We know there are lots of choices when you buy a Brazilian jiu-jitsu gi. There are so many options out there that very elaborate rating systems have emerged for ranking gi choices, most notably by Aesopian.

Recently a good friend of the FightWorks Podcast recounted his recent success selling some very expensive BJJ gis on ebay. Even after wearing these gis for a while in training, he was still able to make a profit over the original price he paid for them!

So this week’s question is about your comfort level in buying someone else’s gi from them. Let’s face it: gis can get funky, sometimes they might attract an occasional bloodstain (hopefully your own blood, but gross nonetheless). But as my buddy’s story shows, there are definitely people out there who will buy used gis without hesitation.

What about you? Do you feel alright taking someone’s old gi off their hands in exchange for a few bucks? Why or why not? Let us know your opinion by voting in this week’s poll, and leave us your reasoning here in the comment section!

Related Polls…

Here at The FightWorks Podcast headquarters, we’ve been receiving messages like this tweet recently:

@bjjradio hey Caleb, when’s the next podcast going to be out?

— Greg Hill (@english_greg) March 29, 2013

..and email like this:

When will you release a new podcast. The latest I have is Dec 2012. Thnx
- Bill in Maryland

Perhaps most touching is this week-old forum post over on the Underground passed along to us by good friend and FightWorks Podcast contributor Bruce Hoyer. I’ll let you go check it out (it’s not long) but suffice to say that the comments are very appreciated. As I’ve said in the past, the only fuel in the FightWorks Podcast engine over the years has been you guys’ positive feedback that we put out content you liked.

As for the future, I can’t say exactly when there will be another episode. What I do know is that I’m not ready to hang up the gi and I’m not ready to shut down the FightWorks Podcast, so there will be more from us. We’re just hibernating right now.

In the meantime, don’t hesitate to reach out to us over email or twitter. You can also send me a message live during BudoVideos’ broadcasts of IBJJF events using the chat rooms available on the Budo site. Who knows, there may even be one of our classic Breakfasts with the Family before the upcoming IBJJF World Championship in June! Let me know if you’re interested!

Moldovan children who train Brazilian jiu-jitsu. All images courtesy Bobby McMasters.

In 2011 we heard Christian Graugart’s tales of global Brazilian jiu-jitsu travel. One of the exotic destinations he visited was the small country of Moldova (population: less 4 million). Since then Georgette has been keeping in contact with Bobby McMasters, an American who’s been instrumental in spreading jiu-jitsu in Moldova.

We reached out to McMasters for more information on the story of jiu-jitsu in Moldova.

The FightWorks Podcast: Tell us how it is that you now find yourself in Moldova, deep in Eastern Europe.

Bobby McMasters: The short answer is Rocky IV. The long answer is that I started out here as a U.S. Peace Corps Volunteer in 2005. As a potential volunteer, you pick the region you want to serve in, and then Peace Corps chooses your host country and everything else. I chose Eastern Europe/Central Asia (mostly because of my childhood fascination with Rocky IV) and I was eventually placed in Burlacu, a small, remote village in the Republic of Moldova. After my service ended in 2007 I moved back to the US. After a while, things got boring and my grandparents (who we were looking after) moved out of their home and closer to other family so we (myself and my then-girlfriend, now-wife) decided to go on another adventure in Eastern Europe. We left in January ’10. Since we both spoke Romanian we decided to try our hand at living in Romania. Initially we wanted to work in tourism but nobody wanted to hire us. We found teaching English to be a fairly lucrative profession for native speakers so that’s how I’ve been making my money for the past 3 years or so. We’re both living in Bucharest now, which is only a 5-6 hour trip from Moldova.

The FightWorks Podcast: What are the three most important things you think our audience should know about the country?

Bobby McMasters: Only 3? Hmm… I could really focus on negative things but I think I’ll look at the positives and tell your audience that Moldova has the absolute best hospitality, wine and the most beautiful girls in the world. What else could be important after that? . When you go to a Moldovan’s house you will totally be taken care of. They will feed you more than you can stand and you will drink some of the best wine and strongest moonshine in the world. When you go to one of their gyms, you won’t be able to escape without even just a few pictures with at least half the team. I’m married now and of course I don’t even look at girls anymore but I hear they look nice. The guys don’t match up… also from what I hear from somebody (sorry, ladies).

The FightWorks Podcast: What is your background in BJJ?

Bobby McMasters: I’ve actually been practicing BJJ for a long time. My road to BJJ started with wrestling. I wrestled in high school and then 3 years in college, and after taking a year off I really wanted to get back into it. I looked around Detroit, where I had moved to after graduating college in 2003, and tried to find maybe a wrestling club or even a high school that maybe needed an assistant coach or something. I wasn’t able to find anything in the area. During my search, however, “submission wrestling” came up. I showed up for a practice and I really liked the idea of submissions. I wanted to compete, and the only tournaments they had were Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu tournaments so I bought like an A4 gi (I’m between an A2 and A3) I entered the tournament, took my guy down and ezekieled the dude in like 10 seconds because of course my sleeves were enormous on me. After this I was totally hooked. I went on to train with Saulo and Xande Ribeiro who were living in Toledo at the time but drove to Detroit every day to teach us BJJ after our first instructor, Dave Gomez left the gym. I trained with them for about a year before I had to make a tough decision: continue to train with some of the best guys in the business, or go see the world and maybe learn some judo or sambo in Eastern Europe. I was at the end of a relationship, sick of my job and Detroit, and since I had never been out of the US prior to this, I figured this would be my only chance and see where this road would take me. I’ll get to my BJJ-in-Moldova story shortly, but after my service I came back and trained in Virginia, got my blue belt, got a back injury and moved back to Eastern Europe where I’ve really only been training sporadically up until now.

The FightWorks Podcast: What made you decide to focus on Brazilian jiu-jitsu there? Was BJJ popular in your new home before you arrived?

Bobby McMasters: In the village, BJJ was absolutely non-existent and unheard of, and so was sambo and judo. My dreams of leg-locking the shit out of huge, Ivan Drago-looking dudes and drinking vodka with Igor Vovchanchyn in a crumbling former Soviet city were crushed when I was assigned to teach health education in a tiny village in the middle of nowhere. The only thing they had that was close to a grappling sport was a yearly traditional wrestling competition (called “trinta”) where the winner of the single-elimination tournament wins a young ram. I entered in the competition in 2006 and subsequently won the smelly little ram. This is an epic story in and of itself but I’ve already written on it in this last issue of BJJ Legends Magazine so you can check it out there if you’re really curious. To answer your first question though, I focused on BJJ because otherwise I would have gone crazy. I was a grappler and grappling is how I have always chosen to spend my free time since I can remember. I wound up sending out just one email asking for help with my program, and within 30 minutes I got calls on my phone and emails in my dial-up-era inbox in the middle of nowhere from people wanting to pitch in. One guy in the Netherlands was closing his gym and wanted to send me all his extra stuff. One guy from England had a gi he really liked but never used and wanted to send it to us…. the list goes on and on. Eventually, (mostly through family) I was able to raise enough funds for the mats, which was our first step. I priced some mats in Chisinau (Moldova’s capital city), and it came out to being about $100 per mat. This was really my only option. We wound up buying 12 mats and the village of Burlacu chipped in 10% of the total cost as well as provide me with a driver who would drive me out to Chisinau (about a 4 hour drive) to pick up the mats. We were able to initiate a sustainable BJJ program that still exists today. They still use the same mats and two years ago they received a refreshment batch of gis (their old ones were all ripped to shreds). Although I’d really like to see them training more and with more drive, this is definitely a step in the right direction. In the end, Moldova’s rural programs definitely need the most support, even to this day.

Traditional Moldovan hospitality: an overflowing table.

