PriusChat Forums - Gen II Prius Main Forum

Gen II Driving Impression (1st year)

PriusTech — Sun, 27 May 2012 20:03:36 GMT

After driving my Prius for over a year now here's my impression of the car.

Overall I really like this car but it doesn't quite live up to the image of what I thought it was. The gas mileage is the best but there are some negative issues.

The stereo feels like the worst controls in the industry. There's 3 separate sets of controls many of which do the same thing. The wheel controls, display controls and stereo face controls. And with all those controls you can't even just look down and see what station you are on, you have to press a button to bring up the display. All those square inches on the face of the stereo unused for any display. The steering wheel buttons are also hard to use. I have calluses from my profession and the bumps used to differentiate buttons are too small to easily feel.

The shifter has similar problems to the stereo. Having two separate controls to achieve what traditional shifters do with one causes problems. Having a control that does not stay in different positions, that moves back to the same position every time, means that you can not tell what gear you are in by feel. You have to look down at the display. With a conventional shifter you don't have to look down, you can tell what gear you are in by feel. Hopefully you learn to do all shifting by instinct and you don't have to think about shifting to do it. But a lifetime of using conventional shifters means you have to start from scratch when driving a Prius. Hopefully during this learning curve you aren't exposed in a life or death sudden decision event.

Same problems with the heater controls. Compare to a 1991 Civic where you can reach down and feel the controls and know exactly what is engaged. Not only can you not feel where the Prius heater is at, you can't just look down and see. Just like the stereo you have to press a button and wait for the display to come up. I don't like auto mode because the sudden and random engagement of full speed fan force is not desirable. The most often used controls when you are not in auto mode is fan speed and mode which have no steering wheel buttons. While the stuff that's rarely used do have buttons.

The display seems to waste screen space. The energy and consumption screens could be condensed into one screen and still probably have a strip at bottom and top to display the heater and stereo. IOW all features on one screen and not having to toggle between displays. Another possibility would be for the relevant screen to come up just by touching the same control without having a button just to bring up the screen.

Many of these complaints maybe are generic to digital controls in general. They are modern and seemingly more aesthetic but when it comes to use they are not always as functional. It seems though that modern technology should strive to be a real improvement and not just an image of one.

The other control/display complaint is no tach and no engine temperature, while not absolutely necessary, after years of having them they are missed. This will corrected with a scan gauge.

It's a given that with a high mileage vehicle you sacrifice power performance but why not have better handling? My 1991 Civic would beat the 2nd Gen Prius in the curves. The main problem is the non-independent rear suspension. I don't think the Prius would beat the Civic on the skid pad G's it just doesn't hold the freeway entrance ramps the same. And the body roll is also more than you would expect. Stiffer sway bars will fix the excessive roll but that's going to make the rear even more non-independent.

Lastly is performance issues. The mileage is really affected by ambient temp. I lose 5mpg or more going summer to winter. This vehicle really needs some temperature controlled louvers to shut off the airflow going to the radiator. I bet this could be realized for less expense than the coolant thermos bottle which gives marginal payback depending on what kind of driving you do.

That and some kind of indicator to know when you are getting into the actual brakes. When slowing down you want all the energy to go into regen. How do you know how hard to press the pedal when coming to a stop? Many times driving conditions dictate stopping as quickly as possible but still not going past regen into the actual brakes. Maybe there's something I haven't learned yet about how this works.

Lastly is visibility. I'm short and it seems like the seat is too low. I'm going to have to do the Corolla seat mod to achieve proper seat position. It may be just my imagination but compared to the Civic I think I've attempted lane changes when a car is there more often due to visibility issues. Looking at the glass the little black strip of cosmetic paint overhangs from the trim by 1/2" in front and 3/8" in back. I've also had the A-pillar plastic trim off and it does not come very close to the metal. So you are losing up to an inch of visibility around the pillars just for cosmetic reasons. In an intersection this is enough to hide a pedestrian and I find myself shifting head and body position just to always check.

Overall I still really like this car and wouldn't trade it for anything but a Prius C, and these complaints are mute since this car is no longer produced. But I think Toyota is sometimes too driven by the engineers just wanting to make something that's different and complex, and not something that puts practicality and functionality as a top priority.

