The Mom With Brownies

RECIPE BOOK WINNER and A SECOND CHANCE TO WIN!

2010-07-26T09:19:00.001-04:00

We're back from our fun weekend of camping and fishing. What a relaxing family time! I did make dinner Sunday night after we got home! Whoot!

We had the Baked Pasta from page 55 of "70 Meals, one trip to the store."

1. I added 1 pd hamburger to replace the spinach. (hubby's request) I added 3 cans of tomato sauce instead of the tomato paste.

2. We like our pasta "SWEET" so I also added some glops of Ricotta Cheese all around the top of the filled casserole dishes BEFORE I topped the dish with the Mozzerella cheese.

3. I didn't add any Parmesan Cheese because the boys add it at the table...why waste it?

We all loved it...of course! It's Baked Pasta, what's not to love?

Brian went out to the store to replenish some items and add some new ones to our pantry. We grabbed some more bread, yogurt, (pop..shhh), some "snackys" for Brian's lunches. The total was $46.15

For those keeping track, This brings our total grocery bill up to $317.38 so far. I'm hoping that by the end of the 4th week we will be under $600 for 4 full weeks worth of meals....Breakfast, Lunch and Dinner....for a family of Eight. (Most of them are Boys and Men!)

We are NOT eating out so we are going to save money right there...Add to that the falling grocery bill and I am hoping beyond hope that we will make our goal of being Debt Free (except our house) by July 2011.

I'll keep you posted!

Now what was that other thing I was going to write about?

Oh! Who Won The Book?

Drumroll Please.....................

The winner of the book is

SISTER TIPSTER!!

Okay Sister! :o) If you could please use the "contact me" button at the top of the blog and send me your mailing address, I'll be happy to mail the book to you, pronto! :o)

Also, I will have Another
Book in my hands very soon.

Be on the look-out for the next Book Giveaway!!

If you didn't win this time, you have a second chance in a week or so!

OUR NEW MENU PROGRESS and A FREE BOOK!!

2010-07-23T17:08:00.000-04:00

Alrighty, here is how we're doing on our menu plan so far.

For the sake of space I will share that we eat yogurt, cereal and/or fruit for breakfast.
We eat sandwiches and veggie chips or veggies or fruit for lunch or Leftovers.
For snacks we eat veggies, fruit and/or a 1/2 sandwich.

Things of note:

1. The Grocery list does not include Parmesan Cheese, but you will need that for some of the recipes. Buy more than one container of it, if your family likes to add more at the table.

2. You'll notice that all of the dinners I make from the book are also accompanied by what I call "Fillers." I either make pasta or rice to accompany a meal. That way we eat less of the more expensive meats and everyone is still quite satisfied.

3. When preparing the chicken breasts, I cut them in half, "long-wise" so that I can use 2 breasts for One meal. I then use a "meat hammer" (as my kids call it) to beat the snot out of the chicken. This spreads it out so that it fills a large casserole dish.

4. When a recipe calls for Tomato Paste and water I use one can of Tomato Sauce. When it calls for just Tomato Paste, I use 1/2 can of Tomato Sauce.

Here are the Dinners we've eaten since getting The Book.

Tuesday: Kitchen Sink Meatloaf on page 33

I haven't made meatloaf in forever. Kole asked me what it was and I had to laugh. I'm pretty sure that he's the only 6 year old who's never eaten meatloaf. LOL Everyone devoured it. This is an absolute keeper. It was gone in no time flat. I've never put cheese in a meatloaf...so...that may have been the difference for my hubby. It tasted like an Italian Meatloaf of sorts and will definitely be coming back to our table very soon. I served it with white rice and tea.

Wednesday: Chicken Parmesan over Pasta from page 16 of the cookbook

*I cut two large chicken breasts in half...meaning I thinned it out and made 4 fillets out of the two. This meal fed our entire family. I liked it very much, as did Brian. The kids ate it up like a house aflame. Very good and a keeper!

Thursday: Homemade Pizza from Page 50

This was so easy to make. The dough was a cinch, as was the sauce. I used a large casserole dish to make the pizza. It was deep and about 12"x8" The dough is thick iand I had to use a lot of vegetable oil in the dish to get the dough spread easily. Be sure to grease the sides of the dish too.

There is a LOT of sauce to put on this pizza. I thought it was going to be way too much but as it cooked, the dough soaked it up a bit and it turned out just so yummy. It is a Deep Dish, Saucy pizza.

Everyone raved about it. Even my guys who hate tomatoes ate the thing. They just picked off the Diced Tomatoes and really enjoyed the taste they leave behind.

This is a definite keeper!

Friday: Pecan Crusted Chicken

This one sounds intimidating but it's very easy to make. It calls for 1/3 cup butter in the list but does not use the butter in the preparation instructions. I skipped the butter and it turned out very fine and without as much fat. :o)

It tasted good but wasn't a huge hit with the kids. There is just something about honey on chicken that makes me cringe a bit. It was a bit too sweet for my taste, but I'm glad we tried it. Everyone still got filled up. It was definitely eatable, but not repeatable for our family.

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My husband really enjoyed the first three recipes. Our finicky 13 year old enjoyed meals two and three. I'm amazed because they are the biggest critics in the house. They have both resorted to making their own meals in the past, when dinner was not to their liking.

This weekend is a fishing/camping trip for some of our family so I'm not sure I'll keep up with the full out dinners this weekend. Smores and hot dogs may be in our future. :o)

I plan to resume full force on Monday. I'll be back soon to give updates on our dinners.

Would anyone be interested in a Free "70 Meals One Trip To The Store" Book?

If so, this is your chance to get one!!

Be sure to comment on this blog post and Keep watching! I'll draw ONE random name from the commentators on this post here. Facebookers, please head over to my blog to comment.

I'll announce the winner on Monday!

Have a great weekend!

BLOGGING PERKS AND OUR FAMILY GROCERY MENU

2010-07-20T13:21:00.002-04:00

There have been a few times, throughout the years of my blogging, that I have been offered free products, by various people (and sometimes companies), so that I could try the product and give my opinion about it on my little blog here. It does surprise me when I get an email asking me to try this or that because, for the most part, I forget that people actually do read the words that I place here in the cyber world.

The reality is that, first and foremost, this blog is for my children. I log our memories here so that I can have them bound into a hard cover book when I have enough memories to warrant a new one. So far, we have 2 Mom with Brownies books in our possession and I hope to make many more as time passes. This is our scrapbook...but I digress...

Regarding emails about free products; More often than not, I delete the email because this blog is more about logging memories for my children and less about trying out new products. The other issue I have with blogging about items that are sent to me, is that I worry I won't like the item. If I don't like the item I would then have to send it back to the person, or company, and that would be one big waste of my time. So...I don't usually blog about free items...

However, I was recently sent an email from a woman who has made a book called "70 meals, One trip to the store." Now THAT intrigued me. I have been trying to get a grocery and menu plan together for this family for many years. At times I feel as though I've gotten our ducks in a row and at others I feel that I'm totally failing in this venture. I decided to answer the email and agreed to take the 70 Meals Challenge. I have agreed to try her plan to see if it is the ticket to curing my dinner planning woes.

I joined her website, entered her contest to win free smart ingredients and "liked" her page on Facebook. I will blog about our experience with the book as time goes by.

Yesterday, Kazz, Becca and Kole went to the store to buy the groceries. Yes, I sent 3 of our children to the store with the list. The semi-annual and weekly grocery lists are spelled out well in the book so I just typed it up, and DOUBLED THE AMOUNTS...because we have 8 people in our family and the recipes are for families of four. I also added foods for breakfast and lunch for our family. We eat cereals, yogurt, fruits and sandwiches for breakfast and lunch...for the most part.

The first task went off without a hitch. I handed them $300.00 and asked Kazz to cover any overage with his own cash if need-be; and Off They Went.

As you can see by the pictures they had 3 baskets full of groceries BUT, to my sweet, sweet surprise, they only spent a grand total of $271.23 between Save-A-Lot and our local market with $196.23 of that spent at Save-A-Lot.

I will try very hard to log what we eat for the next month and what I have to buy to create more meals as supplies dwindle. Hopefully this helps us get a grip on our grocery spending, stop eating out for quick meals and begin saving money! :o)

Last night, we ate the yummy Kitchen sink meatloaf recipe, white rice and fruit. I have decided to make white rice with most of our meals as a filler. I've also toyed with the idea of brown rice, but decided against it as I'm making meals that are nutritionally sound and the rice is meant to fill the void if a recipe is not very filling.

This morning the kids had yogurt and fruit for breakfast and we had Bologna sandwiches and veggie chips for lunch.

Tonight is our eldest son's 18th birthday so we will eat out and have a family night tonight.

That's the beginning! Snacks are cereals and fruits and veggies, by the way...and the odd 1/2 PB&J sandwich.

The recipes in this book don't have crazy ingredients that would break our budget. I took a quick peek at the recipes and quickly discovered that they are mostly the time-proven, All-American meals that most everyone would enjoy. I recognize and use almost every item on the recipe lists.

I have high hopes for this plan. If it saves us money too, I'm going to be one happy camper!

I have $28.77 to spend for the next two weeks. We'll see if that holds. We usually spend over $600 for groceries, which really chaps my hide, because I used to have that bill down to under $400 for the month...but that was before the boys grew and our family increased by one more...and a fiancee. :o) I will be happy as a lark to feed our crew for anywhere near $600.00 per month. We'll see how it goes.

I'll be posting updates as the days pass. I am so very hopeful that this little plan will be just what I need to finally answer the question, What's for dinner AND save us money!!

Wish us luck!

MY BROTHER'S NEW KENTUCKY HOME

2010-07-15T14:15:00.001-04:00

Our family loaded into our 15 passenger van and took off for Kentucky last week. My niece, Keisha, turned Sweet-16 and we were invited to the Luau!

My Brother and Sister (in-law) recently bought a new home-on-the-hill and we couldn't wait to go see their new digs.

The scenery to behold on the drive to their home was nothing short of breathtaking. I couldn't snap pictures quickly enough to do the views justice, but I was able to grab a few sites as we zipped by.

We arrived just in time to catch my nephew Ryker wide awake. He was waiting up for his Aunt Shelly to arrive. He just couldn't shut his little eyes before he said, Hello and I love you. (tee hee) Oh My Gosh! What a cutie-butt! He just grabbed my face and kissy-kissy-pull-hair-kissy-kissied till the cows came home. I couldn't get enough of my little 8 month old baby boy.

The next day, Keisha's party gals arrived for the weekend sleepover-luau. Their new home was full of family and friends for days on end.

All the kids had a ball running around the hill, swimming, shewing away cows and swinging on the porch swing. I got a kick out of swatting bumble-bees with a tennis racket.