The FightWorks Podcast: Describe the average Moldovan BJJ practitioner. For example, what is his or her gender, belt level, age, size, etc…

Bobby McMasters: Hmm… The average Moldovan BJJ practitioner is pretty young. I would say on average he is a boy in his early teens and since Moldovans don’t tend to be huge people, he’s not that big either. He is definitely a white belt, but on the other hand he’s like a mini Matt Hughes; he’s thirsty, he’s a farm boy and he’s ripped as shit. As you can imagine there aren’t too many black belts who come out to rural Moldova in order to promote people so their belt colors tend to remain pretty white. All current BJJ practitioners in the country have, at most, a blue belt, and unless I’m mistaken there are presently only 3 or 4 of them. There’s a guy who is originally Moldovan but has emigrated to Canada. He has his purple belt but that’s as high as they go. Regardless of belt rank, the level of the average Moldovan fighter is definitely advancing. Up until a couple years ago I could have told you that beyond a shadow of a doubt there was nobody who could beat me. Now, I’m not so sure. I’ve been subbed during sparring sessions on more than one occasion, and I’ve been BJJ-ing for about 9 years now. In the end, the average Moldovan BJJ practitioner has rolled with 0.02% of people from other countries. How many people from other states (which are larger than your average European country) or countries has your audience rolled with? Consider coming out sometime.

The FightWorks Podcast: Tell us about the first ever nationwide BJJ tournament in Moldova.

Bobby McMasters: Sure. “The Moldova Cup”, is the first Moldovan-initiated, Moldovan-run, Moldovans-only BJJ tournament to date. We’ve had a few previous competitions including an organized sparring between the Chisinau and Burlacu teams, and two “tri-duals” tournaments which were structured after US wrestling dual and tri-dual, team-based competitions. In any case, the Moldova Cup kept to the IBJJF regulations in all regards with the exception of weight classes, weigh-in and gi regulation requirements (most competitors don’t have regulation BJJ gis, many competing in their karate gis that they grew out of two years ago). We were lucky to have help from three BJJ practitioners from Absoluto BJJ (based in Bucharest) come and help referee the tournament including Tudor Mihaita, Romania’s only resident black belt. The tournament almost didn’t happen. At the last minute, the Ministry of Sport said that we couldn’t hold the tournament because we weren’t sanctioned by some sort of official sports body or something. Luckily, we have some connections and were able to get it cleared up. Still, this is nothing you would see in amateur BJJ competitions in the US. This is just one of the many hurdles one has to get through in order to do something positive for people out here. Despite the bureaucratic haters, it was a really positive experience for all the participants. We had over 70 people participate including judo practitioners, and we even had 5 girls. It’s been our biggest turnout so far, so much props and love to everyone who showed up and who volunteered and helped organize the tournament. Another bragging point I have is that one of my first BJJ students, Alexandru Birlea actually set the ball rolling for this event and did most of the organizing/fending off of bureaucrats. Alex “Sandu” Birlea is a blue belt and an absolute future baller. He has won multiple national titles within Romania and remains unbeaten in any Moldovan competition.

A group of Moldovan Brazilian jiu-jitsu students.

The FightWorks Podcast: Was there any moment of the tournament that was particularly special for you, or most rewarding?

Bobby McMasters: Oh yeah, at this point in my life BJJ in Moldova is super rewarding in and of itself. I see kids now who I used to see being carried around the village by their parents because they weren’t even old enough to walk, winning their first BJJ match and getting their first medal, or kids who experienced their first triangle choke courtesy of myself all those years ago as young adults winning matches. After almost 10 years experience working professionally with disadvantaged youth this is by and far the most rewarding thing I’ve ever been involved with. As far as one moment in the tournament (and actually this happens on a regular basis at all BJJ events I attend out there), I would say it’s when I get introduced as Robert McMasters, the guy who brought BJJ to Moldova. That always makes me feel really good. The truth is, and I tell this to everyone, that BJJ is not a sport/discipline/art that you can do by yourself. The reality of the situation is that BJJ would not be in Moldova if it weren’t for the Moldovan people who practice it. Moldovans are very capable and talented people, and it makes me really proud of them when I see them actually training and enjoying Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu.

The FightWorks Podcast: Anything else we should know Bobby?

Bobby McMasters: Glad you asked! Although there are still a few bugs here and there, we’re officially launching our site which is dedicated to continuing the support of the development of BJJ in Moldova: www.pridemoldovabjj.webs.com. Here you can see our short documentary about BJJ in Moldova as well as look into more detail about our past, present and future projects. This way we look more official and I’m not just some dude asking people for money and gis whenever a need comes up. We’re also on facebook, so look us up and like us (Pride Moldova BJJ)! As I’ve said before and as you’ll see on our website, volunteering is super important not only to the development of skills but also to the overall encouragement of furthering development in the country, so, think about coming for a visit! One rather poignant story of a positive volunteer experience can be found on Christian Graugart’s BJJ Globetrotters blog here. Of course you can help from home as well. We’d love to be able to take donations for a patch-exchange campaign (details about this can be found on our website) but we don’t know much about non-profit law so anyone reading this who is a lawyer or knows a lawyer who knows about this stuff, feel free to contact me at pridemoldovabjj@gmail.com. We also need someone to design an awesome patch and someone who knows where/how to print patches and a whole slew of other things. OK, so in reality it doesn’t matter your background. We can almost definitely find a need for you if you really want to help out.

Thanks again for your interest in what we’re doing out here. We rely on folks like you to get the word out and spread the love and all that.

A photo of the Gracies circa 1962 from the family archive, donated by Angela Gracie to the film.

All of us in the jiu-jitsu community know bits and snippets of the story of the family who brought us jiu-jitsu. That knowledge is likely related to how close one’s instructor is to the Gracie family. Due to the Gracie clan’s large size and understandable biases of our sources, it’s unlikely any of us have a very comprehensive picture of the family history. Most of the answers to our questions about the very large and complicated Gracie family and jiu-jitsu’s history are unclear.

Since then much time has passed. The Brazilian jiu-jitsu community has continued to hope that the film would one day become available. We recently learned that work is finally nearing completion on Bota’s film and brought him on today’s episode of the FightWorks Podcast to give an update on a project that will unquestionably make a big impression on jiu-jitsu lovers everywhere.

[iTunes] Subscribe to the Podcast directly in iTunes (recommended)
[mp3] Download the show

One of the great things about Brazilian jiu-jitsu is that it encourages asking questions. It’s built for curious minds who want to understand the how’s and the why’s of self-defense and sport jiu-jitsu techniques because it fosters innovation and evolution of the art.

The innate drive to understand jiu-jitsu is not limited to what happens on the mat, and here on the FightWorks Podcast we’ve been asking questions for some time. We have been gathering data on jiu-jitsu beliefs, customs, and attitudes in polls since 2008.

December always brings reflection and when you pause for a moment to think about jiu-jitsu since the time you began training, you must notice that jiu-jitsu is gaining popularity. There are more jiu-jitsu schools, more jiu-jitsu videos on youtube, more local jiu-jitsu tournaments*. In sum, more jiu-jitsu.

We were wondering exactly how one might measure the growth of jiu-jitsu. Getting a tally of jiu-jitsu practitioners everywhere is hard, because it’s hard to know exactly how many jiu-jitsu schools there are out there. One imperfect measure might be to compare the number of tournaments out there took place this year compared to past years. While iCompete.org has a very large list of jiu-jitsu events out there, it does not capture every single event around the globe. In the end, the number of International Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu Federation events per year should be a relatively representative measure of the growth of jiu-jitsu around the world because it’s the organization that the vast majority of jiu-jitsu practitioners consider the sport’s authority.

In the image above you can see a dramatic increase in the number of IBJJF events per year. From 1996 through 2007 the Federation held ten or less events per year. Since 2007 the number of IBJJF tournaments per year has more than tripled! Would you have guessed that the Federation is that active?

If the metric used here is a valid reflection of jiu-jitsu’s future growth, BJJ practitioners around the world have a lot to look forward to because if there is one thing we crave, it’s even more jiu-jitsu.

Coincidentally, if it is any measure of the maturation of jiu-jitsu, today the inaugural IBJJ Pro League takes place. It’s the very first IBJJF event will be held where prizes are awarded. A free, live broadcast will be offered at ibjjftv.com.

*our sister site iCompete.org has published over 1,300 BJJ & submission grappling events since December 2008!

December is when we look back at the year and congratulate or curse ourselves based on the work we’ve done! Depending on our assessment of the year we then proceed to either reward ourselves with lots of holiday food and drink, or we punish ourselves with lots of holiday food and drink.

Regardless, the annual tradition of evaluation and introspection is sacred. You’ll (probably) thank us for forcing you to confront your jiu-jitsu progress or lack of progress with today’s poll. There are just two options:

• I feel good about my BJJ progress in 2012
• I feel like my BJJ didn’t improve enough in 2012

Please also share your thoughts about your jiu-jitsu in 2012 in this post’s comment section, as well as your plans for being awesome in 2013!

