4th Caliph, Ali, saw it in 7th century A.D. His attempted fix, known as Al-Awl (or Aul), is basically a normalization. So, let's look at this example from the last post: A man dies and leaves behind 3 daughters, 2 parents and 2 wives. Let's see how Ali would change things (http://www.muslim.org/english-quran/quran.htm under section 4:11):

"The ‘aul was first legalized by ‘Ali, the fourth Caliph, who, being questioned about the share of a wife, the other heirs being the two parents and two daughters, gave the answer “without premeditation” that the wife’s one-eighth had become one-ninth, for the two parents should take one-third, the two daughters two-thirds, and the wife one-eighth, which make up nine-eighths, and hence ‘Ali decided that each of the heirs should take less than was due,
so that the proportion might remain the same "

Now, keeping in mind that nowhere in the Quran does it say to normalize, let's look at the resultant math:

Quran's literal words give a total of 9/8:

3 daughters: 2/3
2 parents: 1/3
2 wives: 1/8

Using Al-Awl rules to normalize, you get:

3 daughters: 16/27
2 parents: 8/27
2 wives: 1/9

The first set of numbers were multiplied by 8/9 so that the total could equal 100%. That's it folks. A quick fix with no basis in the Quran.

Residues and Remainders

Another idea was to take remainders after each calculation. Let me be more clear by quoting from the same Muslim website above:

"In this case the parents first take their respective shares,
and the residue goes to the children, if there are any, failing which, the share of the
parents is increased. "

So, instead of following the Quran literally, that "Allah makes clear to you," Muslims invented words that didn't exist in the 4:11, 4:12 and 4:176 of the Quran...specifically, "first take" and "residue." There is no mention of order in the Quran's inheritance calculation, nor is there a mention of residue. Just for fun, let's go through the calculation:

2 parents first: 1/3, then daughters? No, actually, those who follow this fix actually calculate the 2 wives first at 1/8 total. Yes, I know that the wives are mentioned in a whole other (later) verse, so it's even sillier for them to get their share first but so be it. OK, so now, we've given away 1/3 + 1/8 = 11/24, leaving a balance of 13/24. Now, the daughters get their 2/3 of 13/24 = 13/36. In summary:

3 daughters: 13/36
2 parents: 1/3
2 wives: 1/8

Now, 13/36 + 1/3 + 1/8 = 59/72 <1 style="font-style: italic;" size="2">"The balance (i.e., 1-59/72 = 13/72) shall be given to the person bequeathed by the deceased; in the absence of such a person, it shall be given to the closest male relative of the deceased; in the absence of such a relative, the balance shall be distributed as per the regulations of the state of residence of the deceased."
I interpret this to mean "we don't know because we just made up the fix anyway." LOL Seriously, there is still a math problem, and, I imagine, some very angry relatives.

Let's revisit this fix. An order was added to the calculation whereby shares were taken of residues rather than the whole. However, this solution also has no basis in the Quran. Nowhere does it say to follow a particular order, especially in reverse of how shares are presented in the Quran (children first, then parents, then wives as opposed to parents and wives then children in the fix).

Islamic Math Mistakes With Fixes

Now, even if we were to accept the fixes, and even if we believed that the justification (of which there is none within the "perfect" Quran). Are we still left with a contradiction? Yes. Simply put, the followers of said fixes are not following the perfect Quran. Muslims who you debate actually know this, and will therefore refuse to give you the final percentages in a debate. If they do, go through this:

"4:11 says "if only daughters, two or more, their share is two-thirds of the inheritance," does it not?"

The answer: yes

"OK, well you're giving those 3 daughters in this example 16/27 or 13/26 (depending on which fix they're using). Doesn't that violate the Quran?"

The answer: uhh...but...uhh...you have to calculate shares after normalizing (or based on residues).

"OK, but the Quran never says to calculate shares after normalizing (or based on residues). In fact, there isn't even a word that is close to normalizing (or residues, nor any mention of order in the calculation). Let's return to 4:11..."