Is this the end?

speedyroo — Fri, 25 May 2012 22:56:16 GMT

I have had my Prius since it was a little sprout with just 20miles on it. Now it has 111,573. Maybe more than that. I know it's 111,000 something. I drive it about 3-4 times a week. I have chosen to walk to my train station instead of driving to it in order to reduce my carbon footprint.

Anyway for the last month or so I've noticed when I start the Prius up that I'd go about 300yards and the hybrid battery would go down to one bar. It kinda freaked me out but then a little further it'd be back to normal and for the rest of the day that I drive it, it's fine.

Until today. I hadn't driven it since Monday or Sunday and went to get into it this afternoon and it was DEAD. More dead than it's ever been. Now I've left a light on or something before but even then there's SOME life - like it'd turn on and give me a or the mechanisms are slower. I get a jump. Not today. It didn't turn on, nothing on the car worked at all - I couldn't unlock doors.

I live across the street from a mom & pop garage that's been here for 70+ years so I asked if they could give me a jump (they have before!) It was a mess because my driveway is so narrow the guy had to drive on the lawn. It was really tight but we got it jumped. It turned on.

I noticed that the hybrid battery monitor was acting erratic. But it was on. I thought all I'd need to do was drive it and get the juices flowing. So I started to drive it and after a few ft the light came on. Crap. I got to a gas station and filled up. I turned the car on and the light AND the "check engine" light was on. Double crap.

I immediately drove to the dealers (about 7 miles) and they just barely took my car. I explained my car is having a midlife crisis and all my lights are on. They told me that since I didn't have an appt to come back on Tuesday.

Um, no. I could feel the car laboring trying to get over 45mph. I am NOT going home!

So my poor Prius is sitting at the dealer's for the weekend. They said they MIGHT be able to call me tomorrow and tell me what's up with it. I'm kind of thinking it's the hybrid battery and that it's met its expiration date.

The Prius is due for for brake pads, tires, and an oil change (in a few miles) so this might get costly......................no longer under warranty.

last day Michelin $70 rebate, tire rack $25 off X-Ice

cnschult — Thu, 24 May 2012 22:37:21 GMT

4 Michelin X-Ice Xi2 185 65 15 $95 clearance to $70 = $280
shipping of 4 tires $42
4 Moda 15" black with machined accents wheels $88 clearance to $59 = $236 (and they're only 14.6 lbs!!)
shipping of 4 wheels $41
free mounting, balancing, hub-centric rings, lug nuts, lug spline

total price $599.18, 3% ebates cash rebate coming back to me, $70 michelin rebate coming back to me (ends today!!!!!), total price will eventually be $511

even if your winter tires are still good, you could probably buy just the tires and resell them in November for a handsome profit.

BTW, I've upgraded to touring wheels for the summer and will accept offers on my 15" gen II wheels, they're not perfect but nice enough to use for your winter set (paint is all intact but starting to bubble here and there). I have all 4 trim rings but missing 3 center caps,

2006 Prius main hybrid battery being replaced (under warranty) after inverter pump failure

EmilyRambo — Thu, 24 May 2012 21:35:34 GMT

My 2006 Prius (72k miles) died without warning while driving on local interstate two weeks ago. No warning lights, just black console, no power at all. Thankfully I was in the right lane and was able to glide it over to the shoulder safely. Had AAA tow to my local shop that I use. After replacing the (very expensive) 12-volt battery, they found blown fuse, replaced it, then the auxiliary water pump (inverter pump) started to smoke. It was bad and had to be replaced. Found out later (from searching this site) that this was a recalled part, definitely have to log on here more.

Last couple of days have noticed that the battery meter is showing low when I start the car, and meter goes from full to low & vice versa very quickly. Other than that, no warning lights until this morning, when a slew of them came on all at once (red triangle, check engine, VSC, tire pressure). Pulled over and, per the manual, found that it's not safe to drive in this condition. AAA came to my rescue again, and dealer says main hybrid battery has to be replaced. Will take a day to get part, giving me a loaner in the mean time.

My main question is whether there's anything else I should be concerned about going wrong after these failures, that I should have them check while they have it? I'm not a car person, a friend told me that running with a bad battery (normal cars, not necessarily hybrids) can cause strain on other related parts, for instance the alternator may go soon after.