Lloyd Irvin wins at the IBJJF 2012 No Gi World Championships.

Team Lloyd Irvin came in second place at the 2012 IBJJF No Gi World Championship, a strong outcome by any measure. The team’s founder Lloyd Irvin Junior was able to take a few moments from his very busy schedule to answer some questions we had about his team’s performance at the event.

The FightWorks Podcast: Your team has successful jiu-jitsu athletes across belts and genders. Talk about some of your standouts this time around.

Lloyd Irvin Jr.: It’s hard to go into standouts because overall everyone did well. We had lots of gold medals, lots of medals. There’s no one person who stood out. If you forced me, I’d say DJ because he became our first Black Belt no gi world champion.

The FightWorks Podcast: After a long time away from competition, you also stepped on the mats and won your weight division, black belt I senior heavy. What was that like?

Lloyd Irvin Jr.: It was great! I did it more so as a way to motivate the team. We had a lot of high energy and expectations going into no gi worlds and I thought throwing my hat in there and telling the guys I’m going to battle with them, getting back in shape, training to compete all that would be a great motivation and it was. It felt great!

The FightWorks Podcast: There was some controversy around the outcome of the black belt lightweight finals match between Team Lloyd Irvin competitor JT Torres and Augusto “Tanquinho” Mendes (Soul Fighters International). JT was winning by a narrow margin until the closing moments of the match, when Tanquinho was awarded an advantage that gave him the victory. The evening of the finals, you wrote on your twitter account @lloydirvin, “What happened to JT in the finals is a disgrace! It’s deeper than anyone knows”. What did you mean?

Lloyd Irvin Jr.: I meant that some people think that this is a game, that this is all fun and game but this stuff affects people lives. People dedicate their lives to Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and you have a situation where people are blatantly cheating. This is way bigger than just the JT match. There’s a serious problem going on and it’s affecting peoples lives.

The FightWorks Podcast: At the conclusion of that match between JT and Tanquinho it looked as if you might have been angry with JT. Were the comments you were making then directed at him or at the referees?

Lloyd Irvin Jr.: I have no idea how anyone would think anything was directed at JT. It was clearly directed at the refs and the people in the stands that were cheering after that travesty. Tanquinho pulled with no grips, JT backed up because there was no grips, the ref gave JT a negative point with no warning, which totally changed the landscape of the match. I mean there are several times during the match where Tanquinho doesn’t engage and runs away during the take down battles and he was not penalized or even given a warning. As soon as JT was given the penalty I knew what they were doing. If you watch the video I tell JT “you know what’s up, you know what they’re doing!” In pro sports it’s called point shaving, and it’s a crime.

A controversial outcome: Tanquinho defeats JT Torres at the 2012 No Gi Jiu-Jitsu World Championships.

The FightWorks Podcast: All said and done, how do you feel about the outcome of the event as you look at your team’s work?

Lloyd Irvin Jr.: I’m happy with my team’s performance. There are a few people who I expected to medal and did not, but we’ll fix those errors going into the next competition.

The FightWorks Podcast: Which Team Lloyd Irvin athletes might we see competing on December 8th for a shot at $5,000 in the first-ever IBJJF Pro League event? It looks like JT Torres will have a bid, but will others be competing earlier that day at the Long Beach Fall Open in hopes of earning a spot to compete later that evening?

Lloyd Irvin Jr.: DJ Jackson is the only one competing on December 8.

Related: Lightweight Champion “Tanquinho” Mendes on the 2012 IBJJF No Gi World Championship

We received a great question this week by email from one of the Mighty 600,000:

I am a purple belt and I was rolling with one of my instructors at my school last night, a black belt. As we were rolling I got in a great position and felt as tho I could have tapped my instructor. Out of respect I slowly loosened the choke and let him out, as tho I lost the position. I guess a topic conversation or poll idea could be:

Should you tap your instructor if the opportunity presents itself or out of respect let it go?

My instructor is Brazilian and does have a bit of an ego so I’m sure it would have been bad news had I finished the choke. Personally I feel as though he doesn’t hold back when he has a submission so why should I, but out of future ramifications I decided to let it go.

Whoa! Heavy question! What do you think? Should you tap your instructor if the opportunity is there or should you resist out of respect for him or her?

Let us know what you think by voting and adding a comment here on the site (and let us know if you are an instructor!).

Roberto “Tussa” Alencar (left) faces Rafael Lovato Jr. at the 2012 No Gi World Championship last weekend.

Halley’s comet predictably visits earth every seventy-five years. In the same way certain celestial bodies will regularly meet, the world of black belt jiu-jitsu has two stars whose paths also appear to eternally tangle. Another epic encounter between Oklahoma native and Brazilian jiu-jitsu black belt Rafael Lovato Jr (Ribeiro Jiu-Jitsu) and Brazilian Roberto “Tussa” Alencar (Gracie Barra) formed the finale of the 2012 No Gi World Championship on Sunday at the Long Beach Pyramid. This time Tussa earned the gold by referee decision after time expired.

The FightWorks Podcast: Rafael, you have medaled again at the highest level in another IBJJF event. The event was nearly perfect for you and even included a submission of CheckMat’s very dangerous Nivaldo de Oliveira. How do you feel about your performance at the 2012 No Gi World Championship?

Rafael Lovato Jr: I’m not happy with it, because I failed to do what I was there to do, become a 3x Champion. I was feeling great en route to the final, but I wasn’t able to complete my mission.

The FightWorks Podcast: You ended up losing in the finals to Roberto “Tussa” Alencar in the finals by referees’ decision. How many times have you faced Tussa in your career and what are your thoughts about how that match played out on Sunday?

Rafael Lovato Jr: I played the strategy I wanted to play with Tussa. I believed that I could sweep him and I had him in many of my sweeping positions, but he did a great job defending and staying heavy. More than half the match was spent with him defending my sweeps and attacks, but they gave the match to him. I knew it could go either way and I was just very angry with myself that I wasn’t able to complete one of my sweeps on him when I had so many opportunities. It really hurts to lose by referee’s decision in the final!

I have now faced Tussa six times, with four matches going in my favor. He is a warrior and we always have great matches that are really close. I respect him a lot and congratulate him on winning his fourth No-Gi title, I just wish it wasn’t over me

Rafael Lovato Jr. cinches a last-second victory over Tussa at the 2008 Pan Jiu-Jitsu Championship to win the gold medal. Photo credit: Aliciaphotos.com

The FightWorks Podcast: You’ve bounced around in weight divisions over the years at the IBJJF No Gi World Championships. In 2009 you were a super heavyweight and won silver, in 2010 you were heavyweight and won gold, in 2011 you were a medium heavyweight and won gold, and now in 2012 you were a heavyweight and won silver. That’s a lot of success. Do you think this means that there may not be an ideal weight for a jiu-jitsu athlete? Should BJJ competitors experiment over the years with different weight divisions or is there a “sweet spot” they should attempt to find?

Rafael Lovato Jr: Yes, I’ve competed at all four of the highest weight classes over the years, but I don’t know if that is something that every BJJ athlete should do. For me it is much easier, because I have a good guard and I’m flexible so I think my game works well with the bigger guys. Also, I am long and have the ability to put weight on or lean up and compete at a lighter division. Heavyweight is my natural weight and I feel best there, but I experimented cutting down to medium heavyweight this past year and it was a good experience. Earlier in my Black Belt career I was bigger and would compete in heavier divisions to stay out of my teammate, Xande Ribeiro‘s division. I’m happy that I’ve been able to show that my Jiu-Jitsu is effective against all different styles & sizes.

The FightWorks Podcast: You brought family members from Oklahoma to watch you compete. Who’d you bring? Do you get anxious knowing that they’re watching?

Rafael Lovato Jr: Yes, I always bring my wife to the World events. She was there and then I had the surprise of my father showing up at my hotel room the day before the event started. He had just returned from a long trip in Spain where he did the Camino de Santiago and he was gone for 6 weeks. He came home just in time to watch my victory at Metamoris over the internet and he didn’t want to miss me at the No-Gi Worlds. It was great to have him and my wife there. I really wanted to win for them! My father is the reason I do BJJ and my wife has given me incredible support during my whole career.