And so the debate will go on ad infinitum. The point stays though - silly Allah can't do math.

In the next post, I will go through some of the other rebuttals and lead into more inheritance mistakes.

The inheritance mistake in detail - Part 1

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Sun, 18 Nov 2007 05:23:00 +0000

The verses

There are a number of verses that tell Muslims how to manage inheritance: 2:180, 2:233, 2:240, 4:12, 4:13, 4:176 and 5:106. However, the verses that go through the detailed mathematics are 4:12, 4:13, and 4:176:

004.011
YUSUFALI: Allah (thus) directs you as regards your Children's (Inheritance): to the male, a portion equal to that of two females: if only daughters, two or more, their share is two-thirds of the inheritance; if only one, her share is a half. For parents, a sixth share of the inheritance to each, if the deceased left children; if no children, and the parents are the (only) heirs, the mother has a third; if the deceased Left brothers (or sisters) the mother has a sixth. (The distribution in all cases ('s) after the payment of legacies and debts. Ye know not whether your parents or your children are nearest to you in benefit. These are settled portions ordained by Allah; and Allah is All-knowing, Al-wise.
PICKTHAL: Allah chargeth you concerning (the provision for) your children: to the male the equivalent of the portion of two females, and if there be women more than two, then theirs is two-thirds of the inheritance, and if there be one (only) then the half. And to each of his parents a sixth of the inheritance, if he have a son; and if he have no son and his parents are his heirs, then to his mother appertaineth the third; and if he have brethren, then to his mother appertaineth the sixth, after any legacy he may have bequeathed, or debt (hath been paid). Your parents and your children: Ye know not which of them is nearer unto you in usefulness. It is an injunction from Allah. Lo! Allah is Knower, Wise.
SHAKIR: Allah enjoins you concerning your children: The male shall have the equal of the portion of two females; then if they are more than two females, they shall have two-thirds of what the deceased has left, and if there is one, she shall have the half; and as for his parents, each of them shall have the sixth of what he has left if he has a child, but if he has no child and (only) his two parents inherit him, then his mother shall have the third; but if he has brothers, then his mother shall have the sixth after (the payment of) a bequest he may have bequeathed or a debt; your parents and your children, you know not which of them is the nearer to you in usefulness; this is an ordinance from Allah: Surely Allah is Knowing, Wise.

004.012
YUSUFALI: In what your wives leave, your share is a half, if they leave no child; but if they leave a child, ye get a fourth; after payment of legacies and debts. In what ye leave, their share is a fourth, if ye leave no child; but if ye leave a child, they get an eighth; after payment of legacies and debts. If the man or woman whose inheritance is in question, has left neither ascendants nor descendants, but has left a brother or a sister, each one of the two gets a sixth; but if more than two, they share in a third; after payment of legacies and debts; so that no loss is caused (to any one). Thus is it ordained by Allah; and Allah is All-knowing, Most Forbearing.
PICKTHAL: And unto you belongeth a half of that which your wives leave, if they have no child; but if they have a child then unto you the fourth of that which they leave, after any legacy they may have bequeathed, or debt (they may have contracted, hath been paid). And unto them belongeth the fourth of that which ye leave if ye have no child, but if ye have a child then the eighth of that which ye leave, after any legacy ye may have bequeathed, or debt (ye may have contracted, hath been paid). And if a man or a woman have a distant heir (having left neither parent nor child), and he (or she) have a brother or a sister (only on the mother's side) then to each of them twain (the brother and the sister) the sixth, and if they be more than two, then they shall be sharers in the third, after any legacy that may have been bequeathed or debt (contracted) not injuring (the heirs by willing away more than a third of the heritage) hath been paid. A commandment from Allah. Allah is Knower, Indulgent.
SHAKIR: And you shall have half of what your wives leave if they have no child, but if they have a child, then you shall have a fourth of what they leave after (payment of) any bequest they may have bequeathed or a debt; and they shall have the fourth of what you leave if you have no child, but if you have a child then they shall have the eighth of what you leave after (payment of) a bequest you may have bequeathed or a debt; and if a man or a woman leaves property to be inherited by neither parents nor offspring, and he (or she) has a brother or a sister, then each of them two shall have the sixth, but if they are more than that, they shall be sharers in the third after (payment of) any bequest that may have been bequeathed or a debt that does not harm (others); this is an ordinance from Allah: and Allah is Knowing, Forbearing.