Am I wrong in thinking that these are all related? That the bad inverter pump caused the 12-volt battery to die, as well as (maybe) the problem with the hybrid battery?

Thanks!

VSC(!) light car switches to Neutral- Danger Danger

Drmom21 — Thu, 24 May 2012 20:37:02 GMT

For the past year or so now under many different driving speeds, mainly 45-65mph and only on flat roads with varied temperatures (so basically nothing out of the ordinary).... The vsc light (!) goes off - system says pull over and reset the parking brake....as it simaltaiiously shuts off the A/C and switches the car into NEUTRAL!!! Not cool when driving at ANY speed!!!!! Let alone the couple times I was on the highway doing 55 and had to cross lanes of traffic with a car in neutral. Every time this happens I have reported and taken my car to the same dealer where I purchased (and have had service) it. The last time they had it they replaced 3 computers that they thought were miscommunicating to each other ( I got charged for two and they absorbed man hours and gave me a loaner car for the week they had it). After that it did fine until TODAY 5/24/12!! It did it AGAIN!!!!!! Now what ? I called them and they want me to bring it in again.... Yes again I will get a loaner but after already having spent $1800 I hesitate to see what the next round of educated guesses will do to my wallet. HELP ME SOMEONE PLEASSSSSSE

Tire Review - Goodyear Viva Assurance Fuel Max

stevemcelroy — Thu, 24 May 2012 16:27:51 GMT

Hey all- Just got new tires so I figure that I would leave my opinion on the old ones for those in the market.

The OEM Integrities got me through the first 44,142 miles. They still had a tiny bit of usable tread, but I decided to forgo the last little bit of tread as it was November and I wanted something decent for winter.

I remember researching all of the LRR options and it seemed like Goodyear's Authority Fuel Max tires were a good option. There were a few different versions but I was told by a few sources that all had the same construction and materials and the only difference was the tread pattern. Given this I just went with the least expensive version - the Viva's which are sold through Walmart.

At the beginning I was impressed - ride and handling were good as was traction in the rain and snow. I had then rotated every 5,000 miles or so when I had oil changes done. Mileage was about the same as with the OEM tires and I was happy with that.

Everything was fine until recently - the tires were wearing much faster than anticipated - I went from 5mm to 3 over the course of 1 oil change. The final tally on miles driven was just 33,218 - just better than half of what the tires had been rated at.

So - I was happy enough with mpg, ride and handling and traction, but based on just how quickly they wore out I would not recommend them.

The new tires are Yokohama Avid Touring-S. I know that I will sacrifice a touch of mpg, but they seemed to be one of the best rated all around tired for under $100 each installed. So far, so good - the ride and handling are terrific, even with the tires inflated at 41/40.

Cost recovered: Just a reminder of why it's worth it

efusco — Thu, 24 May 2012 15:28:05 GMT

I have 125,000 miles on my '04 Prius.
I get about 55mpg (a bit higher, but being conservative) over the life of the car.

I replaced a 12mpg Ford Expedition in Oct. 2003 with the Prius.

I've used 8145 gallons LESS fuel in the Prius than I would have used had I simply gotten another Expedition.

At $3/gallon average fuel cost over those 8 1/2 years I've saved ~$24,450 in gas cost.

I paid right at $24,000 for my Prius, cash, in October 2003.

I STILL love this car!

problems with Optima D51 yellowtop

LIPriusFreak — Thu, 24 May 2012 13:47:14 GMT

been having problems with my optima yellowtop that is less than 1 year old. Sometimes my car starts fine, sometimes it won't until I jump it.

Spoke to Bernie from elearnaid (who I bought it from) and he says with my short driving habits (10min to work, 10min home) that the battery isn't getting a full charge from my engine because of the short commute...

also now my immobilizer (smart key) won't unlock doors without using keyfob or start car without keyfob in slot...

he told me to trickle charge it for 18-36 hrs...

anyone had this with an optima?