The FightWorks Podcast: How do you feel about the IBJJF’s new ranking system for black belts? As of this writing, you’re ranked number 50.

Rafael Lovato Jr: I think the ranking system still has some kinks to work out. I mean, guys like Xande Ribeiro and Roger Gracie aren’t even in the top 10 for their weight classes. Cobrinha and Marcelo Garcia aren’t even ranked in the top 7 of their divisions. Some of the veterans have a lot on their plates with their academies and business and are only able to compete at the Worlds or maybe the Worlds and one other event. There are some people who are eligible to compete at the Pro League who have never won or even medaled at the World Championship, but they do a lot of the Open events and medal at the smaller tournaments and they have a lot of points, I don’t think that is right. If you were on the podium at the Worlds this year, you should be able to compete at the Pro League without having to qualify at the regular tournament held that morning.

The FightWorks Podcast: Can we expect to see you in action again on December 8th at the Long Beach Fall International Open Jiu-Jitsu Championship, fighting for a chance to compete for $5,000 in the first ever IBJJF Pro League later that evening?

Rafael Lovato Jr: No, I feel I have done more than enough to earn my shot at the Pro League competition having won 6 World Black Belt medals from 2007-2012 and being the most accomplished American in BJJ. I will be back at the Gi & No-Gi Worlds next year. Now, I am going to get some rest and spend time with my family, focus on my academy and my team. Also, I will be releasing my online coaching program – www.ultimatepressurepassingsystem.com to new members this month and I’m very excited about it! I added a Kimura series to the program that shows exactly what I did at the Metamoris against Kayron Gracie. Everyone is going to love it!

Justin Rader’s hand is raised after he defeated Samir Chantre at the 2012 IBJJF No Gi World Championship last weekend.

The FightWorks Podcast: You have been successful in the IBJJF World No-Gi Championships for several years now. In 2009 you won gold medal as a brown belt, in 2010 you won the gold medal as a black belt, and in 2011 and 2012 you earned silver medals as a black belt. What comments do you have about your performance over the weekend?

Justin Rader: The No-Gi Jiu-Jitsu World Championships is a tournament I’ve had a lot of success at during my career, with 4 finals appearances in the past 4 years (3 as a black belt), two gold medals, and one gold medal as a black belt. This past weekend was just one more showing of how far I’ve come and where I stand on the World Championship stage. Obviously it was not the end result I wanted, and I’ll never be satisfied with 2nd place, but it just shows I’ve got more learning and work to do to come back even stronger. Overall though, I am proud of my performance at this year’s No-Gi World Championships. I had some great matches against Ed Ramos, Samir Chantre, and Rubens “Cobrinha” Charles. I fought each match with the same intensity and heart I always expect of myself, giving it everything I had, and I have no regrets.

In truth, this was probably one of the hardest training camps I’ve ever endured to get ready for this tournament as well. I’m not sure how many people know, but I’m still in school and work 40 hours per week as an intern for dietetics, and then I try to find time for strength and conditioning and training. I had many people tell me I would likely not be able to compete, and just as many tell me I shouldn’t even try. And there were plenty of times I questioned myself through training on whether I was making the right decision, and whether I could train like I need to for a tournament like this. Through this struggle though, I realized just how great a support group of coaches, mentors, and close friends I have around me, who inspire and push me, and convinced me to finish training camp and this tournament the right way, no matter the outcome.

I’m not entirely sure what next year is going to bring for me competition wise, and I’ve got some big plans and decisions to make, so be sure to stay tuned and follow me on facebook.com/DarthRader86 and on twitter @DarthRader86.

The FightWorks Podcast: A gentleman who goes by the name Cobrinha has prevented you from bringing home the gold at the No Gi Worlds for two years in a row. Did you expect him to stand in your path again this year, and if so did you make any special preparations for the encounter?

Justin Rader: Cobrinha is a great champion, who has now won 4 titles each in the gi worlds and no-gi worlds as a black belt, and a humble competitor. It was an honor to compete against him once again. I absolutely expected to see him back, and I had envisioned another finals match against him for a whole year. We’ve had some great matches against each other in the past, and this one was no different. I had worked on some different things leading up to this tournament, both from the take-down game and ground game, and Cobrinha was ready for it and did a great job. Again, I’m not satisfied with the end result, but I congratulate Cobrinha on another great performance and match, and I’m sure it won’t be the last time we compete against each other.

The FightWorks Podcast: What are your thoughts on the 2012 No Gi World Championships as a whole? Did you see anyone’s performance that particularly impressed you?

Justin Rader: I thought the tournament as a whole was a pretty good tournament. Of course it had its high points and low points, as with all tournaments, and I do hope that its lows are addressed and improved upon in years to come.

Xande Ribeiro’s performance was very impressive this past weekend. Xande came away with a double gold performance, winning both his division and the absolute division. Xande had many great matches, fighting all of the best guys at the tournament, and coming out on top each time. Xande was solid in all of his matches, and was very impressive to watch. Huge congrats to him.

I’d also like to comment on DJ Jackson’s impressive performance. DJ has not been a black belt for very long I don’t believe, and he walked into the tournament, had some great matches in the absolute division, and ended up winning his first black belt world title in his division. He stuck with what he did best, and had a great tournament. Congrats to him as well.

The FightWorks Podcast: Can we expect to see you in action again on December 8th at the Long Beach Fall International Open Jiu-Jitsu Championship, fighting for a chance to compete for $5,000 in the first ever IBJJF Pro League later that evening?

Justin Rader: I do not have any plans on competing in the Long Beach Open or IBJJF Pro later this year. I’m still in school (until January 2013), and I only have so many days I can get away, and I used them to train and compete at the No-Gi Worlds. I’ll once again have a lot more time to dedicate to training once next year rolls around, and I can’t wait to see what next year has in store.

The FightWorks Podcast: Your email address refers to “Darth Rader”. Are you a Star Wars fan and if so, what are your thoughts on the Star Wars franchise becoming property of the Disney Corporation?

Justin Rader: Haha, yes I am a Star Wars fan. That’s a nickname that has been thrown around quite a bit as I was growing up, and being a fan, it has kinda stuck. As a fan, my first reaction to Disney buying the Star Wars franchise was “NNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!”, haha. But I really don’t have many thoughts on Disney buying the franchise, and I haven’t heard exactly what they plan to do either. If they decide to make more Star Wars movies, I just hope they do a great job!

The FightWorks Podcast: Anything else, Justin?

Justin Rader: I’d like to thank my parents, Master Rafael Lovato Jr., my wrestling coach Andy Howington, my close friends and mentors, all my students and teammates at Lovato’s School of Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu and MMA, and my sponsors OnTheMat, Lucky Gi, Tirey’s Training, 1914 BJJ Kimonos, and Novatek Laboratories for all their support and helping me get to where I am today. I’m also available for seminars. Be sure to message me if you’re interested.

Tanquinho applies the choke to JT Torres at the 2012 No Gi World Championship which earned him the victory and a gold medal.

The FightWorks Podcast: Tanquinho, this is your first gold medal as a black belt at the IBJJF No-Gi World Championship. How does it feel? How does this compare to other accomplishments in your career?

Augusto “Tanquinho” Mendes: I have been trying for a while to get the World title at the black belt from IBJJF and the feeling of finally winning, especially after coming back from my neck surgery is incredible! I am really happy!! I think each title is important at the time that you win for many different reasons. This World title is not anymore or less important that my other titles throughout my career. But this title will be my memory of overcoming of everything that I have been through and being able to come back and compete at the high level!

The FightWorks Podcast: How did you prepare for the event? Was most of your preparation done in Arizona?

Augusto “Tanquinho” Mendes: All of my preparation for the Worlds No Gi was in Arizona at Megaton’s Academy! All of my training for the tournament I did with the gi. The last week before the tournament I trained No Gi to adapt positions for no gi. I did this because I stayed a really long time without training, because of my surgery, and I needed to recover the timing of positions and my reaction timing, and I can only do that with the gi. I also was focused on my physical preparation! I know that No Gi uses a lot of cardio so I wanted to make sure that I would not get tired!

The FightWorks Podcast: The match against JT Torres (Lloyd Irvin) in the finals generated controversy. JT was winning until the closing moments when you applied a choke that is essentially a triangle with no arm inside. In those final seconds you were awarded an advantage point that gave you the victory. Can you talk about that? There seems to be a difference between what some people think the rules are and what the three referees that day think the rules are.