004.176
YUSUFALI: They ask thee for a legal decision. Say: Allah directs (thus) about those who leave no descendants or ascendants as heirs. If it is a man that dies, leaving a sister but no child, she shall have half the inheritance: If (such a deceased was) a woman, who left no child, Her brother takes her inheritance: If there are two sisters, they shall have two-thirds of the inheritance (between them): if there are brothers and sisters, (they share), the male having twice the share of the female. Thus doth Allah make clear to you (His law), lest ye err. And Allah hath knowledge of all things.
PICKTHAL: They ask thee for a pronouncement. Say: Allah hath pronounced for you concerning distant kindred. If a man die childless and he have a sister, hers is half the heritage, and he would have inherited from her had she died childless. And if there be two sisters, then theirs are two-thirds of the heritage, and if they be brethren, men and women, unto the male is the equivalent of the share of two females. Allah expoundeth unto you, so that ye err not. Allah is Knower of all things.
SHAKIR: They ask you for a decision of the law. Say: Allah gives you a decision concerning the person who has neither parents nor offspring; if a man dies (and) he has no son and he has a sister, she shall have half of what he leaves, and he shall be her heir she has no son; but if there be two (sisters), they shall have two-thirds of what he leaves; and if there are brethren, men and women, then the male shall have the like of the portion of two females; Allah makes clear to you, lest you err; and Allah knows all things.

Here, I have included all the translations so that there is no discrepancy in understanding. While we're on this point, please note the last line of the last verse:
"Allah makes clear to you, lest you err; and Allah knows all things."
OK, so let's all remember that Allah makes it all clear to you because he knows all things. So, if we notice that three Muslims give three different answers (and they will), then there must be another contradiction...simply that Allah is not clear after all.

The Math and the mistake

So let's go back to the original question:

Now, calculate how to split the inheritance for a man how dies and leaves behind: 3 daughters, 2 parents and two wives.

3 daughters: x%
2 parents: y%
2 wives: z%

Here's the answer with the supporting quotes.

3 daughters: 2/3
4:11 : "if only daughters, 2 or more, their share is 2/3 of the inheritance"

2 parents: 1/6+1/6=1/3
4:11 : "For parents, a 1/6 share of the inheritance to each, if the deceased left children"

2 wives: 1/8
4:12 : "in what ye leave, their share is 1/4, if ye leave no child; but if ye leave a child, they get an 1/8"

Now, let's add up the inheritance divisions up:
2/3+1/3+1/8 = 9/8 >1

Mistake! Allah can't do math. How can you possibly give away more inheritance than you have? Now, I pointed out just one math mistake, but there are many. In the next set of posts I will go through the typical, albeit false, objections to Islamic mathematics.

The mathematical, scientific and historical errors

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Thu, 15 Nov 2007 09:28:00 +0000

There are almost too many errors and contradictions in the Quran from which non-Muslims must choose. Here is my favorite opening salvo when messaging a Muslim:

"1. Let's start with a mathematical mistake. This one is best to do on your own so that you can see the problems yourself. Go to the inheritance verses (4:11, 4:12 and 4:176), read them here: http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/004.qmt.html

Now, calculate how to split the inheritance for a man how dies and leaves behind: 3 daughters, 2 parents and two wives. It should take about 15 minutes.

3 daughters: x%
2 parents: y%
2 wives: z%

--------------

2. Historical mistake. The Quran plagiarizes much of the Bible. In the process of copying, sometimes Mohammad and his buddies got creative. In the following example, their creativity caused them to leave behind an obvious historical error. From the story of Joseph...