My awesome sister (in-law) (I don't like to say "in-law" cause she's my one and only sister soooo... that's why the parenthesis...I thought about just saying sister on the blog but then you all would have thought my brother married my sister and well...the Kentucky jokes would fly now wouldn't they) LOL

Anyway, My awesome sister (in-law) hung out with me and chatted and let me nap and sleep and relax so that our weekend vacation was actually a relaxing event. Our boys didn't have time to be bored since there were acres to play on, a pool to swim in and a large house to navigate. The dogs and cows kept them so busy that I barely saw any of them while we were there. Thank you LeAnn for the relaxing weekend!

(I want one of those fake out-houses! Those are fake boots under the door! LOL)

Zachary, my brother, your talented Tile Laying Magic is amazing! I could NOT believe how awesome your floors looked! No wonder people pay you the big bucks to lay their tile. You're an artist, my brother. :o)

Anyway, Keisha turned 16 and had an awesome party. Shayla is taller than Keisha now and looking like a runway model. I just can't believe how tall they all are these days!

My parents came over to grab a few fruit smoothies and we all got to take some time out to play with our family.

There's just nothing like family to lower the blood pressure and fresh, Kentucky, country air to breathe a little life back into these weary, city bones of mine.

But all good things must come to an end. I got to hug Keisha, Shayla, Brooklyn, Caleb and Ryker...I got to hang out with them, party with them and laugh with them...and sometimes AT them.

Our boys also got laughed at quite a bit. LOL

It was a good weekend but as pretty as the country view can be....It only took one look at Detroit, as we rolled up the highway, to put a smile on my face and prompt a photo shoot from our vehicle.

Yes, it was good to see my old Kentucky home, with it's lightning bugs and rolling hills but the City does call to me.

She lights up brighter and rolls a little longer in these eyes.

You know what? I think it's perfectly, alright to love Bluegrass, MoTown and Rock City all at one time. We only live once; Might as well appreciate it all.

HELLO GENTLEMEN

2010-06-30T16:39:00.002-04:00

Wednesdays are "Homeschool Park Day" in our neck of the woods. Each Wednesday a group of area homeschoolers gather together to play, run and roam the local park while mom's chat and relax in the nice, Summer breeze.

Today was no exception.

I gathered Kole, Daxx and "Chickadee," our foster daughter, into our 1 ton family van. We began to roll down the road when it became quite apparent that we were all very hungry, so I decided to drive over to our favorite Little Caesars to grab a Hot N Ready pizza....as usual.

I was driving along, when I looked back, through the rear view mirror. I couldn't help but notice that my little babies are just not babies any more. They were sitting, quietly, right beside one another, chatting and getting along as if they were happy as larks to just hang out together.

I drank in the serenity and decided that this would be a good day for Kole and Daxx to go inside to get the pizza and pop by themselves.

Yes, today they are men.

I gave Kole 10 bucks, explained that he will do the talking...because he talks best and can be understood...and Daxx will grab the 2 liter of cola while Kole orders the pizza and pays the man.

As I sat in our van, right outside the store window...just in case help were needed....I couldn't help but sneek a little picture of their very first grown-up action taking place.

If you squint really hard you will see Kole and Daxx standing in front of the counter chatting with the owner.

They were all smiles when they emerged from the Pizza Parlor with their pizza box and 2 liter of Mt. Dew.

I asked them how it went.

Kole: "The man said, 'Hello Gentlemen.' "
Daxx: "And he gave us Animal Cookies!"

Yes, today our little 6 1/2 year old gentlemen navigated the adult world on their own. :o) It was a good day.

NEVER FLOAT

2010-06-28T17:25:00.000-04:00

I, listening to ABBA, dive into memory. Our first, born six weeks early, my desire to make him strong,

Our sons laughing, splashing down the water slide, our foster daughter, asking to change her swimsuit,

Time, swishing by;

They, untying family, adopted children, unknitting hearts, patchworking normalcy, bonds,

Mesh, city-folk, let go of frivolous, Feel the beat, vibrating, bouncing from the black man's car;

Swish, swish;

Hope, pray, abhor the small towns; watch my boys, my hope of a daughter, watch them closely; Do not become oil,

Immerse in truth, NEVER only tolerated, only floating, never accepted; Boys, my daughter, watch, look, listen,

Swish, swishing time;

Realize difference; kindness or pity; generosity or obligation; Detect and define

Will they find the soul that God made for them; Family, real family, one to cleave.... All others fade.

Time, it swishes;

They take, we keep, they spend, we remember; Pour into souls, emotion, experience.

Swishes on by;

City, take us. Immerse children. Immerse! We cannot float. We will not float. Nevermore

No Time, No time to waste

Shelly Rae

HOMESCHOOL ICE CREAM SOCIAL/BBQ/FIELD DAY

2010-06-21T17:24:00.000-04:00

Well It's June and that can only mean one thing....well...it can mean many things but for this post is can only mean one thing...and THAT'S the 5th Annual Homeschool Ice Cream Social!

This is the time of year when the kids from the Homeschooling World in our neck of the woods gather together to make a 40 Foot Ice Cream Sundae/Banana Split, Hop on the Bounce House and Play Games.

The Ice Cream Sundae idea originated with my father. He used to plan an event much like this for the kids in our church. (I'm the curly headed kid with the striped shirt.)

I remember it to this day....and that's why I plan it for our boys and the Homeschool group I founded.

This year, even the teens got in on the action, riding tricycles and running around the obstacle course.

It is a lot of work to put together and I have to thank my WONDERFUL Husband. He's my backbone through all of the orchestrated chaos.

A HUGE thank you goes out to all of the Homeschooling Parents in our group for bringing supplies and running the games. This could not be done as efficiently and run as smoothly without all of their help.

This is the last year that Kazz will be a "child" for the event. He turns 18 next month. *sob*

It gives me a little tear to see the picture of him and his crew. I was surprised to see that our Brise is the tallest of the bunch and that doesn't make me feel any better. They've all grown so much.

But, that's why we do these things, I suppose. These memories last a life-time and hopefully our kids will do the same thing for our grand-children in the future.

We counted over 150 in attendance. It was a beautiful, breezy day and couldn't have gone any better.

My favorite part of the day was playing catch with my boys. They all have quite an arm and gave me a run for my money in the catching department. I think it may be time to start that ball team people are always accusing Brian and me of having. :o)

There's just nothing quite like the feel of a stinging fast ball hitting my 25 year old ball glove, delivered by my boy. Nope. Nothing like it at all.

Saturday was a good day....a really good day.

WE'RE REBELS

2010-06-06T21:22:00.000-04:00

I turned Forty. *sigh* Yep, I turned the big 4-0. I have been saying that I'm 40 since my 39th birthday....just to get used to the idea. Once it actually got here, I sort of stopped saying it. It's just not the same when it's true.

I've never been one to have a big birthday celebration or ask for big gifts for my birthday. I just don't have much interest in yahooing around once a year just because I was born on that day. This year, however, my husband thought it was time to change that situation. He planned a party at a local Bistro. He called some of our closest friends and to my amazement, they showed up to support me on my big day!

I didn't know about the party at first, but Brian let the cat out of the bag sooner rather than later. I guess he had to because he was bringing the balloons to the event and I, of course, would be riding with him! LOL

We, and our friends, met up at a local Bistro where we Feather Bowled, ate, hung out and chatted until the Bistro closed. I had a great time and am starting to think that this should be a yearly event!

I sort of like having a big birthday party. I especially like the Broadway Tickets to 6 Broadway shows that my hubby bought for me!

I wonder how many years in a row I can cajole my buddies into coming out to celebrate? All I know for sure is, I've missed out on a lot of fun and plan to make up for it in spades! Next year we're totally going to Vegas you guys! (...or maybe we'll have a BBQ)

HI MOM!

2010-06-06T20:56:00.001-04:00

I haven't been blogging as much as I used to. It's really a shame, because many of our family memories are held within this blog. I've even had a hard-cover book made of "half" of this blog. It serves as a family scrapbook and has been a joyful read.

The kids crack up at their pictures and our son, Vinze, has dubbed it his favorite book in the world.

My mother, who lives in Kentucky, has commented a few times that she misses the family blog. This used to be the place she would surf to find out how we are doing and see how the kids have grown. I've slacked off long enough I suppose.

I've decided to pick blogging back up, full force. I hope to add memories and pictures and rants, on a regular basis. I hope my mom and dad love getting to see what's going on with our family. I hope Blogger keeps on being free so I can continue to print books to keep as family treasures. I hope my 15 minute a day, self imposed limit, to free myself of Facebook holds out! Facebook keeps me from blogging!

I hope my mom is reading this because I've written this post to say, Look-out, Mom! I'm back! :o)

American Idol

2010-05-27T10:08:00.003-04:00

You Died, serving our Country.

Thank You.

You carried him/her from the field, from the ocean, from the water, from the road.

Thank You.

You made them ready to come home.

Thank You.

You flew with them, drove with them, sailed with them, home.

Thank You.

You gave us your child.

Thank You.

You gave us your parent.

Thank You.

You gave us your husband, your wife, your sister, your brother, your blood.

Thank you....

is not enough, for the

True American Idols.

(Shelly R. Mabe 2010)

2010 MICHIGAN HOMESCHOOL PROM CRUISE

2010-05-09T14:26:00.004-04:00

April 30th marked the 2nd Annual Michigan Homeschool Prom. It was held, once again, aboard the Elegant Detroit Princess in Downtown Detroit, Michigan.

The Detroit Princess is a beautiful, 5 story riverboat with chandeliers and stunning views; Located between COBO Hall and the GM Renaissance Center.

The Ship is enclosed, heated and air conditioned. What more could we ask for?
How about a 2 1/2 hour Cruise DURING our 6 hour prom! Oh Yes! Truth it be!

This is the second year that I've planned and organized the Michigan Homeschool Prom.
It's been a joy to work with the ship and watch the kids have a ball dancing and hanging out with old friends and New Acquaintances.

Our sons, Kazz and Brise, have attended with their friends both years. Brise is still a bit young to go, but he helps decorate so he gets to enjoy the party too.

Brise (age 13)

Kazz and Becca

Becca

Last year, Kazz danced his hiney off with his girlfriend, Becca. This year, he danced his hiney off with his fiance, Becca. :o) Brise didn't feel comfortable dancing last year, so he didn't. However with a year of maturity, some prodding from big brother, Kazz, and help from the DJ, who taught the kids to dance, before letting the music rule the evening, he got out there and shook his groove thing some this year.

Jade

The Masquerade Theme was a hit.

The evening was a beautiful 80 degrees and breezy.

Brian and I are so thankful to have such wonderful friends who worked their tails off as Chaperons.

I think I'll let the pictures speak for themselves.
(Not Pictured: Randy & Ellen, Rita J., Jeannine G., Andre)

If you live in Michigan, The USA or Canada and feel like attending next year, feel free to join the Facebook Group to follow updates for the 2011 Homeschool Prom Cruise! (Click Here)

Hope To See You There!

My Parents

Our Friends: Joel & Stacy

Our Friends: Keith & Jen

Our Friends: Dan & Dawn

FACEBOOK SUCKS

2010-04-17T00:58:00.000-04:00

In 2008 I joined Facebook and now....my world is one big computerized mess!