Augusto “Tanquinho” Mendes: Yeah, unfortunately a lot of people are showing how they do not know or don’t completely understand the rules and are not very knowledgeable of positions. The choke I did is not a triangle, how I have seen a lot of people confusing it to be as. A triangle position with or without an arm inside is a blood choke, meaning it stops the blood from going to the brain. The choke I did, I learned it by the name as crab choke, is an air choke, so it blocks your esophagus. If you tried to do the crab choke but with your legs in a triangle position you would not get the position at all. I really don’t know what people are so confused about the rules. For every argument that I have heard, such as “JT was not warned before he was penalized”, or “he needed to defend the choke to get an advantage”, or even “the referees are corrupt and they have never made a bad call in favor of an American guy”, all have quick and easy answers. Plus, just for people to be thinking all of these things shows that they are not knowledgeable of the rules or the federation. I don’t want to address every argument to have to explain myself. I know the rules and I know how much I trained and fought my best to win and I am absolutely confident that I won.

The FightWorks Podcast: In 2010 and 2011 you almost won your division but in both of those years Lucas Lepri (Alliance) stopped you and you ended up with the silver medal. This year Lepri was not able to compete due to illness. Do you wish you had the opportunity to face him this time?

Augusto “Tanquinho” Mendes: Lucas was better then me in 2010 and 2011 without a doubt! I did not go to fight this year thinking about just fighting him. I just trained and prepared myself to fight against who ever would be in the division, and I knew there would just be tough guys! I knew that there was a chance I could win or lose to Lucas just like there was a chance against JT and Leandro or anyone else in the lightweight division but I was confident in my game and preparation!

The FightWorks Podcast: There are some competitors who perform very well in the gi but sometimes their game is not as strong without the gi. Which do you think is stronger for you, gi or no gi?

Augusto “Tanquinho” Mendes: I don’t think that I am stronger in one or the other! I am really good at adapting my game to gi or no gi! There are a lot of things in my game that are easier to do with the gi, but then on the other hand, there are a lot of different things that I have adapted to my game that work better with no gi. But I have to say that I like with the gi a little more than no gi!

The FightWorks Podcast: Can we expect to see you in action again on December 8th at the Long Beach Fall International Open Jiu-Jitsu Championship, fighting for a chance to compete for $5,000 in the first ever IBJJF Pro League later that evening?

Augusto “Tanquinho” Mendes: Yes! For sure! I am first waiting for the chance to maybe be qualified already in the Pro League because I am number 8 in the ranking, so if anyone before me can’t make it my spot will be moved up! But if all of the first six will be there, I will be at the Fall Open to try and get a spot to compete for the $5,000! I am really happy about this event and I think it will have a really good turn out! I will just train hard to be as prepared as possible because every fight will be a tough one!

Roger Gracie (white gi) fends off his aggressor Marcus “Buchecha” Almeida in the October 14 debut of Metamoris. Image courtesy Metamoris.

On Sunday the Brazilian jiu-jitsu world experienced the first-ever Metamoris jiu-jitsu event. Judging by feedback on social media and in the blogosphere, the event was a success. The format of pitting specially-invited renowned BJJ athletes against each other in submission only matches consisting of one twenty minute round was proven to entertain and fans are wondering when the next event will be. As The FightWorks Podcast spoke with Metamoris organizer Ralek Gracie prior to the event, we felt it only fitting to invite the event’s other promoter Robert Zeps to join us and talk about their evaluation of the evening and learn what’s next.

Metamoris organizers Robert Zeps (left) and Ralek Gracie. Image courtesy Metamoris.

Also in this episode we continue the FightWorks Podcast tradition of encouraging academic inquiry into Brazilian jiu-jitsu, our beloved addiction. We’ll round out the episode with a conversation with Chris Kavanagh, an Oxford University researcher and BJJ blue belt. Kavanagh needs our help, Mighty 600,000 in gathering data about BJJ belt ceremonies (also known as belt grading, also known as belt promotions, also known as graduação in Brazilian Portuguese). Please help further knowledge about BJJ by participating in his survey, which is found at BJJSurveys.com.

Are there any rituals that take place at your BJJ school when new belts are awarded? Image courtesy scottonthenet.

[iTunes] Subscribe to the Podcast directly in iTunes (recommended)
[mp3] Download the show

TRANSCRIPTION OF INTERVIEW WITH ROBERT ZEPS

The FightWorks Podcast: Alright family, we are on the line with Robert Zeps, one of the promoters of Metamoris Pro which took place last Sunday. I don’t think too many people need an introduction to what Metamoris is but it was an invite only event with 12 competitors. There were six matches of submission only grappling – most of which were in the gi – and twenty minute time limits. I think most of us know that and have seen the results online. But suffice to say it was a big event in the jiu-jitsu community, and we’re very excited to speak with Robert about it. How are you Robert?

Robert Zeps: I’m very well Caleb, thank you for having me on.

The FightWorks Podcast: It’s out pleasure. I thought we have an obligation to introduce you a little bit more formally to the world out there of Brazilian jiu-jitsu because based on what we’ve seen so far you may have an impact on things and it’d be nice go get to know you a little bit. What I thought we would do is give you a chance to reintroduce yourself to our audience here so tell us about Robert Zeps.

Robert Zeps: Yeah no problem Caleb. Like I said at the press conference (I think it was placed online), I’m English and I came to America in 1995 and I started training jiu-jitsu just about 5 years ago. It was something that came to me later, and I wish it was something I’d started earlier like most people at my age. I started training with Nelson Monteiro in San Diego. As I was training with him I reached out to the Gracie Academy which is in Torrance, and not too far from my house, and I started meeting a lot of fun people and talking a lot about jiu-jitsu. And it became a real hobby of mine. It started taking up a lot of my time. And as I was doing that I started thinking about what [jiu-jitsu matches] I’d like to see. I managed to sit down with Ralek Gracie a few times and we discussed, “what is it that people really want to see in jiu-jitsu? Do we want to just go to high schools and watch some of the top professionals wander around looking for bottles of water, or do we want to do something that would treat these athletes like the stars that they are, and also treat the fans to something a little more exciting and interesting?” And with not a lot else more interesting on our plates to be honest with you Caleb I decided this could be a real fun event we could put together and if enough people got excited, we’d keep doing it. So that’s what happened.

The FightWorks Podcast: You mentioned that you’ve been a martial artist for a long time. What got you into martial arts way back in the day?

Robert Zeps: [laughs] It’s a funny story. I think I was about fifteen years old and the fourteen year old sister of a friend of mine at school wanted to go and start some full contact karate in the area, in England. She wouldn’t do it without somebody going with her. I was the guy who decided I’d be the good guy and go along with her. I kept on doing it, and she quit after about two weeks. I kept going and I think I got my first black belt in 1986, if that doesn’t age me too much! That was in full contact karate. It started out there. I met some other people training and I got involved in aikido, Japanese jiu-jitsu, some goju-ryu karate, and I was doing that in England. I continued to do [martial arts] when I came to America. I continued training aikido, goju-ryu karate. Of course like everybody else, I watched the UFC in 1993 and was blown away. It just took me far too long to get involved in jiu-jitsu. I was still teaching in the U.S. some aikido as well just for fun and training down there in San Diego with real top level guys. It was just a joy. But the jiu-jitsu really grabbed me. And it grabbed me for one reason and I’ll tell you while we’re talking about it briefly. What took me with jiu-jitsu was how cerebral the whole thing was. It wasn’t just about force. It wasn’t just about who is the toughest guy. It really was something you could think on, in tough, tough situations. I think most people, particularly guys like me over forty, know what that feels like. You know what it feels like to be in a fight and you can actually genuinely think through what you’re going to do and who’s next. That honestly doesn’t happen too often in a lot of the older Japanese-style martial arts.

The FightWorks Podcast: I think a lot of our audience would agree with you on that. There are a bunch of great reasons to be in jiu-jitsu but that is one of them. Some of us have this superiority complex about Brazilian jiu-jitsu sometimes, myself included. It’s not necessarily legitimate, but we have this, I have this conception that a lot of people who did other martial arts when they come to Brazilian jiu-jitsu they stop doing the others. Is that what happened with you? Talk about that.