I have an 06 prius fully loaded

As our Prius Car ages?

shaneprius2005 — Thu, 24 May 2012 00:33:58 GMT

So based on reports here and online how have the traction batteries been holding up in the second generation Prius? Are the replacement of these batteries still low on average? Recently I purchased an 05' Prius, produced in Feb, 05', with 117,000, and it's in great condition, having all the recalls performed as well as all maintenance per the manual. Just wondering if I can get many more years out of the traction battery if it is taken care of? I know this is a tough question to answer but one I think about. Maybe I should be less worried since I live in Pa were the weather never gets really hot. Plus I don't travel many hills. I've read hills, hot temps, and a clogged fan can cause the traction battery to fail. OK I guess I've covered enough info for now LOL. :)

how much are my 15" wheels worth

cnschult — Wed, 23 May 2012 23:48:13 GMT

I've upgraded to touring wheels so i'm trying to figure out if its worth selling my 15" prius wheels, they have no sensors but do have trim rings, only one out of four center caps has survived. They are in good shape considering they are 8 years old, perfect for someone with a touring model to throw on winter rubber such as blizzak or X-Ice.

what is a fair member to member price before I charge for actual shipping?

I plan to sell them in the correct forum later, just want to get an approx idea to see if its worth it.

Traction Battery Maximum Temperature

semperego — Wed, 23 May 2012 19:30:34 GMT

Question 1: What is the maximum acceptable temperature for the Traction Battery?

Question 2: What is the optimum MAX temperature battery necessary to keep the Traction Battery in good shape?

Question 3: Are there any public logs regarding the temperature variations for PHEV Prius 2 Gen?

Can a non SKS Fob be used in an SKS Prius?

SageBrush — Tue, 22 May 2012 15:22:51 GMT

I have lost one of two SKS fobs for my 2004 Prius. Since the second fob is used very infrequently, I am debating whether I should pay the $100 premium for an SKS replacement. Two questions:

1. Will a new non SKS fob work after programming ?
2. If I subsequently lose my remaining SKS fob, will the non SKS fob be an adequate first key to program another key ?

... I realize the programming is of the car and not the key, pardon the inaccuracy in language.

Roof Rack Spacing

Victoria Bruce — Tue, 22 May 2012 02:25:35 GMT

There are logs of discussions about roof racks on a Prius, but I haven't seen anyone discuss the spacing of the bars.

We have a pair of Yakima racks and Q towers which were purchased specifically for the 07 Prius. They fit fine, but Yakima specifies that the front one is to be 10" back from the windshield, and the back one 30" behind that - quite close together.

This means that for my 16' kayak, the boat wobbles a lot more than I like and needs to be tied tightly front and back.

The roof is more like 60" long, so there is lots more room to spread them out. The boat would be a lot more stable if I put one bar close to the front, and the other close to the back, like I did with my previous cars. It seems like the roof edge would be stronger closer to the supports beside the windshield and back window.

Does anyone know why the spec is to put them so close together ? Has anyone tried a wider spacing ?

HELP needed in making a decision on a used 2008 prius

aragon — Mon, 21 May 2012 20:26:54 GMT

Love the discussion here and learn a lot.

I am in the market for a used prius and came across a 2009 prius on craigslist, which I test drove. I havent owned a prius before, but I loved the car overall. It is loaded with leather, nav, bluetooth etc. (I think it is with package #6). KBB costs it at about 19k.

I have three questions:
* The average mileage that this seller has gotten in 36 mpg, which was a huge surprise to me! Granted this is in SFO with hills, etc. but this seems to be a huge red flag to me. Any thoughts on whether this is a systemic issue with the vehicle vs just bad driving?
* The car has about 45k miles, which is on the lower side. However other cars with much higher miles (70k to 110k) go for around 12 to 14k, and am curious why the price difference is so high with higher miles
* There was a clapping sound when I braked hard, and slight rattling, should I be worried (is this indicative of a bigger problem)?

Thanks in advance for all the insights and tips.

Disable keyfob alarm in 2009?

tundrwd — Mon, 21 May 2012 13:17:38 GMT

I've got a real problem with my keyfob alarm in my '09 Prius. It goes off with the slightest touch many times. This morning, it went off twice, just dropping the keyfob on the bed, from a height of 4-6".

Once it starts, the ONLY way to stop it is to run out to the vehicle, and start it. Pressing the alarm button doesn't do it, opening/unlocking the door doesn't do it. Turning ACC on doesn't do it - MUST start the car is the only way it stops.

I'm really tired of this. How can I disable the keyfob alarm? Battery has been replaced in the keyfob (both), etc.