Oh sure, it started out easy enough. I friended all of my real life friends. I recruited a bunch of my buddies to join the madness. We played games, took quizzes, commented about how the quizzes were pathetic, had spelling errors and were an utter waste of time....but kept taking them anyway just to pass the time away until the wee hours of the morning.

That craziness wore off just in time to find friends from my old high school, my last high school, my grade school, my clubs, my churches, my parent's friends, my kids, my kids buddies, my kids buddies parents, my family, friend's of family, my past work associates, my college professors, my buddy from my radio DJ days, and various blasts from the past that I still can't quite put my finger on...but I know I just HAVE to know them from somewhere.

So it was that I was friending here, friended there, friending, friended everywhere. It was a hoot.

Weeks turn into days, days into months and months into present day. At any given moment I can get caught up on my old friends' lives, find out more that I care to know about new acquaintances, check out everyone's photos and give the thumbs up whenever the mood strikes, for any reason, for any random event.

All of that is well and good...but...in the process of all this catching up...I found out that an old...OLD...flame got married, divorced, and weird. I found out that some of my weirder friends turned out pretty normal. I found out that some of my goody-two-shoe friends got their freak on and others...put on Jesus...and I just keep reading more and more about people from my past. Sounds great, right?

It would seem that way, but something funky has happened. All of the sudden...about 6 months ago....the excitement of Facebook...wore off!

For a while now, I've gone on there to check out pictures, make sure that everyone is fine, post a few blurbs on my status and try to get off of there as soon as I can. I couldn't put my finger on it, but I knew that Facebook...somehow...kind-of ruined something for me.

Something just hasn't felt "right." I have been going about my day all bummed and out of sorts. I couldn't put my finger on it for so many months...but today, I think I figured it out!

The mystery is gone.

I no longer have fun memories to carry me away when I'm stressed out or need a break from the reality I have going on here at home! Why?

Well...

That old flame from teenage past no longer flits through my mind as a fun, little, youthful romantic memory. He's sitting right in front of me on the screen all old and taking up space in my "real" world. That's not youthful OR fun.

My childhood buddy who used to ride through the muddy, water filled ditches with me on bicycles as a kid is now a Democrat....and she's equally annoyed to find out that I'm not.

My spunky friend who was always laughing and showing the world what was what...now argues with her mother, hates work and wishes she could quit her job.

Facebook! You Stupid, Stupid thing! You sucked the fun, quirky, never to be found out mysteries of my youth right out of my life! All of my warm, fuzzy, breezy memories that swept away my stress in times of angst are now replaced with reality. What a stupid, stupid thing!!!

Reality sucks. Reality really is just boring, real life, no fun, darn daily life. And sure...we're blessed and happy and life is truly special...and it's all good for the most part...but OLD memories...those warm, special, only I get to return to those days moments are now gone! :o(

I used to return to childhood at any given point in my day and smile. I used to feel the rain on my face, the mud splashing up my back from my bicycle tire and the water swishing by my legs as I peddle through the ditches. Now...I think of politics and my friend, the democrat.

I, at the very least, enjoyed pretending that those spunky people from my past somehow kept that spark of youth, that uncontrolled love for life and were able to side-step the hum-drum daily yolk of the world.

But no...today my memories are displayed before me in all their glory. All real and ordinary and true. Nothing for the fantasy, wispy dream world of yesteryear. It's all here, all real and all gone.

Thanks Facebook.

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hmmm...

I wonder if my best friend from the First Church of God has a Facebook page yet? When I was 11 years old, I would spend summer days at her house. She had a pool in her backyard and we used to eat peanut-butter and jelly sandwiches on the porch and prank call Joey Darling. Man, those were the days... Oh Wait!

THE WHOLE RELIGION THING

2010-04-12T00:05:00.004-04:00

Here is Catholic/Protestant Post Number Five!
:o)

I'm sorry it's taken so long to get this written. Life is hopping over here at our home. Things...they are a changin'.

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As most of you know by now, I am a Bible Belt Protestant who has been trying to understand "the other" Christians for well over a year now.

I began these posts in an attempt to figure out my good friend's religious beliefs because I was intrigued and frankly, didn't understand how anyone could actually be Catholic if they have read the same Bible that I read.

Well, God has a sense of humor, now doesn't He. He decided to show me just how little I actually know about Catholicism. My "knowledge" consisted of half truths, complete misunderstandings and total falsehoods.

God surrounded me and my family with wonderful friends who are faithful, practicing Catholics. They have learned a lot about what Protestants believe....and why. And, I have learned a lot about what Catholics believe....and why. There has been a beautiful, mutual respect that is felt deeply. I am so happy about that.

And guess what! NONE of my Catholic friends have ever paid a Priest off so they could have their sins forgiven. wellll...who knew! LOL

Of course I jest, but the sad truth is that some Protestants believe this kind of thing when the reality is that practicing Catholics are focused on Jesus and have a very sincere desire to do His will. THAT is something I did not know. I "thought" they worshiped Mary. I "thought" they had to talk to her to get to Jesus and.... I have to say ... I was amazed to find out that Catholics actually PRAY to JESUS for forgiveness! Gasp...

Imagine my surprise when I found out that not one of my Catholics friends live like the devil during the week and then go to Church on Sunday just to check in with their Priest so they can go out and live a life of sin again for the next 6 days. Sadly...I held that view for a time too.

Yes, I was Pharisee material my friends...with a Capital "P." I had a funky idea of what Catholics believe, I thought I had it all figured out and God had a very interesting way of changing my view of my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ.

Thank you Jesus.

Not only have I found that Catholicism is based on the Bible, I found that much of what I believe as a Bible Belt Protestant is also actually taught in Catholicism...but "worded" differently. My understanding has grown, my Faith has grown and friendships have deepened through these interesting conversations.

To my Protestant and Catholic Friends: If you feel led to say something, please read the other 4....longgggg posts before inquiring about certain things regarding either religion because I've touched on and answered many common concerns and questions about both religions. I'm hoping I don't have to "re-visit" old topics so I can concentrate on new concerns and/or excitement. I LOVE to look for the answer to direct questions. All respectful comments and questions are enjoyed and we have nothing to lose by asking! Bring them on. :o) This is how all of these posts have come into being. (See the numbered questions below from a Catholic about Protestants. The misconceptions are actually mutual.) :o)

If there were ever a time to jump in with concerns or blessings...now is the time.

Click for...

POST NUMBER 1: EVANGELICAL ME AND MY CATHOLIC FRIENDS

POST NUMBER 2: THE WHOLE CONFESSING TO A PRIEST THING

POST #3: WHAT DO CATHOLICS BELIEVE?

POST #4: DO CATHOLICS PRAY TO DEAD SAINTS?

POST #5: THE WHOLE RELIGION THING

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My husband has always hinted to me that he wants to be Catholic, but I've always assumed that he was joking. How I could have interpreted the words, "If I have to pick a religion Shelly, it would be Catholic" as a joke, I do not know. Maybe my Protestant born and bred genetics find that statement amusing but the reality is...he was NOT joking. He just knew that I could not go there...at that time.

He's been patient. He's been precious. But, now...he will no longer attend a Protestant church because HE is led to his roots. So, it has come down to this...After 20 years of marriage, my husband wants to go back to the particular Christian Religion he was born into. He has told me recently that he's not Protestant...so, there you have it. Ack! Those are words I understand...clearly.

I've told my husband that I will have more questions than the Priest may want to answer during our "Catholic Classes", but the information I've learned over the past year has really been an eye opener for me. I am so blessed to have so many Protestant and Catholic, Jesus Worshiping, friends who love and hold us up in prayer no matter what our religious choice. I am so blessed by all of you!

My husband has assured me that he has questions of his own. Who knows what we will learn or where we will end up, but one thing is for sure...Our family will worship JESUS together...As Always...wherever He leads us.

I have had a few friends who have pulled away from us in the past few months. I sense that they are uncomfortable with our choice, though they haven't outright mentioned it. It may be that they "think" we may try to convert them to Catholicism? I don't know...but I'm just a Jesus Christian. If people worship in a different "kind" of church than I do...I don't feel the need to "convert" anyone to anything. Goodness knows, I've attended just about every kind of Protestant church there is to be had! LOL In my lifetime, I've attended everything from the Nazarene Church to the quiet First Church of God to the loud, running the isles, talking in tongues Church of God.

They all leads us to Jesus so, to me...It's all Good! :o)

There's that revelation...some are more shocked than others I'm sure. :o)

Now on to the most recent questions posed to me. To read the other posts in order...click the links above. :o)

I'm going to number the questions that have been presented to me since Post Number 4 and then give the answer just to keep this as simple as possible.

Here we go!

Question 1: "Why are you using Wikipedia...I talked with a friend of mine and she just shook her head that you used Wikipedia as a source for information."

Answer: I sometimes use Wikipedia as a "jumping board" to find cited books, articles and history where I can THEN GO to find the sources and back up any answer I "think" I know so I can be sure to have facts to support the conclusions. I don't believe Wikipedia on face value.

Question 2: from a Catholic in blog comments: "I don't understand why Protestants believe that you can confess Jesus as Savior once and you cannot go to hell after that, regardless of what you do."

ANSWER: We don't believe that.

That is a HUGE misconception some Catholics have about Protestants. Aren't you glad we don't believe that! :o)

There is a sect of the Baptist Church that believe this, however MOST Protestants do NOT believe this AT ALL. We are constantly praying and asking Jesus to forgive our sins. We pray all the time. We are told to be in a constant state of prayer and faith believing. We are also told to pick up our cross daily....meaning....choose daily to live our lives for Christ. Basically, we believe He saves us when we pray to Him for forgiveness...sort of like the day Catholics take their first communion and have their first confession...that would be the "day" we would say we were "saved" HOWEVER, we KNOW that we have to always ask for forgiveness and TRY to live the best that we can to do the work Jesus has planned for our lives. We DON'T believe we can go and commit crimes, willfully sin and forget God's plan for us and still get to Heaven just because we prayed one time. That's crazy talk to us.

Question 3: from a Catholic in blog comments: "In the case of believing the "Bible alone", what do Protestants think people did for the first 1500 years of Christianity without a Bible?"

ANSWER: There are a few "schools of thought" on this subject.

A. Some protestants never even consider this. Some of us have a huge gap in our historical knowledge. We assume that the churches formed after Jesus resurrection were configured "like ours" and worshiped like we do today because that is how we worship. We just never even "think" to go look up how the Apostles and people worshiped in the years after Christ's death because we "think" we already know. We "assume" we are doing what they did.

B. SOME protestants believe that the Catholic church "hid" the Bible for those years and God protected the "real" church as a "remnant" that practiced His teachings in private and later became the Baptist Church. Some even try to trace their lineage to the apostles through the Waldenses. Many of the older Waldensian histories speak of them as a body of Christians, hiding in the Alps from the days of the original apostles, or at least from the time of Claude, archbishop of Turin. But the eminent French historian Jean-Pierre Poly has shown that from 883 until 972 (nearly a full century) that Saracen pirates fully controlled southeastern France and the Alpine passes. All inhabitants of the areas later known as the Waldensian Valleys were swept off. There simply could not have been a continuous group there.