Robert Zeps: Yes I think the funny part for me was there’s generally a misunderstanding about the traditional martial arts, particularly arts like aikido and judo even, and traditional Japanese jiu-jitsu. I think people understood the history and where these things came from. I’m not talking about Brazilian jiu-jitsu guys. I’m talking about guys who were actually studying Japanese martial arts. A lot of these arts were formed around training with weapons, training with armor, and I think a lot of that is lost on people training today. There are instructors like Kazuo Chiba in San Diego, who was my aikido instructor who taught a very realistic form of aikido that was taken directly from training under Jigoro Kano. These guys were animals in all sorts of Japanese martial arts. They weren’t practicing them for the self-defense in any way, shape, or form. They really were just moving meditation. And too many people training in it because it was physical that somehow they were doing something that was self-defense oriented. We all convinced ourselves up until UFC 1 that somehow these arts were actually legitimate. I think what happened in UFC 1 was that we demonstrated that frankly in a modern era a lot of the things that were practiced and done were simply not practical. I don’t know if it’s just a personal feeling of mine but I really do believe that Brazilian jiu-jitsu had to come from somewhere like Brazil, a place where there is significantly less attention paid to the respect that goes on between elders and juniors in the Japanese culture. And the idea that somebody walking on the beach and kicking sand in someone’s face in a speedo and ended up rolling around the beach is not something that happens, or could conceivable happen in a Japanese culture. I think it’s interesting to note that though the Japanese have clearly their training and continue to train, it really takes a cultural difference to modify martial arts sometimes and I think that’s what happened with Brazilian jiu-jitsu.

The FightWorks Podcast: So you’re saying it’s an American phenomenon – not North American, but a “new world” phenomenon where some of those vestiges of the past were not present and allowed people to just make something new up along the way.

Robert Zeps: Absolutely, I think you evolve your martial arts to the context and the culture that you’re in. If you’re fighting and rolling around in speedos, that’s quite distinct from rolling around in full samurai garb. Clearly you can’t fight both ways the same. Equally you couldn’t do well in the dark ages using Brazilian jiu-jitsu against a guy on a horse with a mace. It simply wouldn’t have been practical. So it had to be modified, you have to evolve. I think Brazilian jiu-jitsu is a modern evolution of martial arts.

The FightWorks Podcast: Let’s come back to the present a little bit. Tell us a little bit more about yourself then I want to jump into Metamoris. You said you’ve been training with Nelson Monteiro and Ralek. Three rapid fire questions for you: what belt are you, what’s your favorite submission, and do you prefer gi or no-gi?

Robert Zeps: [laughs] This may get confusing. I have a purple belt with three stripes from Nelson. I have a blue belt with one stripe from the Gracie Academy. But I think that guys understand that they have a very different program up there right now where their stripes are now being tested on an entirely different curriculum. I think that’s something people should explore at the Gracie University if you have an interest. I actually enjoy gi and no-gi. I train a couple of times a week with a friend of mine Steve Gable. He’s a professional MMA fighter and a Gracie Barra black belt. We go through some basic no-gi training with punches just for fun and I enjoy it very much. But I can’t say I have a preference. I do enjoy them both. What was the third question?

The FightWorks Podcast: Which is your favorite submission?

Robert Zeps: [laughs] My favorite submission? You know I don’t know if I even have one right now. I think one of my favorite submission right now and only because it gets done to me: Nelson has this way of submitting me without choking me or arm-barring me where he just squeezes me tight from the top mount, and I tap.

The FightWorks Podcast: [laughs]

Robert Zeps: And I say it’s my favorite because it’s so unbelievably tight, and it’s not painful, it genuinely squeezes the life out of you and you want to give in. I find that very few people can do that, I’m sure. Nelson is amazing at that. I can’t do that to anybody. But I say it’s my favorite submission because when he does it to me I’m laughing aloud.

The FightWorks Podcast: While we’re on the topic of Nelson Monteiro, we’ve talked with him before on our show. He’s proven to be a character who appears once in a while in the big, big, big stage of Brazilian jiu-jitsu. He had a relationship with Sheikh Tahnoon, who brought us the ADCCs, and now he’s connected with you, who are an integral part in bringing us Metamoris. What’s the likelihood of that happening twice? It’s pretty unlikely.

Robert Zeps: It is unlikely and Nelson’s told me the full story of Sheikh Tahnoon and that story is quite unbelievable, every step of it. It’s an amazing story. I don’t think people have respect for or understand where ADCC came from and some of the sacrifices that Nelson had to make to make that happen. You know, taking his wife and his daughter to Abu Dhabi without really understanding what on earth it was this guy wanted. So he really did build something quite amazing out of that. The chances of that happening twice? He is quite an individual. I think he’s one of the early architects of American jiu-jitsu. He’s one of the first people out here, way back, pre-Gracie Barra.

The FightWorks Podcast: Let’s talk about Metamoris. I know you’ve been very busy since the event on Sunday. What is the most common question you’ve been asked by the media since the event ended?

Robert Zeps: It has to be, “is there going to be another one?” And the answer is yes, there’s absolutely going to be another one. No question about it. We obviously want to do our homework and make sure we learn from everything on that last event and make sure that we can improve it in every way possible. We understood that some people had issues with the live stream. We’re trying to figure out whether that was [due to] local issues or something on our end. We had people in Afghanistan who were streaming it no problem, people in Australia with no problem, and people in London with no problem. And then again we had people in Southern California who had issues. I don’t know what technical issues they were having, We would love to make sure that those issues go away and never happen again. As for the event itself, I couldn’t have been happier. The fights went off every which way I wanted them to. I was absolutely ecstatic after every single fight. I enjoyed every single one. I didn’t see one that bothered me in any shape or form. It really couldn’t have gone better for me. I was over the moon with what happened that evening with regard to the fights. And indeed I thought the camera work was terrific. I thought Rener Gracie and Sean Peake were amazing on the commentary. I thought that really added to it. I went home that night Caleb and I watched the entire stream. I think I started at about 1 o’clock in the morning and I watched the whole thing. I was really pleased with what happened. So yes, I want to do another one.

The FightWorks Podcast: I do remember during the event after each match I would look over from the press gallery where we were and see your reaction and you had a very big smile on your face every time. I noticed you looking over at Ralek and you looked very pleased.

Robert Zeps: Very much so. My wife hasn’t seen me that happy in a long, long time. She really enjoyed watching how much fun I was getting out of it too. It was a real enjoyable night for me.

The FightWorks Podcast: What was your favorite match of the night? I know it’s hard to chose but I’m going to ask you to try.

Robert Zeps: [laughs] I have thought about that because somebody’s asked me that before. I really enjoyed what Caio [Terra] and Jeff [Glover] did. I thought what they put on was a display of jiu-jitsu. Not just technical jiu-jitsu but the playfulness they had. Showing people that you could get playful but at the same time when it got real, it was very real. I thought that match was absolutely beautiful to watch. It really was. I can’t say enough about Rafael Lovato [Jr.] too. I thought his submission was the purest, most absolutely beautiful jiu-jitsu I’ve ever seen. In an environment like this I thought that was incredible. Dean [Lister] and Xande [Ribeiro] had my heart pumping from the moment they walked on the stage. I did not know where that was going to go. To see Dean with his arm fully extended was out of control. And of course Roger [Gracie] versus Buchecha was amazing to me. I understand that a few weeks before the fight that Roger was suffering a bit. The week before he showed me he had a real bad infection and he really shouldn’t have probably taken the fight to be quite honest with you. But that’s the kind of guy that he is. He took it. And taking nothing away from Buchecha, he really put on the performance of the night. So if I had to say who I enjoyed the most, it was probably Buchecha because I really think he’s amazing. He really is. To come up and fight someone like Roger Gracie, who is your hero as a child, and do as well as he did, I was delighted to watch him.

The FightWorks Podcast: A lot of the attention after the event has been focused on the match between Ryron [Gracie] and Andre Galvao. Do you have any thoughts on that? It sounds like if there was controversy that night, it was in that match.