Here's the Bible:

40:18 Then Joseph answered and said, "This is its interpretation: the three baskets are three days;

40:19 within three more days Pharaoh will lift up your head from you and will hang you on a tree, and the birds will eat your flesh off you."

Now, here's the Quran (different translations listed below to make it easy):
012.041
YUSUFALI: "O my two companions of the prison! As to one of you, he will pour out the wine for his lord to drink: as for the other, he will hang from the cross, and the birds will eat from off his head. (so) hath been decreed that matter whereof ye twain do enquire"...
PICKTHAL: O my two fellow-prisoners! As for one of you, he will pour out wine for his lord to drink; and as for the other, he will be crucified so that the birds will eat from his head. Thus is the case judged concerning which ye did inquire.
SHAKIR: O my two mates of the prison! as for one of you, he shall give his lord to drink wine; and as for the other, he shall be crucified, so that the birds shall eat from his head, the matter is decreed concerning which you inquired.

Did you see the difference? The Bible talked about decapitation followed by hanging. The Quran talked about crucifixion. That's where the error occurs. You see, archaeologists point out 6th century BC Persia as the earliest occurrence of crucifixion, yet the story of Joseph was over 10 centuries before that. The ancient Egyptians did not do crucifixion before the Roman's brought the practice over. Mohammad should be more careful when he plagiarizes.

------------------------

3. How about another obvious one. You see Mohammad knew that the Christians believed in a son of god, so he assumed the Jews did too:

009.030
YUSUFALI: The Jews call 'Uzair a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the son of Allah. That is a saying from their mouth; (in this) they but imitate what the unbelievers of old used to say. Allah's curse be on them: how they are deluded away from the Truth!
PICKTHAL: And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah, and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah. That is their saying with their mouths. They imitate the saying of those who disbelieved of old. Allah (Himself) fighteth against them. How perverse are they!
SHAKIR: And the Jews say: Uzair is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!

Mistake! Find me a Jew that talks about Ezra. You can't. Especially one that talks about Ezra being the son of god. You see, the Jews find the whole son of god thing to be blasphemous. They would not say it. Another Quran mistake."

There is enough here to start a conversation. In the next set of posts, I will go through the common counterarguments from Muslims and show you why they are false. First the Quran inheritance mistakes.

Violent sexism and wife beating in Islam - Part 2

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Mon, 12 Nov 2007 06:32:00 +0000

Mohammad found wife beating quite alright, almost a fan you might say. Let's go to the Hadith: (read it carefully, a wife is bruised so green that she matches her clothing, but it is ok...Mohammad actually criticizes the woman in the end!). A thank you to answering-islam.org for finding it.

"Narrated Ikrima: 'Rifaa divorced his wife whereupon Abdur-Rahman married her. Aisha said that the lady came wearing a green veil and complained to her (Aisha) and showed her a green spot on her skin caused by the beating. It was the habit of ladies to support each other, so when Allah's messenger came, Aisha said, "I have not seen any woman suffering as the believing women. Look! Her skin is greener than her clothes! When Abdur-Rahman heard that his wife had gone to the prophet, he came with his two sons from another wife. She said, "By Allah! I have done no wrong to him, but he is impotent and is as useless to me as this," holding and showing the fringe of her garment. Abdur-Rahman said, "By Allah, O Allah's messenger! She has told a lie. I am very strong and can satisfy her, but she is disobedient and wants to go back to Rifaa." Allah's messenger said to her, "If that is your intention, then know that it is unlawful for you to remarry Rifaa unless Abdur-Rahman has had sexual intercourse with you." The prophet saw two boys with Abdur-Rahman and asked (him), "Are these your sons?" On that Abdur-Rahman said, "Yes." The prophet said, "You claim what you claim (that he is impotent)? But by Allah, these boys resemble him as a crow resembles a crow.""

Notice that the believing women suffer more than the rest. They get green bruises, but the prophet is ok with it.