C. Other Protestant acknowledge that we were obviously taught the Bible from the Catholic Church. Many of us have studied history and know that the Catholic Church translated the Bible, Put the books in order, Chose the books of the Bible and was the only source where the Bible was even accessible for over 1500 years after Christ's resurrection. We acknowledge that nobody owned a Bible of their own until they could be copied by a printer...so obviously The Catholic Church was THE Church for those many, many, years. However, we also believe that after Martin Luther "righted the wrongs" that were occurring in parts of the Catholic Church at the time, well....we believe that the Catholic Church ceased to be the Universal Church left behind by Christ. We believe that somehow, during that time, the Eucharist ceased to be as important and that now "anyone who believes in Christ will go to Heaven" even though the Bible does say that "NOT everyone who says Lord, Lord will enter the Kingdom of Heaven."

I know it sounds funky. That's just how it is. The Protestant Reformation took place. It is what it is. Some people believe that the Wolves in Sheep's Clothing in the Catholic Church tainted the Church as a whole and others do not. It's that simple. Those who don't think the Church was tainted hold to the truth that no Dogma was created during that dark historical time and believe that the Catholic Church is still the same Church that gave us our Bible. Those who think the Church WAS tainted forever, believe that we can be any kind of Protestant we want and get to Heaven. It's that simple. It's just something that has to be accepted at face value, because it's that simple.

Question 3: from a Catholic in blog comments: "Why are you (protestants) so scared of Mary? Because you're scared of sounding Catholic, who you think "worship" Mary?"

ANSWER: We (Protestants) are very concerned that people begin to take their eyes off of having a Relationship with Christ when we begin honoring the vessel that carried Him.

Basically, Protestants understand that she was His earthly mother, but we wouldn't dream of talking to her because we don't "talk" to anyone other than Jesus. We believe that giving Mary honor in our daily lives or asking Her to talk with Jesus for us is actually hindering OUR relationship with Christ. We believe this because the time we spend talking with Mary could be time we build our relationship with Jesus. We actually think we would be offending Jesus by asking Her to go to Him for us because He's the one who died for us, so we believe His love for us FAR supersedes any love She could have for us.

All of that said....though we think she was wonderful....we would never think that she can hear us down here anyway. We are not brought up to believe that people in Heaven can hear us at all. We believe we will see each other in Heaven again, but we are all worshiping together....without actually "being" together until we meet again in Heaven.

Cutting to the chase: We don't put anyone between us and Christ because we are to have a full, committed relationship with HIM. Anyone who would come between that relationship is a hindrance to our time with Christ.

HOWEVER....The Bible says that the prayers of the Righteous avails much...(James 5:16)....and after reading about the Great Cloud of Witnesses (Hebrews Chapters 11 and 12) and the portion of Revelation where our prayers are being given to Jesus...(Rev. 5:6-9 and Rev. 8:3-4) I am inclined to believe that Saints can indeed hear us and present our prayers to Jesus. I have come to understand that Saints in Heaven could help us reach the Throne of God as PRAYING people of God, just like our friends here on earth who pray for us when we need prayer. Prayer requests are okay. In THAT relationship, I understand talking with Mary....HOWEVER...There are many Catholics who actually ask Saints to "do" Supernatural things...like find them a house, keep them safe...etc. That is not what the Catholic Church teaches...if I'm reading the Catechism correctly. When we take our eyes off of Christ and begin asking other Saints to "DO" things for us, rather than "ASK" things for us...we have then replaced our Jesus with His creations which is not something I'm willing to do.

Question #4: "But Catholics believe that unbaptized babies go to something called Limbo and will never see the face of God."

Answer: One thing I've learned about Catholicism is that there are many people in the Catholic Church. Where there are people, there will be vast differences in how people "interpret" their religion's teachings. If you know one Catholic, you know one thought. If you know two...you know two stances. Until you read what the church actually teaches for yourself...you will not KNOW that these stances "could" be beliefs that those specific families hold as truths that may indeed go directly against Actual Catholic Teachings.

Here's a snippet about "Limbo"

Since at least the time of Augustine, theologians, considering baptism to be necessary for the salvation of those to whom it can be administered, have debated the fate of unbaptized innocents, and the theory of the Limbo of Infants is one of the hypotheses that have been formulated as a proposed solution. Some who hold this theory regard the Limbo of Infants as a state of maximum natural happiness, others as one of "mildest punishment"....This theory, in any of its forms, has never been dogmatically defined by the Church... (source)

To Sum Up: Limbo has never been Dogma in the Catholic Church.

For those who are Protestant: we can liken this thought to the Faith Healing debate. Some Christians believe we can pray for healing and get it no matter what. Others believe we can pray for healing and God may choose to take us home to Heaven to heal us perfectly. Either way....we're still Christians...nobody knows "who, how, why" some are healed and others are not but we can all agree that God holds the final answer. When we get there...we will know. This is a matter of debate, faith and interpretation among people of a certain faith...this is NOT taught as Dogma for the entire Catholic church and Faith Healing is NOT taught as Dogma in every Protestant religion.

Question 5: from a Catholic in blog comments: "What do Protestants make of Jesus on the cross saying, "here is your mother", and "here is your son"? Why even mention it in the Bible if it is insignificant?"

ANSWER: Protestants believe that Jesus was making sure she was going to be taken care of after He left earth. Nothing more, nothing less. It's that simple.

Why was it significant? Because it may answer the age old question..."Did Mary Remain a Virgin after Jesus' Birth?"

I have to wonder why Jesus would ask someone.... who is NOT His "brother".... to take care of Mary....IF...she had other children. (as most Protestants happen to believe) I was always taught that Mary had other children...and I believed it because I didn't know that "brother and sister" could mean Aunt, Uncle, Cousin etc...in those days. So IF she had other children...Why appoint someone else to care for her other than one of her natural born sons... a natural brother of Christ? That would be a huge offense to Jesus' natural family IF he had other siblings. (There's another pickle my Protestant mind has to navigate.)

Question 6: This was a statement from my family member. "Communion is "like" the last supper. It "represents" Christ and is to remind us of Him. It's not actually Him, Sacramentally."

ANSWER: I understand this position. I respect that stance and certainly don't expect that everyone is going to beleive the way I do on any given subject. I will explain how my mind processes this information but please don't assume that I think everyone has to agree with me...

My personal answer to this is that I often wondered how we could damn ourselves to Hell by drinking grape juice. When I was a child watching people take communion at our little First Church of God in Ohio it looked like everyone was so uncomfortable with doing it. It seemed like everyone was trying to "get into" the act but it never did quite "feel" right to me.

When I started studying history I found a lot of information about how Communion (the Eucharist) was celebrated. I now realize that I would like to be a part of the Original Design. And...in my mind...there is nothing new under Heaven, God does NOT change, so what Jesus put forth as an example should be kept true to it's origins. Thus...keep the form it had when Christians were risking their lives in the Catacombs to take the Eucharist. I don't want to do it "like" they used to. I want to do IT...take THE Eucharist....the one He Passed Down and People Died to take while trying to keep IT in HIS true form. Back then...The Eucharist WAS church.

Here's a snippet of information from History just after Jesus' Resurrection. In one of the first Christian texts, St. Justin the Martyr narrates how the Eucharist was celebrated during the ancient times.

"And on the day called Sunday, all who live in cities or in the country gather together to one place, And the memoirs of the apostles or the writings of the prophets are read, as long as time permits; then, when the reader has ceased, the president verbally instructs, and exhorts to the imitation of these good things. (San Justino) Then we all rise together and pray, and, as we before said, when our prayer is ended, bread and wine and water are brought, and the president in like manner offers prayers and thanksgivings, according to his ability, and the people assent, saying “Amen”; and there is a distribution to each, and a participation of that over which thanks have been given, and to those who are absent a portion is sent by the deacons. And this food is called among us Εὐχαριστία [the Eucharist], of which no one is allowed to partake but the man who believes that the things which we teach are true, and who has been washed with the washing that is for the remission of sins, and unto regeneration, and who is so living as Christ has enjoined. For not as common bread and common drink do we receive these; but in like manner as Jesus Christ our Saviour, having been made flesh by the Word of God, had both flesh and blood for our salvation, so likewise have we been taught that the food which is blessed by the prayer of His word, and from which our blood and flesh by transmutation are nourished, is the flesh and blood of that Jesus who was made flesh. For the apostles, in the memoirs composed by them, which are called Gospels, have thus delivered unto us what was enjoined upon them; that Jesus took bread, and when He had given thanks, said, "This do in remembrance of Me, (Lk 22:19) this is My body;" and that, after the same manner, having taken the cup and given thanks, He said, "This is My blood;" and gave it to them alone. And we afterward continually remind each other of these things. And the wealthy among us help the needy; and we always keep together; and for all things wherewith we are supplied, we bless the Maker of all through His Son Jesus Christ, and through the Holy Spirit.
(St. Justin the Martyr, Letter to Antoninus Pius, Emperor, 155 AD)

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Well that sums up the questions from the past few weeks. It's hard to put this stuff "out there" because now you are reading it. But in the end, this blog is for my children. This is the path your dad and I took in April of 2010. These posts basically detail what we did and why. Always remember that no matter what you believe...Respect other people's point of view and most of all LOVE PEOPLE! That is the gospel summed up. If you do that...everything else will fall into place.

When I've gone the way of the Dodo bird, please remember that your dad and I love you kids. Always hold to that and Jesus and you'll never be alone. :o)

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UPDATE: POST NUMBER 1: EVANGELICAL ME AND MY CATHOLIC FRIENDS

UPDATE: POST NUMBER 2: THE WHOLE CONFESSING TO A PRIEST THING

UPDATE: POST #3: WHAT DO CATHOLICS BELIEVE?

UPDATE: POST #4: DO CATHOLICS PRAY TO DEAD SAINTS?

UPDATE: POST #5: THE WHOLE RELIGION THING

HOMESCHOOLING ANSWERS TO RANDOM STRANGERS

2010-03-16T14:26:00.003-04:00

Imagine yourself in this situation. You are a normal everyday parent. You believe in God or you don't. You send your children to public school or private school. You are living your life as normal as the next fella when circumstances arise and you find yourself making a decision you never thought you would have to ponder. You are deciding whether or not to homeschool your child(ren).

It may be that your child is having difficulty with rules and regulations at school. It may be that your public or private school has shut down. It may be that you or your spouse is now working afternoons and will never be able to see the kids. It may be because you found out that your child can go to college early if they homeschool...whatever reason, here you are contemplating Home Education of all things!

You are a normal gal or guy. You never really gave it much thought before now but the more you look into the idea the more you see that there are other normal people, just like yourself, who are having a wonderful time with this kind of lifestyle.

You jump in with both feet and begin your new life. You are enjoying the kids, though freaking out a little that YOU have decided to do this but other than that things are going along smoothly.