Robert Zeps: That’s a funny thing. I did read all the blogs about it, and obviously I was present during the comments both on the mat and at the press conference. I would definitely say that neither of them when they were speaking about what happened were particularly articulate about what their position really was. My opinion was, and I knew this going into the fight, and it was why we picked this fight, that we really wanted to take two very distinct styles of jiu-jitsu. Andre Galvao, everybody knows what he’s like. He’s aggressive, attack attack attack individual, and I knew going in that Ryron was very much the opposite style. And we discussed the idea of “let’s create a blank canvas for the fighters and let them express themselves however they want, and maybe one will come out on top and one won’t come out on top”. In many ways, it’s like comparing different types of art. You can try and compare cubism and impressionism and you can’t come up with a conclusion about which one is better. Nobody would ever suggest that one’s better than the other, and I think that night we demonstrated that Andre was very much on the attack, and Ryron was very much on the defensive but I think that was his choice. That was his style. I enjoyed every minute of it and actually Saulo [Ribeiro] came up to me after the fight and said that was his favorite fight of the night. I think people need to take a step back from the comments being made and say, “look, you watched some really good jiu-jitsu between both Ryron and Andre, who obviously we all have the utmost respect for. I thought it was a terrific fight and I thought we learned a lot from it. Obviously everybody would love to see a submission and we didn’t see a submission but you know what? Sometimes there are no submissions in jiu-jitsu. And that’s okay! I think people need to learn that that’s okay.

The FightWorks Podcast: Looking forward… I’m not sure Metamoris has a physical office anywhere, and not that it needs to, but let’s imagine that you guys were around the desk in the conference room Monday morning with some coffee and stuff, what conversation took place, if any after the dust had settled [from the event the day before]? What was that conversation like?

Robert Zeps: It’s funny because Ralek and I just met not three or four hours ago at the Gracie Academy on one of the mats in one of the private rooms. So we would roll for twenty minutes not full on, just on and off, practicing some things, we’d go after each other then we’d stop to chat about the event, then we’d fight again. So a little fun along the way. We talked about a lot of different things. We talked about all the different possibilities. Obviously we are still going to want to do a masters event. We need to get Nelson [Monteiro] and Jean Jacques [Machado] together. We were really disappointed that Nelson got injured but we’d love to see them get together and they want to. We’d love to see fights between two ladies too. I think everyone would like to see someone like a Rhonda Rousey come in and fight someone of her weight in the jiu-jitsu community, whether it’s Kyra Gracie or someone equally matched up with her. I think that could be a terrific fight. We talked about some of the other competitors that called and said they’d love to do the event. Obviously we have people like Marcelo Garcia, Rodolfo Vieira, Leo Nogueira. This list of top, top level jiu-jitsu is pretty good still. The question is “how do you put those guys together?” I think that for the fights we had in ours, the fights were well-matched and in the next event we’d like to get a lot of well-matched fights again that people would take an interest in and want to see, to step back and view them on the canvas to express their jiu-jitsu in an unconfined manner in the way that we saw it on Sunday. We sat and talked about those things and we’re going to go out tonight and we’re going to talk some more.

The FightWorks Podcast: There are a couple of things that I think would be good to express to the audience because not everybody was in the press conference or may have heard in the meantime but in terms of things you might do differently next time, I noticed in the press conference that you made an explicit point of saying “we did not intentionally schedule this event on the same day as the Abu Dhabi [submission grappling] qualifiers in San Diego”. I just wanted to make that explicit for you.

Robert Zeps: Yeah, and I think Caleb that that’s a problem we’re going to have no matter what. Whenever we try and put an event together I can almost guarantee there’s going to be another event on the same day or the same weekend. There’s so many jiu-jitsu events going on these days. When we originally picked the day, I think we originally had picked the week before that, and there was some scheduling issue that week so we moved it to the following Sunday and we weren’t even aware of the ADCC trials at that time. It’s not that we didn’t know they were happening, but we didn’t know they were on that date. Once [our] date was picked, once we’d signed with the university to get the San Diego State Arena it’s very difficult to start messing around with venues and production company availability. So we weren’t overjoyed about having it on the same day as ADCC but sometimes that’s just going to happen.

The FightWorks Podcast: I think there are those in the community who are guardedly ecstatic about Metamoris. I think there are folks who have been around a while and are familiar with things like Rickson Gracie’s Budo Challenge back in 2005, and the Professional Submission League put on an event or two in 2007 I believe. And they have a lot in common with Metamoris. The problem with those is that we don’t hear from them anymore. I think the concern is, “how excited should we get?” Are we going to be disappointed if in the end [Metamoris] was just a one or two time thing? I think people are concerned about sustainability. I guess that’s you guys’ challenge right, is to make sure that it works.

Robert Zeps: That’s absolutely right. We’re challenged to make sure there’s sponsors to support the event and to make sure that the fans support the event. They did a great job on the live stream. We had a lot of support there, which was terrific. Obviously I look to expand that. I think we’re in a slightly different time as well, Caleb. I really do believe that jiu-jitsu has evolved a fair amount and I think the world has evolved in terms of access to content. I think the availability to live stream is becoming easier, and simpler, and cheaper. I think that makes it more likely that people will put events on. I think that the television companies like the Fuels and MTV2s are looking for this kind of content too, which I don’t think they were five years ago. So I’m hoping that we can convert some of the excitement that we have in Metamors into legitimate commercial excitement as well and I actually do have some signals that that is indeed the case. It’s my job to make sure that I can manage that strategically and I will commit to the fans that that is what I will be doing in the next year and two years: making sure that we can really make this happen. I really want to see this happen. It’s not just about financials for me. This is something that I’m enjoying doing. It makes me feel really good to know that people are excited about it. I would implore the fans to look at the fights and say, “Enjoy it, educate yourselves on the fights, educate yourselves about jiu-jitsu”. The more education you have about jiu-jitsu the more you’re going to enjoy the fights, quite frankly. Move away from trying to look at the fights as trying to see a winner and a loser. At the end of the day for me it was all about, “can we see a beautiful exhibition of jiu-jitsu?”, and I think we did. I’m not too worried about who submitted who. I think we all enjoy that but that’s less of a consequence to me than making sure that we’re putting on a great show. As a promoter I want to make sure that people enjoy it. We want to expand the demographic to people who maybe don’t understand what’s going on in a jiu-jitsu match. [We'll] hopefully educate them and expand this great, great sport in America.

The FightWorks Podcast: Any last words before we let you go?

Robert Zeps: No, but thank you Caleb for your support. It’s been terrific. I can honestly tell you, this is not all about money for me. This is about jiu-jitsu. I know people hear that from a lot of promoters, but I can promise you from the bath I took on the first event that this is about jiu-jitsu, not about money. So there will be a second one for sure.

It’s been a big year for Brazilian jiu-jitsu, no matter how you slice it. Heck, some would say that it contained one of the most exciting matches we have have ever seen when Rodolfo Vieira faced Buchecha!

Two recent developments have been and will continue to be on people’s minds:

• the October 14 debut of Metamoris, an invite only event where some of jiu-jitsu’s biggest names competed in submission only (no points) matches with twenty minute time limits
• the International Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu Federation announced they’ll hold their first (presumably of many) events where the athletes will be compensated for their performance.

Which do you see as having a bigger, lasting impact on the world of Brazilian jiu-jitsu?

As always, defend yourself by letting us know why you think the way you did by leaving a comment on this page!

Metamoris Pro athletes Rafael Lovato Jr. (left) and Kayron Gracie. Lovato submitted Gracie in under eleven minutes. After the match, Lovato explained, “I believed in my conditioning and my jiu-jitsu. I knew once I got my rhythm I knew it was a matter of time. The kimura’s been one of my best submissions since I was 15 years old.”

The twelve competitors in Metamoris Pro’s debut event (left to right): Marcus “Buchecha” Almeida, Andre Galvao, Dean Lister, Otavio Sousa, Rafael Lovato Jr., Caio Terra, Jeff Glover, Kayron Gracie, Kron Gracie, Xande Ribeiro, Ryron Gracie, and Roger Gracie.

Last Sunday’s Metamoris Pro was watched with great interest from all corners of the global jiu-jitsu community. We were curious about the opinions of some influential jiu-jitsu personalities abroad and asked Fabio Gurgel, one of Alliance Jiu-Jitsu‘s founders for his thoughts. Alliance Jiu-Jitsu is the most successful team of Brazilian jiu-jitsu in recent history, and has won the gold medal for academy results in every IBJJF World Championship since 2008.