Violent sexism and wife beating in Islam

noreply@blogger.com (Silly Allah) — Sun, 11 Nov 2007 00:08:00 +0000

Battered Saudi TV Host, Ranya Al-Baz and Abusive Husband

Posted Nov 14, 2005

A glimpse into women's rights in Saudi Arabia.

As I said in an earlier post, a great way to get a Muslim woman thinking is by starting with Mohammad's pedophilia or Islam's violent sexism. Muslim's will generally deny the first (in the face of all evidence), but eventually succumb to the existence of sexism although twisting and turning with respect to the violent aspect.

General sexism

The sexism is obvious, as can be found in the Skeptics Annotated Quran's section on Women. It's quite a long list, here is a subset of really loony verses:

A woman is worth one-half a man. 2:282 ; and males are to inherit twice that of females. 4:11
Lewd women are to be confined to their houses until death. 4:15 ; but the wives of Mohammad will be punished double for lewdness! 33:30
You can't have sex with married women, unless they are slaves obtained in war (with whom you may rape or do whatever you like). 4:24
Don't pray if you are drunk, dirty, or have touched a woman lately. 4:43
A husband can accuse his wife of adultery with only one witness. 24:6
The wives of Mohammad are not like other women. They must not leave their houses. 33:32-33 [a little controlling, aren't we Mohammad?] ; oh, and Allah says it is lawful for Muhammad to marry any women he wants. 33:50-51
If men must speak to Muhammad's wives they must speak from behind a curtain. And no one must ever marry one of his wives. 33:53

These are just nutty (now we know what Mohammad liked fair, young virgins with wide eyes):

The single-minded slaves of Allah will enjoy a Garden filled with lovely-eyed virgins. 37:40-48
Allah will reward faithful Muslims after they die with "fair ones with wide, lovely eyes." 44:54
Those in the Garden will be attended by immortal youths with wide, lovely eyes. 56:17-23

Most of us are aware of this one:

Believing women must lower their gaze and be modest, cover themselves with veils, and not reveal themselves except to their husbands, relatives, children, and slaves. 24:31

But not everybody is aware of this one:

Men are in charge of women, because Allah made men to be better than women. Refuse to have sex with women from whom you fear rebellion, and scourge them. 4:34

Wife beating

The last verse mentioned is responsible for some horrific domestic violence, so let's examine further with the full translation:

004.034
YUSUFALI: Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has given the one more (strength) than the other, and because they support them from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient, and guard in (the husband's) absence what Allah would have them guard. As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (Next), refuse to share their beds, (And last) beat them (lightly); but if they return to obedience, seek not against them Means (of annoyance): For Allah is Most High, great (above you all).
PICKTHAL: Men are in charge of women, because Allah hath made the one of them to excel the other, and because they spend of their property (for the support of women). So good women are the obedient, guarding in secret that which Allah hath guarded. As for those from whom ye fear rebellion, admonish them and banish them to beds apart, and scourge them. Then if they obey you, seek not a way against them. Lo! Allah is ever High, Exalted, Great.
SHAKIR: Men are the maintainers of women because Allah has made some of them to excel others and because they spend out of their property; the good women are therefore obedient, guarding the unseen as Allah has guarded; and (as to) those on whose part you fear desertion, admonish them, and leave them alone in the sleeping-places and beat them; then if they obey you, do not seek a way against them; surely Allah is High, Great.

For those doubters, I bolded the key parts. If you fear disloyalty, desertion or rebellion...beat your wives (of course after admonishing them and not sleeping with them). Now, in Yusuf Ali's version, the word "lightly" is added, but this was added for palatability not because the word is actually there. In the video at the top, you can see how "lightly" some are beaten.

In fact, the word in the Quran in 4:34 used for "beat" is "idreb". It is a conjugate of the word "daraba" which primarily means "to beat, strike, to hit" - Hans Wehr Dictionary of Modern Written Arabic, page 538.

Here is a Quranic verse in which "idreb" is used:

8:12 - ""Strike" off their heads, "strike" off the very tips of their fingers!"

Don't believe the Muslim apologists. In the next post, I'll go through what Mohammad actually thought when "revealing" the Quran.