One day you are wandering around town, in the middle of the day with your children when "IT" happens. You and your children are minding your own business at the grocery store, park, field trip, zoo, museum, nature hike, play date, Science Center, or some other random social activity when a complete stranger walks up to YOU, taps YOU on the shoulder and says,

"Why aren't they in school? Did the school have a day off today?"

You are now staring at a random stranger contemplating your response. For the very first time you are forced to see yourself through their eyes. You now have to say...out loud...

"We are a homeschooling family."

You are about to experience the wonder and awe of the human mind. You are about to witness ignorance at its best. That random stranger, after hearing your answer, will react emotionally to YOUR family...whom they have never met before this conversation....as if you have committed a purposeful attack on their very life. Yes, it will happen to YOU, my good friend.

After you have given your answer, the Random Stranger will say one of the following statements and you...YOU...could very well be standing there, stammering...wishing you had a response....but you won't! Why? Because you did not realize that you are now one of us!

You are now considered....dunn...dunnn....dunnn...."Not Normal!"

To other people you have morphed into whatever that specific person's idea of a homeschooler happens to be. YOU are..."that" homeschooler!!!

Some people understand that homeschooling is a difficult choice made by practical parents. Some may ask questions out of legitimate inquiry, but some people are flat rude, judgmental, nasty and they...need a jolt!

These answers are NOT funny...they are just true.

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HOMESCHOOLING ANSWERS TO RANDOM STRANGERS

Random Stranger:

"Why aren't your children in school today? Did the school have a day off?"

You:

"We are homeschoolers."

1. RS: "I don't have the patience for that. You must be a saint."
You: "If you are doing homework 2 to 3 hours a night, you're already doing it...welcome to Sainthood. We just don't have to do it after a hard day's work and we don't have the stress of having to get it done in some bureaucratic time-frame."

2. RS: "Is that legal?"
You: "Yes."

3. RS: "Do you have a teaching degree?"
You: "Do you have one? You are teaching your children every night when they bring homework to your home. Does your child's school have courses for parent's to take that will give them a degree to teach their own children...after the kids have been at school all day and are tired...and you are tired from working all day....and you now have to force them to get the work done on time, know it on time and memorize it on time or else? 'Cause....that's the degree I needed when our kids were in Public School."

4. RS: "Do you have a teaching degree?"
You: "Do you have hemorrhoids?"
(rude personal question begets rude personal question)

5. RS: "What gives you the right to do that?"
You: "Their birth certificate."

6. RS: "What about Socialization?"
You: "Between sports, camp, clubs, homeschool organizations and field trips we've decided we're going to have to cut back. We just have to decide where."

7. RS: "What about Socialization?"
You: "They weren't allowed to talk in class for 7 hours a day and only had 3 minutes between classes to chat, so we thought we'd take them out of that situation in the hope to teach them to socialize."

8. RS: "What about College."
You: "I know what you're thinking. You've heard about Harvard and Yale grabbing homeschoolers left and right and that colleges are now recruiting homeschoolers but we're not going to push that in our family. We're just going to send them to the local community college when they turn fourteen like many homeschooling families do. That way they can graduate homeschool with an associate degree when they are seventeen or eighteen instead of just starting their higher education."

9. RS: "You can't possibly teach them Algebra and Chemistry!"
You: "Do you remember your Algebra and Chemistry?"

10. RS: "You can't possibly teach them Algebra and Chemistry!"
You: "That's what the community college is for." or "That's what our Co-Op is for." or "That's what tutors are for." or "Sure I can." or ...you get the drift

11. RS: "You are abandoning our public schools! It's our responsibility to fix the schools."
You: "Are you saying private schools need to fold also? The Public Schools get my taxes...they are not entitled to have my kids."

12. RS: "Why would you want to shelter your children like that?!"
You: "Shelter them as in keeping them in the same class with the same kids for 13 years, day after day, year after year?"

13. RS: "Why would you want to shelter your children like that?!"
You: " Well, the horse and buggy became too cumbersome so I learned how to drive a car. We go on field trips and outings nearly every week...unlike most traditionally educated children who may have a field trip once a year."

and my personal favorite...

14. RS: "My brother-in-law/sister-in-law/fiancee's cousin....Homeschools and their kids are bratty/stupid/too shy/too assertive/too fat/too skinny/lazy/clean house all day/talk too loud/breathe too hard/don't have any friends/talk to their friends way too much......

You: "Yes, I'm sure it's because they are homeschooled.....Public Schooled kids are perfect."

DO CATHOLICS PRAY TO DEAD SPIRITS?

2010-03-02T14:02:00.027-05:00

I'm trying to keep up! :o)

I have had many emails and questions posed to me in person, via Facebook and via the "Contact Me" button on this blog since I wrote the "What Do Catholics Believe" post.

I've found that many people are much like I am, in that they have always wanted to ask the questions, but were too "afraid" to do so because...well...This Is About RELIGION! It's a touchy subject! LOL (and frankly, we are all adults and feel that we should already know much of this...but we don't...so here we are...)

I have been busy reading, questioning, sifting through the many answers and gathering information to try to answer the inquiries.

For those who are reading this blog for the first time, you should know that I am "just" a regular Bible-Belt Protestant who happened to move to Michigan.

This blog is our family blog...left for my children...so they can read mom's ramblings when I've gone the way of the dodo bird.

Cutting to the chase: Basically, everything goes into the blog because it's our scrapbook. Literally...I have it printed into a hard back book for a keepsake....Aren't you glad kids...grandkids.... :o)

It just so happens that I have, here in Michigan, met quite a few wonderful families over the past few years that happen to be PRACTICING Catholics. I have had the uncanny luck to become close friends with many of "them" AND have open, honest discussions with them regarding religion...that do NOT lead to debates, anger or even many uneasy moments. What a hoot! I blogged about this a year or so ago, and the post basically took on a life of its own. Now, I'm on post number four! LOL

These wonderful people have put up with me. They love me even though I have said completely ABSURD things like..."Why do you worship Mary?" "Why don't you pray to Jesus?" and "You have dirt on your forehead." (Ash Wednesday...for my Protestant friends. It's something like washing feet but enforces being humble AND repentant.)

So, if you are a protestant...especially from the Bible Belt...who wants to know "What's up with those Catholics"...I would suggest that you start from the beginning with post number one. Like-wise for Catholics as you'll get "our side" too. :o)

If you are a protestant and you have a question or information for me, please feel free to drop me a line. I don't "allow" anonymous comments on this blog. This helps me "weed" out those who wish to flame these posts. I'm truly thankful for the forthright, respectful, questions and comments that have been posed and enjoy looking up the answers.

So without further adieu...

Here is part 4 of MY understandings from "the other" Christians.

In this post, I'll pose the question asked to me and then give the answer I understood from research.

(online/off-line/in person)

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HERE WE GO

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Question 1: Why Is the Catholic Bible Different?
(Question posed by Tarla on Facebook)

This is usually where I would say "Protestant's Believe"... But, I'm not quite sure how ignorant I am compared to my Protestant counterparts and/or how well versed my Protestant counterparts are on this subject. So for this Question...I'm just going to type my heart out with what I've discovered. Here we go...

Please be aware that this particular question seemed ever so innocent to me. I didn't "think" I would find anything very interesting when I began researching this question. I do believe that this one...caught me off guard. In my Protestant mind I always assumed that the Apostles and early Christians worshiped like I do. It never dawned on me to actually check to see how they worshiped.
The answers I found are a bit unsettling; to me anyway. The research is causing me to delve more deeply into why I believe the "things" I do.

Here we go to answer Tarla's Original Question.

Why is the Catholic Bible Different?

Short answer:

Both Protestant and Catholic Bibles have the same New Testament...All 27 books are the same.
Catholic Bibles have 7 extra books in the Old Testament...BUT Protestants HAD THOSE SAME BOOKS in The King James Version....and took them out only 240 years ago.

What!? Oh yes. Truth it be.

These books are called the Apocrypha. These books were in ALL of our Bibles until....are you ready?... Until the 1700's! In 1769 publishers decided to save money and take out books that were in the front of the Bibles. (Granted...the push came from Puritans, and nobody knew what to do with the books for so many years, so it wasn't a great leap when they were dropped...it wasn't "just to save money" (see below: long version) but I can totally see how saving money played a part in this)

SO...All the people from Jesus' time...through the Bible making, printing, selling, preaching times...for OVER 1 Thousand 7 hundred years...had these books in their Bibles. What a Hoot! I'm 39 years old and did NOT know that!

Long Answer:

For many years I thought that the Catholic Bible was written by man...not the Holy Spirit. I "thought" they used something called the Catechism as their Bible. (Turns out that the Catechism is their doctrine, like Protestant churches have our own doctrine...statement of faith...rules of the church)

I didn't know that Catholics actually use "The Bible." It turns out that they do read The Bible because their doctrine is based on The Bible...and we're talking...The Same Bible.

Here is the difference between "their" Bible and "ours"...for the past 240 or so years...since 1769.

Both Protestant and Catholic Bibles have the same 27 books in the New Testament.

Catholic Bibles have 7 extra books in the Old Testament.

Why?

Before Jesus' time, around 2200 years ago, Jewish scholars put together all of the Jewish Scriptures. All of the books together in their entirety are called the Septuagint. (What we know as the Old Testament plus more books that we've taken out over time...since Jesus' resurrection.)

Now, here's the dicey part...and the part that shook my protestant psyche to the core...

The books of the Septuagint were placed in the original Authorized King James Version of The Bible. I was always taught that we read The King James Version because it doesn't change. Well, that's a fine how do ya do.

Side Note: The oldest translation of the Septuagint "still around" is from the time of Alexander the Great which is from about 350 A.D.

When the New Testament was being compiled with the Old Testament, some of the books of the Septuagint were moved around in The Bibles..some of the books were put in the appendix...sometimes various books of the Old Testament would be put in the beginning of the Bibles as a history about Bible Times. You just never knew in what order the Bible would be arranged next.
Eventually, over 100's and 100's of years...some of the books of the Bible were named the Apocrypha. They remained in the Bibles. Around 241 years ago, various Protestant people decided they didn't want the Apocrypha in their Bibles. The publishers took notice because they could save money by keeping the Apocrypha out of the Bibles...so they were taken out....with Martin Luther's Blessing....as he began messing with words in the Bible and what-not well before the 1700's. He's the one who added the word "alone" or "apart"....as in faith alone....at one point. He CHANGED Romans 3:28 and thus, started the debate between that verse and the teachings in the book of James.

Read more here...

And Read more here....

Side Note: So, am I to understand that ALL of those 1500 or so years...The Bible was translated by MANY people, Kings and Church Officials...and taught in Church....and NONE of them changed any words...but Martin Luther..."had"...to change a word or two to "make it work." (I'm getting nauseated...I need someone to help me with this...Anybody?) Now it's back to normal...I think. :o(

When Luther was challenged on any of his views of which Scripture to keep and which ones to take out, Luther said, "Thus I will have it, thus I order it, my will is reason enough."