The FightWorks Podcast: Where did you watch the event and did you have other athletes from the Alliance family with you?

Fabio Gurgel: I watched at home, no I was alone!

The FightWorks Podcast: Which of the Metamoris Pro matches did you enjoy most and why?

Fabio Gurgel: Xande was the best for me as an individual performance and the fight between Buchecha and Roger was the best.

The FightWorks Podcast: What did you think of the submission only, 20 minute format?

Fabio Gurgel: I think it is a nice idea, every time you take the fighters out of their confort zone you create some interesting to see, I liked the format.

Xande Ribeiro and his Metamoris opponent Dean Lister in the press conference at the event’s conclusion.

The FightWorks Podcast: Were you surprised by any of the outcomes? For example, did you expect Buchecha to almost armlock Roger Gracie? Did you think Kron Gracie was going to armlock Otavio Sousa?

Fabio Gurgel: What surprised me was how some fighters get so exhausted in 20 minutes… but of course see someone catching Roger’s arm even though was Buchecha should be considered also a surprise!

The FightWorks Podcast: Alliance has many accomplished jiu-jitsu competitors. Are there any that you think the Metamoris 20 minute, submission only rules would complement?

Fabio Gurgel: I think all my athletes would fit very well in this type of rules, this is something that we do very often in the academy, (long rolls submissions only), unfortunately they don’t invite us this time.

The FightWorks Podcast: Metamoris organizer Robert Zeps has suggested that there could be interest in a “masters” Metamoris event with more match ups like the Nelson Monteiro versus Jean Jacques Machado match. Would you be interested in competing in such an event? You are already scheduled to face Mario Sperry in 2013 at ADCC…

Fabio Gurgel: Why not! I will compete in ADCC and it would be awesome to compete in a gi event like Metamoris as well.

The FightWorks Podcast: Any last thoughts about Metamoris, Fabio?

Fabio Gurgel: I think that in general the fighters put out a great show! The event was very well broadcast and the rules made the event very fun to watch, if it was no time limit it would be more interesting to see how the athletes would handle it but I understand that is hard to build an event with out knowing how long it is gonna take!

Robert Zeps (left) with Ralek Gracie at today’s press conference in San Diego.

A press conference was held today in San Diego for tomorrow’s Metamoris Pro jiu-jitsu event. The event features six matches between some of the most exciting Brazilian jiu-jitsu athletes in a submission only format with 20 minute time limits.

In mid-September here on the FightWorks Podcast we spoke with Metamoris organizer Ralek Gracie about the event. When we had the opportunity to learn more about his fellow organizer Robert Zeps, we pounced!

The FightWorks Podcast: We know a lot about Ralek Gracie. But we know less about you, sir. Could you introduce yourself?

Robert Zeps: Yeah sure, my name is Robert Zeps. I’m British. I came to San Diego about fifteen years ago, seventeen years ago thereabouts. I was a martial artist from the old school, doing jiu-jitsu. The Japanese jiu-jitsu. I did karate, I did aikido, and then about five years ago I ran into a gentleman back there [points to back of room], my very good friend and instructor Nelson Monteiro who squeezed the life out of me in about five seconds, and changed my life in many ways. I got into jiu-jitsu and involved in doing it. I then became very good friends with the Gracie Academy, with Ralek, and with Ryron. The funny part was Ralek and I would do the occasional private once a week or once every two weeks. We just started talking abotu points in jiu-jitsu. As an older guy it’s really tough for me to play that game. I don’t like to when I spar. When these little kids grab me and say, “two points!” that really drives me nuts. So we talked about the evolution of sport jiu-jitsu from the way Helio Gracie did it, the way all the great champions from Brazil did it. We thought we might organize something that would do what everybody wants to see, which is no points and just submissions. Clearly we can’t do it with no time frame, because what happens when a fight goes three and a half hours. What are we going to do? Tell everybody to wait?… Twenty minutes seems like a reasonable period. We can see all our fights get done in a reasonable amount of time. Then it was a question of who we wanted to see fight. Quite honestly it was more about who Ralek and I wanted to see fight instead of what should be out there. It was really just a matter of if you could choose any fighters, put them together and see them fight right now, who would it be? I’m fortunate enough that I could speak with Ralek and say, “Ralek you have the connections and you can make this happen”. I am fortunate enough to make this happen financially. Hopefully, if the event is a success – and I understand that the first events are a little more… expensive – then after that you learn and hopefully the jiu-jitsu world is really impressed with what we do. And not just the jiu-jitsu world but the ones who sponsor events, would want to see another event like this occur. We’d love to see a Metamoris 2, 3, 4, 5, and 6 but clearly it has to be a financial success at some point. Not necessarily right at the beginning.

Ryron Gracie during a trip to instruct jiu-jitsu to US Army soldiers in Iraq in 2008.

Today is the press event in San Diego for tomorrow’s Metamoris Pro, where all the athletes will be able to address the media about their submission only matches tomorrow. We are not so patient sometimes so we caught up with Ryron Gracie in his car while he was on his way from Los Angeles to San Diego.

The FightWorks Podcast: We asked our audience which Metamoris Pro match they are most excited about in a poll. Your match against Andre Galvao nearly tied the excitement levels for the Roger Gracie vs. Buchecha match up. Your match was the favorite of 36% of the voters, and their match was the favorite of 40% of the voters. Why do you think that is?

Ryron Gracie: I think it’s because I haven’t competed that much. So they’re curious to see how I’ll do. And we have so many students, thousands of Gracie University students, who may have voted, so that’s probably involved.

The FightWorks Podcast: How did you prepare for your match against Andre?

Ryron Gracie: Lots of rolling! I didn’t do too many new things aside from a lot of jiu-jitsu. I also trained with Kron a lot. So that should sure help.

The FightWorks Podcast: Is rolling with Kron an opportunity you get very often? Or was that something you guys made happen specifically in preparation for this event?

Ryron Gracie: The opportunity is always there because he lives right around me. We were training months before [the announcement of Metamoris] not as regularly, but once we had this event booked we started training three times a week.

The FightWorks Podcast: What do you think made the promoters choose this match up between you and Andre? Why you? Why Andre? Why you and Andre? There’s a bunch of people they could have put in there but they chose you two.

Ryron Gracie: Most of the people they choose to fight me would pretty much be the same in that they’re all going to be super explosive, position savvy and not wanting to be on their back, because they’re world class BJJ competitors. And there’s me, who doesn’t really have a problem in any position. I might be stuck somewhere, but I’m pretty much safe in most positions from what I’ve experienced in my training with people around the world. I always say, “keep it playful”: let somebody side mount you! Having someone mounted on you is not as bad as some people make it out to be. When you watch most people compete in tournaments the top level guys fight to prevent dominant positions like side mount as if it’s the end of the world. They fight to prevent it because points will be put against them. Now even when there’s no points, they’re going to fight to prevent it because of their lack of comfort in those positions. So as for the question “why me and why Galvao?”, it’s just cool to have someone who’s so decorated against me, who really hasn’t done anything but I have been rolling for 25 years, you know?

The FightWorks Podcast: What match are you most excited about as a spectator?

Ryron Gracie: Xande Ribeiro versus Dean Lister. I know them both and I know they’re both extremely powerful. They’re just two guys who are going to go head first and butt heads. Compare that to my match, where I’m not going to be going so hard and it’s going to be about making it very clear that he can’t tap me – or trying to make it clear that he can’t tap me! – and taking every opportunity I can get. When it comes to Dean and Xande, it’s going to be two guys going forward 100%. I mean, everybody likes to see two trains collide, it’s fun.

FightWorks Podcast listener Liam Wandi wrote us earlier this week:

I hope this email find you well. I was thinking this morning about the extent to which the mighty 600,000 in BJJ academies around the world stick to the Japanese decorum surrounding martial arts and thought it would make an interesting question for a poll:

At your BJJ academy, do you regularly:

(i) Bow before and/or after a class
(ii) Use the term Oss for acknowledgement and/or greeting
(iii) Both of the above
(iv) Neither of the above

I hope you like it as I’m very curious about these things.

Great question Liam! Thank you for sending it our way.

What do you think Family? What’s it like at your academy? Is there a lot of ye olde martial arts influence going on, or is it straight up, informal and Western in there? (If you get a chance, check out Liam’s blog the Part Time Grappler – it’s full of United Kingdom goodness.)