This is one of the things that caught me off guard...Okay, there I admit it.

Granted, at the time when Luther was a Practicing Catholic, the Catholic Church in one area of the world was "selling salvation" and claiming that viewing or buying "things" belonging to Biblical Characters of the Bible would save them. Of course, that's terrible…AND non-Christian people were being killed for going against the Church....that was, of course, even worse.

The Faithful Practicing Catholics were still practicing the age old religion...some even underground...but the Pope at that time was a "wolf in sheep's clothing." So Luther had every right to demand that those false teachings be dissolved. (I hope I'm getting this right!)

We all know about the Inquisition...the Medieval practices through history where people were just killing each other left and right. We know that the "Catholic Church" did this. I have to interject that in my studies, I see that it wasn't "the Church" so much as it was just humans all over the place who were crazy. I found, in my historical studies that even good ole Martin Luther was quite the bugger himself. (Yes, our protestant founder...okay, I admit it) He wasn't "selling salvation" but he was calling for people to be put to death for their sins...just like people in the Catholic Church had been! Ack!!

Here are a few snippets...I'm only posting two but there are many.

Side Note: I'm putting this in here to be fair to both Protestants and Catholics. We all stunk back then...and before this time. History is riddled with our pathetic human carnage. That's sin for ya. We Protestants do like to "poo poo" that period of the Catholic Church for their heresies, but the truth is that both sides had some crazy notions about religion and how to handle those who don't believe like we do, during that time in history. So turnabout is FAIR play. :o)

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Concerning the female sorcerer. . . . Why does the law name women more than men here, even though men are also guilty of this?

Luther "Because women are more susceptible to those superstitions of Satan; take Eve, for example. They are commonly called "wise women." Let them be killed."(Sermon on Exodus 22:18: "You shall not permit a female sorcerer to live," 1526, WA XVI, p. 551; in Susan C. Karant-Nunn & Merry E. Wiesner-Hanks, ibid, p. 231)

Between September 2 and 17, 1540. No. 5207.
In Dessau there was a twelve-year old boy like this: (140) Luther: "he devoured as much as four farmers did, and he did nothing else than eat and excrete. Luther suggested that he be suffocated."
Somebody asked, “For what reason?”
Luther replied, “Because I think he's simply a mass of flesh without a soul. Couldn’t the devil have done this, inasmuch as he gives such shape to the body and mind even of those who have reason that in their obsession they hear, see, and feel nothing?“The devil is himself their soul."
-----------------------------

Side Note: So, there were some crazy things happening in the church at that time, though I found it interesting that during that time there was NO "new" Dogma written or declared in the Catholic Church....but in my denomination...Luther changed the age old teachings after he started his own church....I think....

Help? Any theology majors out there...pastors?

Anyone...give me your particular take on this, please.

Can someone, tell me when/where the Protestant religious teachings were taught...BEFORE Luther...in what Churches? I'm having a hard time finding "my" church history pre-Luther in historical records. I can only find "catholic" like service examples.

I'm reading The Letters to the Churches in the New Testament and I can find both "Catholic" teachings and "Protestant-esque" teachings written by Paul to the churches.

-------------------------

So, after ALL THAT MESS....

Eventually, in the protestant religions, the Apocrypha books were deemed NOT to have been divinely inspired and were taken out of the King James Version altogether.....only 241 years ago. (that made life easier I suppose...all of the sudden...someone decided they were not inspired...so there's that to chew on...my head hurts)

I had NEVER been taught about this...NOR did I ask about Biblical History so there's that situation. I have to take some fault upon myself for this as I am an adult and fully capable of truly, openly and honestly studying the history for myself...(but I digress)

Here is another source if anyone cares to delve into this more deeply.

So, the point is....Our Bibles used to be the same. The Old Testament is different....now.

WHY NOT EASTERN ORTHODOX?

(Question Posed by Emily K: What I want to know is why Catholic, and not Easter Orthodox. I'd like to compare both of those, since they both lean heavily on the church fathers.)

Hi Emily!

From Crossing The Tiber: "There is no central leadership to tie the various jurisdictions into one coherent whole. Thus the Eastern Orthodoxy "Church" is actually "Churches." Each jurisdiction is headed by a patriarch, but there is no single, overall hierarchical structure as in the Catholic Church. The Orthodox have always depended upon the SECULAR ruler, the emperor, to call the various Orthodox churches together for ecumenical councils. Since there is no emperor representing all the Orthodox churches, they have been unable to come together as a unified whole for more than one thousand year. They hold to the same ancient traditions as Catholics but have no mechanism for unification into one cohesive whole to this day. Therefore, they are in actuality churches, in the plural."

This is a paraphrased quote from a Catholic message board where I received this answer.

"The Catholic Church is composed of 22 distinct (but not seperated) Churches. The largest is, of course, the Roman Catholic Church. But there are several others such as, Byzantine Catholic and The Chaldean Church.... Most of the Christians in Iraq are actually Catholics of the Chaldean Church. There are Eastern Orthodox Churches within the 22 Churches. What is really neat about the Chaldean Church is that their liturgy is still in Aramaic, which was the language that Jesus spoke as His 'native' language. Each of those liturgies (sermons) is very distict from the regular Catholic liturgy, but has many of the same elements. Readings from Scripture, a homily (sermon), and a celebration of the Eucharist (Communion) And all are equally 'Catholic.'"

Strangely enough...the Eastern Orthodox Catholics that are "once removed" from The Catholic Church are actually in negotiations to become part of The Catholic Church again...so...it's all good any way you slice it.

"PRAYING" TO SAINTS

It is the official position of the Roman Catholic Church that Catholics do not pray TO saints or Mary, but rather that Catholics can ask saints or Mary to pray FOR them. The official position of the Roman Catholic Church is that asking saints for their prayers is no different than asking someone here on earth to pray for us. However, the practice of many Catholics diverges from official Roman Catholic teaching. Many Catholics do in fact pray directly to saints and/or Mary, asking them for help – instead of asking the saints and/or Mary to intercede with God for help.(source)

Don't Catholics Practice Necromancy and The Use of a Medium? (ie: Praying to "Dead" Saints)

I've said before that the idea of talking to people in Heaven is preposterous to Protestants. We only pray to Jesus. That's it. So the notion of asking a "dead" person in Heaven to pray for us is just really...it feels weird to even think about it...we just don't do it.

When I noted this in my previous "Catholic/Protestant Posts", I refrained from using more direct language in the hope that I could bypass this touchy subject but the question has been asked so an answer is in order.

Here's the deal...

Most Protestants believe that Catholics practice Necromancy when they talk with "Dead" Saints in Heaven.

There, the cat's out of the bag...pretty noisy cat...but it's out non-the-less.

The reason for this belief is due to the following scripture where Moses warns the Israelites against pagan practices that they will find in the new land. Here is the passage:

Deuteronomy 18: 9-14: " ⁹When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations. ¹⁰There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch. ¹¹Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer. ¹²For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee. ¹³Thou shalt be perfect with the LORD thy God. ¹⁴For these nations, which thou shalt possess, hearkened unto observers of times, and unto diviners: but as for thee, the LORD thy God hath not suffered thee so to do."

Catholics have read this passage. The Catholic understanding is that Moses is speaking to God's people and warning them against leaving their faith to join a cult. Ta Da. That's the sum total of that passage.

Protestant: What is the "sum total"?

Catholic Answer: Love God, Don't Join a Cult against God.

Protestant: Well, that's just not what that means...

Well...maybe...maybe not...let's get into the rest of what Catholics believe about this subject and then decide...

Catholic: Catholics believe that ALL Christians are one in Christ.

Protestant: agreed

Catholic: Catholics worship Jesus; So they are not summoning "dead" spirits, because...my Catholic friend reminded me.....the Saints are NOT Dead...so the whole "conjuring spirits" thing is a moot point. Catholics don’t talk to the dead OR follow a different god.

To which I answered with a Protestant..."Huh?"

Answer to my Protestant "Huh?": Catholics believe that Christians are "one in Christ" and thus "never die."

Protestant: Agreed.

Romans 12:4-5:

"For as in one body we have many members, and all members do not have the same function, so we, though many, are one body in Christ, and individually members of one another."

^{John 11: 25-26:}

²⁵Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: ²⁶And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

Well, do I believe that? In my Protestant way, sure. We're alive "in Heaven."
Let's keep reading shall we?

Luke: 20: 37-38

"³⁷Now that the dead are raised, even Moses shewed at the bush, when he calleth the Lord the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. ³⁸For he is not a God of the dead, but of the living: for all live unto him."

Protestant: Well okay, we are "alive" but He's talking about IN HEAVEN...it's not like they know what's going on down here...

Right?

Well, I did some digging. I guess I'd have to tell that to Elijah and Moses then....because One "died" and one was whisked away into Heaven...but after their "deaths"....Jesus came down to earth. Just before Jesus was put to "death"...ahem....He made a point to take some of his disciples on a little hike.

During that walk, both Elijah and Moses APPEARED, very much alive again on earth, and began having a chat with Jesus!

What?

Not only that...it all happened right there in front of HUMANS and God Himself was yelling at the disciples, freaking them out, telling them to Pay Attention!

Matthew 17

¹After six days Jesus took with him Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. ²There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light. ³Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus. ⁴Peter said to Jesus, "Lord, it is good for us to be here. If you wish, I will put up three shelters—one for you, one for Moses and one for Elijah." ⁵While he was still speaking, a bright cloud enveloped them, and a voice from the cloud said, "This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased. Listen to him!" ⁶When the disciples heard this, they fell facedown to the ground, terrified. ⁷But Jesus came and touched them. "Get up," he said. "Don't be afraid." ⁸When they looked up, they saw no one except Jesus."

(See also: Mark 9:2 and Luke 9:20)

Side Note: For many years I thought people were in Heaven completely oblivious to our lives here on earth. That passage makes me wonder. Then I read this...It's Long... but only because this scripture DETAILS nearly EVERY person of Faith in the Bible and then ties it up in a nice little bow to let us know that they are ALL SURROUNDING US....well...you just read it and see what you think...

Hebrews 11

By Faith

¹Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see. ²This is what the ancients were commended for. ³By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God's command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible. ⁴By faith Abel offered God a better sacrifice than Cain did. By faith he was commended as a righteous man, when God spoke well of his offerings. And by faith he still speaks, even though he is dead. ⁵By faith Enoch was taken from this life, so that he did not experience death; he could not be found, because God had taken him away. For before he was taken, he was commended as one who pleased God. ⁶And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him. ⁷By faith Noah, when warned about things not yet seen, in holy fear built an ark to save his family. By his faith he condemned the world and became heir of the righteousness that comes by faith. ⁸By faith Abraham, when called to go to a place he would later receive as his inheritance, obeyed and went, even though he did not know where he was going. ⁹By faith he made his home in the promised land like a stranger in a foreign country; he lived in tents, as did Isaac and Jacob, who were heirs with him of the same promise. ¹⁰For he was looking forward to the city with foundations, whose architect and builder is God. ¹¹By faith Abraham, even though he was past age—and Sarah herself was barren—was enabled to become a father because heconsidered him faithful who had made the promise. ¹²And so from this one man, and he as good as dead, came descendants as numerous as the stars in the sky and as countless as the sand on the seashore. ¹³All these people were still living by faith when they died. They did not receive the things promised; they only saw them and welcomed them from a distance. And they admitted that they were aliens and strangers on earth. ¹⁴People who say such things show that they are looking for a country of their own. ¹⁵If they had been thinking of the country they had left, they would have had opportunity to return. ¹⁶Instead, they were longing for a better country—a heavenly one. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared a city for them. ¹⁷By faith Abraham, when God tested him, offered Isaac as a sacrifice. He who had received the promises was about to sacrifice his one and only son, ¹⁸even though God had said to him, "It is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned." ¹⁹Abraham reasoned that God could raise the dead, and figuratively speaking, he did receive Isaac back from death. ²⁰By faith Isaac blessed Jacob and Esau in regard to their future.
²¹By faith Jacob, when he was dying, blessed each of Joseph's sons, and worshiped as he leaned on the top of his staff. ²²By faith Joseph, when his end was near, spoke about the exodus of the Israelites from Egypt and gave instructions about his bones. ²³By faith Moses' parents hid him for three months after he was born, because they saw he was no ordinary child, and they were not afraid of the king's edict. ²⁴By faith Moses, when he had grown up, refused to be known as the son of Pharaoh's daughter. ²⁵He chose to be mistreated along with the people of God rather than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a short time. ²⁶He regarded disgrace for the sake of Christ as of greater value than the treasures of Egypt, because he was looking ahead to his reward. ²⁷By faith he left Egypt, not fearing the king's anger; he persevered because he saw him who is invisible. ²⁸By faith he kept the Passover and the sprinkling of blood, so that the destroyer of the firstborn would not touch the firstborn of Israel. ²⁹By faith the people passed through the Red Sea as on dry land; but when the Egyptians tried to do so, they were drowned. ³⁰By faith the walls of Jericho fell, after the people had marched around them for seven days. ³¹By faith the prostitute Rahab, because she welcomed the spies, was not killed with those who were disobedient. ³²And what more shall I say? I do not have time to tell about Gideon, Barak, Samson, Jephthah, David, Samuel and the prophets, ³³who through faith conquered kingdoms, administered justice, and gained what was promised; who shut the mouths of lions, ³⁴quenched the fury of the flames, and escaped the edge of the sword; whose weakness was turned to strength; and who became powerful in battle and routed foreign armies. ³⁵Women received back their dead, raised to life again. Others were tortured and refused to be released, so that they might gain a better resurrection. ³⁶Some faced jeers and flogging, while still others were chained and put in prison. ³⁷They were stoned; they were sawed in two; they were put to death by the sword. They went about in sheepskins and goatskins, destitute, persecuted and mistreated— ³⁸the world was not worthy of them. They wandered in deserts and mountains, and in caves and holes in the ground. ³⁹These were all commended for their faith, yet none of them received what had been promised. ⁴⁰God had planned something better for us so that only together with us would they be made perfect. Chapter 12: ¹Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles, and let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us.

Did you see that? He names practically EVERY Wonderful Christian in the Bible. He details their GREAT Faith and then tells us that we are "Surrounded By Such a great cloud of witnesses" (Them!! The "Dead" people...who are really Alive.)

It is within THIS context that Catholics speak with and worship with our brothers and sisters in Christ.

They are not "conjuring dead spirits." They are praising God WITH, praying to God WITH, COMMUNING WITH our ALIVE brothers and sisters in Christ!

Now ALL of that said...

What Did The Apostles Say To Believe? Didn't the guys who walked with Jesus give us something to believe before we had a Bible to buy?

This is the Apostles Creed...written by all 12 Apostles...this is from the people who wrote the Bible...and is what Catholic also believe....and....what Baptists believe.

1. I believe in God, the Father almighty, creator of heaven and earth.

2. I believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord.

3. He was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit and born of the Virgin Mary.

4. He suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and was buried.

5. He descended into hell. On the third day he rose again.

6. He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father.

7. He will come again to judge the living and the dead.

8. I believe in the Holy Spirit,

9. the holy catholic Church, the communion of saints,

10. the forgiveness of sins,

11. the resurrection of the body,

12. and life everlasting.

Amen

Well...fiddle...There it is...right in the Bible... So Catholics believe we never are separated from other Saints...we're all Alive...and coming together to worship Christ at all times...even after death on this earth.

Also, Catholics will point to Revelation 5:6 where we will read about the elders who actually give prayers to Jesus...just like the Catholics happen to believe...

Revelations 5:6
John sees in Heaven "⁶Then I saw a Lamb, (Jesus) looking as if it had been slain, standing in the center of the throne, encircled by the four living creatures and the elders. He had seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven spirits of God sent out into all the earth. ⁷He came and took the scroll from the right hand of him who sat on the throne. ⁸And when he had taken it, the four living creatures and the the twenty-four elders (not angels) fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and with golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints (Christians) and they sang a new song: " You are worthy to take the scroll and to open its seals, because you were slain, and with your blood you purchased men for God from every tribe and language and people and nation. ¹⁰You have made them to be a kingdom and priests to serve our God, and they will reign on the earth."

Not only did/will those men hand Jesus our Prayers but the Angels will too apparently. In the book of Revelation, we read that after the bowl full of prayers and incense are placed on the altar: "[An] angel came and stood at the altar [in heaven] with a golden censer; and he was given much incense to mingle with the prayers of all the saints upon the golden altar before the throne; and the smoke of the incense rose with the prayers of the saints from the hand of the angel before God" (Rev. 8:3-4).

Shewwwww...So, there's THAT topic. What a doozey!

Now that I've done some research I have questions.

Can anyone...on either side of the "others" isle... help me out with some answers?

Thanks! :o)

1. Who created the "Final" version of the Bible?
2. Where in the Bible does it say that "they" were appointed the power to make the final version?
3. What did people use in the Hundreds of years before the Bible was compiled? They got to hear the Apostles preach and worship like the apostles. Right?
4. If the literacy rate was under 10%, and there were no compiled Bibles for hundreds of years after Jesus' death, how did people learn about Jesus in those hundreds of years?

Bible? No, it wasn't written in fully or compiled yet.

Oral Tradition handed down from generation to generation? Yes.

Right?

6. If there was no New Testament or compiled Bible to read...for over 400 years...and none that could be bought until the year 1455….how could "Bible Only" have been the basis for early Christians? Didn't they "have" to rely on Oral Tradition, just as the Jews did for all those thousands of years before Jesus was born?

7. When did "Bible Only" theology take affect?

My head...is spinning...Anyone have some Protestant answers?

I feel like I should know the answers to these things by now!

WHAT IS DOGMA?...
Original Question: (prefers to remain anonymous) "Do Catholics have to believe every single answer in the Catechism?"

As with any religion, there is a community of people that make up the body. Can we find a religion where every member believes all of the teachings in the exact same way? In a cult, maybe, in a recognized religion...it's highly unlikely.

When I heard the word Dogma I thought it meant "Catechism." I "thought" that every Catholic HAD to believe every single answer in that book. I "thought" that the Catechism WAS "their" Bible. I "thought" wrong.

In my defense, there was a long period of time when many Catholic Churches basically were headed by a Priest who didn't "push" the idea of reading the Bible. Many Catholics studied what the Church taught and never opened a Bible...some didn't even own one! This is not true of every Catholic person but in the past 30 years or so, there have been many Catholics who will attest that they didn't have the best "Sunday School." They feel that they are just now, as adults, really understanding their faith as it "should" have been presented. So, I came by this "misunderstanding" honestly.

The word Dogma is usually thought to mean just "the teachings of a church." Dogma can relate to any church really...their "Statement of Beliefs" is considered to be their "dogma."

In the Catholic Church, however, there is "Dogma" (teachings) that will NEVER change. There are indeed teachings that may be understood better, or answered in a more understandable way as time goes by; as the Catechism is less about beating people over the head with what they "have" to believe and more about answering questions that have been posed to the Deacons over these thousands of years. However, when the word Dogma is used in Catholicism, I'm finding that this is usually the word that defines the Teachings that are Unchangeable...

THE "you have to believe it, it's what Catholicism stands for"...DOGMA of the Catholic Church...
So, what is DOGMA in the Catholic Church? What does a Catholic "Have" to believe?

Answer: THE NICENE CREED

THE NICENE CREED....What is THAT???

Well, this, my protestant friends is the big question. This is "what Catholics have to believe to be Catholic."

The word "Catholic" means "Universal"...that's important later one... Here we go...

"We believe in one God, the Father, the Almighty, maker of heaven and earth, of all that is seen and unseen. We believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ, the only Son of God, eternally begotten of the Father, God from God, Light from Light, true God from true God, begotten, not made, one in being with the Father. Through Him all things were made. For us men and our salvation He came down from Heaven: by the power of the Holy Spirit, He was born of the Virgin Mary, and became man. For our sake He was crucified under Pontius Pilate; He suffered, died, and was buried. On the third day He rose again in fulfillment of the scriptures: He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father. He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead, and his kingdom will have no end. We believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life, who proceeds from the Father and the Son. With the Father and the Son, He is worshiped and glorified. He has spoken through the Prophets. We believe in one, holy, catholic,(universal) and apostolic (taught from Jesus' Apostles) Church. We acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.(Confirmation Baptism...the one where we are older and choose it..it also involves asking for forgiveness from Jesus) We look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen."

The "Catholic" and "Baptism" parts are taken from here..."There is one body and one spirit," Paul wrote, "just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call, one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of us all" (Eph.4:4-5).

They believe that the Holy Spirit came down upon the Church at Pentecost at a time when "there were dwelling in Jerusalem Jews, devout men from every nation under heaven" (Acts 2:5). It was then that the Holy Spirit temporarily enabled the apostles to speak in the languages of all these various nations. This was an absolutely powerful sign that the Church was destined for all men everywhere, (universal). Many people accepted the faith at that time and began the teachings of the Church. They carried those teachings back to their land(s).

What is Purgatory? The actual question was..."How can they possibly think there is such a place as purgatory?!" LOL

The history of Purgatory dates back before Jesus was here on earth. Click Here for the History. Basically Catholics believe that when a person dies, they will have the true knowledge that "God Is a Consuming Fire" Hebrews 12:29. It is at that time that the soul will go through Judgment day... immediately.

Catholics believe that the person/soul will find out where they are going right then. They either go to Heaven "in the Fire of God's Love", Hell "in the Fire of God's punishment" or "walk through fire"...(Purgatory)...to be purified by the Fire of Gods purgation....before they enter Heaven. Read a LOT more HERE

Purgatory is a completely foreign concept to Protestants. I can safely say that most protestants have never read the writings of the Early Church leaders...(the leaders of the Churches right after Christ's resurrection)…apart from the King James Vesion we know today. That's true for me anyway. I didn’t even know there were records about how churches were run and what-not.

The idea that it was "common knowledge" that there could be a "walk of fire" has never been presented to most Protestants. This is why we cannot understand how we would "Need" a "Walk of Fire" if Jesus has saved us and forgiven us from our sins.

Here’s The "Rub": there is often talk among Protestants about what happens if we are about to have a car wreck or if our heart suddenly stops beating and we don't have time to pray for forgiveness....knowing that we all sin every day. We all "assume" that we are forgiven because of Jesus' Precious Grace....however....we do have this nagging knowledge that "NO" sin will enter into Heaven. (ack!)

This is the place that ties that little psychological dance into a nice bow for me. I understand the "need" for “a walk of fire” in "that" circumstance....though I still believe Jesus blood covers every sin...but we still pray for forgiveness every day...so...you can see the circle of never-ending thought there.

Side Note: I "think" that the big issue with Purgatory is that many Protestants "think" Catholics are trying to "pray people out of Hell." We don't think of Purgatory at all so to us, it's hell...not a walk of fire. We also "think" that Catholics assume they will automatically get to go to either Heaven or Purgatory just because they are Catholic. We "think" that Catholics believe they are safe from hell right after their infant baptism. Which, my protestant friends, is NOT the case. :o) So, you know...we can stop thinking that now. LOL

ORTHODOX AND ANGLICANISM
(Question posed by "X" in the blog comments)

Are you learning about Orthodox Catholicism?

I'm not really asking much about Orthodox (Eastern) Catholicism for two reasons...my friends are Roman Catholic so that is where my journey for understanding began. I did, however, take a look at the Eastern theology in my quest. I followed the schism that took place over the years with Orthodox and Roman Catholicism. It "looks" to me that they basically worshiped very much the same way for 1000 years...there were "small" differences, as there are with any religion due to different people in different church buildings having their own social dynamics...but for the most part they worshiped alike. The basic teachings "look" like they are the same to me. The "meat and potatoes" of each seem to be, at their heart, the same as far as the "serving Christ and getting to Heaven" parts. The "thing" that set the two apart, in my mind, was the teaching of "filoque."(and something about unleavened bread)

I have always believed that God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit are one, and not separate. It is my understanding that, in order to bring this point "home," the Roman Church inserted the term "filioque" into the heart of their beliefs...the Nicene Creed.

Traditionally, the Holy Spirit was seen to proceed from God the Father; the insertion of the "filioque" clause meant that, in the West, the Holy Spirit was believed to proceed from God the Father and God the Son. The Catholic Church in the East felt that Rome had overstepped its authority by altering the Creed so they decided not to follow that Pope anymore. (source)

I happen to believe that The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are one, yet separate, and since the division, to me, amounts to saying Potato/PotAto...the Spirit proceeds from the Father through the Son or Comes from the Son or Comes from the father...they are all the same to me...though God is the Father...at any rate....that ended the bunny trail for me on the Orthodox Church.

To sum up:

Though there were small differences in Roman and Eastern Catholic churches, they all were united until the Nicene creed changed. Basically; the division came about because of the insertion that emphasizes that Jesus, the Son, is of equal divinity with God, the Father, while the absence of it in Eastern Christianity concentrates on the Father.

"There is one body and one spirit," Paul wrote, "just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call, one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of us all" (Eph.4:4-5).

"One Lord" to me is The Father, Son and Holy Spirit combined. If we take away any one of them we don't have God...so...that's my thought process for the questioner.

DID PEOPLE CONFESS THEIR SINS TO PRIESTS "RIGHT" AFTER JESUS ASCENSION?

Yes indeedy....though the practice of public confession was practiced quite a lot in some regions. Public...as in...stand in the middle of town and tell EVERYONE your sins...for a long time...until the Priests told them they were "done" and allowed them to take communion again! ACK!!

Thank goodness most churches decided to nix that ridiculousness and made confession of sins a more private thing as time went on! Here are a few excerpts from various sources regarding what the authors witnessed being practiced by Christians in various places just after Jesus Resurrection.

Examples of early worship in the years Before the Bible was compiled into a book.

What the Catechism says about confession.

The short version: People used to confess to a priest and pray to Jesus for forgiveness...just as they do today. Also, Catholics believe that "Penance" is to help people reunify themselves with their Christian Family (peers) in church. Penance is not the "thing" that saves the person. Jesus saves the person.

John 20
¹⁹On the evening of that first day of the week, when the disciples were together, with the doors locked for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them and said, "Peace be with you!" ²⁰After he said this, he showed them his hands and side. The disciples were overjoyed when they saw the Lord. ²¹Again Jesus said, "Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you." ²²And with that he breathed on them and said, "Receive the Holy Spirit. ²³If you forgive anyone his sins, they are forgiven; if you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven."

Here is more stuff on Confession

Here is more stuff on Saints

Okay, I'm ready for comments.

I'm absolutely positive that I have messed up somewhere! :o)

Please give me the Protestant answers to my questions and some more Protestant history before Luther...I would especially like to see where the Apostles prayed at the altar for forgiveness, talked about Bible Only and precisely when Bible Only took affect.

Any history or Bible passages to back all that up would be great! :o) I'm all ears for any respectful dialogue, thoughts and comments! :o)

Thanks so much! This is fun!!

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UPDATE: POST NUMBER 1: EVANGELICAL ME AND MY CATHOLIC FRIENDS

UPDATE: POST NUMBER 2: THE WHOLE CONFESSING TO A PRIEST THING

UPDATE: POST #3: WHAT DO CATHOLICS BELIEVE?

UPDATE: POST #4: DO CATHOLICS PRAY TO DEAD SAINTS?

UPDATE: POST #5: THE WHOLE RELIGION THING

A CLOUD OF SMOKE!

2010-02-26T09:38:00.003-05:00

Brian and I have been blessed to parent healthy, inquisitive little rascals who really have a tenacity for education. Some of their education...I would go so far as to say most...is self directed. Their natural curiosity unfolds a question and their natural body proceeds to find the answer...in a hands on sort of way. Last week was no exception.

I've blogged about the antics of our children in the past...many of which were headed by our brilliant, spunky little Daxx. It's been a while since we've had any really shocking incidents in our home. The boys have grown, life has calmed down to a run instead of a sprint and I have allowed myself to relax. Life is good...but it still throws us a curve-ball now and then.

I was cleaning the bathroom and twin's room last week in my "relaxed" state of grace when Kole arrived to tell me that they were finished coloring their pictures. I said, "Wonderful, go on down to the playroom to play for a bit while mommy cleans."

The children put away their crayons, placed their pictures around for all to view and then...clomp,clomp, clomp they went down to play in the newly-built playroom equipped with everything from a climbing rope, to books, to a full-out set of monkey bars.

It was during the "going down of the stairs" that I closed the bathroom door...as the cleaning was finished...and went into the boy's room to sweep the floor. About 10 minutes into the sweeping..."sweeping" involves a very large trash can and tipping a bed over in our house...Kole came into the room to tell me that there's a lot of dust. I said, yes honey, I'm cleaning...that's why you need to go downstairs for a minute to play.

Kole went obediently down the steps again...and came right back up.

Kole: "Mom"

Shelly" "What?"...I was still cleaning and not looking at my son.

Kole: "There's a lot of dust."

I turned to look at Kole to see him COVERED with dust!

Shelly: "What is that?!"

Kole: "The Dust!"

I went over to dust him off and couldn't figure out what in the world it would be. He and I went over to the kitchen door, I opened it and a full out CLOUD of...."what I percieved to be smoke at first".... dust hit me in the face! I began to scream like the house was on fire! No words...just screams...

I made it to the bottom of the stairs to see 4 wide-eyed little children looking at their mother. As I looked around, it finally sunk in that this "smoke" actually WAS dust! Quikrete Dust!!

Yes, our children had gone down to play in the newly renovated playroom and my hubby, God love his heart, had innocently left 2 bags of FULLY SEALED bags of Quikrete lying in the basement foyer...to take out later. That was no biggie, but the children...you know...our inquisitive, healthy, self-educating children, had found a Large Mallet also. I mean, what else could they hit with it? The walls? No, THAT would make a mess. Each other? No, that would be too loud. The floor? No, THAT would be no fun. Hey! I know! How about those bags over there!

Their Question: "How much dust does Quickrete make in an enclosed space if the bags are hit repeatedly by a large mallet and then handfuls of the "stuff" are thrown around?

Shelly: "I know the answer!! Pick Me! Pick Me! I even have pictures!"

Side Note: We have added two little children to our mix here in the "Brownie" Home. We are restricted by law thus unable to post photos of our foster children...and we can't use their names online....but they were in on this tiny fiasco too. The culprits are 3 boys, all six years old...and one precious little 4 year old girl...what has been blamed as the one who "did it first."

This happened Saturday. Today is Friday. It's been nearly a week...and I'm still dusting....and so are our children. :o)

WHAT DO CATHOLICS BELIEVE?

2010-02-13T20:19:00.023-05:00

It is no secret that most Protestants consider Catholics to be "the other" Christians. By the same token, most Catholics consider Protestants to be "the other" Christians. The interesting part of this dynamic, to me, is that most of us believe that "the others" are probably going to be accepted by Christ. Most of us believe...or at least, strongly hope, that we all will probably see each other in Heaven. We all love each other and respect each other, yet are inherently terrified to talk with each other about what "the others" believe.

We just don't understand each other very well at all. Sadly, ignorance often creates deep division. The fear of division inherently hinders people of both faiths from having an intelligent, Unheated discussion about their religion. I've been fortunate enough, however, to have friends who will indulge my questions, and not only indulge me, but openly discuss their faith without animosity.

When all is said and done, we all have our own beliefs, understand them and live with them...openly...without animosity or "poo pooing" the other persons stance on any given religious issue. During these discussions every one of us have questioned our own beliefs about certain details of our faith, found answers and become stronger in our walk with Christ. It's not as much about "we're right, you're wrong" as it is about, "Why do you believe this, why do I believe THAT?"

I suppose it is my need for answers that drives these discussions....my friends accept this attribute of mine all the while knowing that my "findings" will eventually find their way to this public forum to be dissected and discussed. Thus, here is installment number three of...

"What I have come to understand from...'the other side.'"

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RECAP
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I was born and raised in a Christian home. I grew up attending evangelical Christian churches in the Bible Belt of America. (Part 1") Here is the post about my Evangelical upbringing AND First Catholic encounter...

My parents were, and still are, very faithful to Jesus, His teachings and living a Christian life. I am also rooted and grounded in Christ's Grace and Love. I gave my life to Christ by repenting of my sins to Jesus, was Baptized in the Ohio river when I was 12 years old, and baptized again, with my husband, during our second year of marriage. We were Baptized in the church Baptismal together...well, one after another...we weren't actually dunked at the same time. LOL

Brian and I have held fast to Jesus, allowing Him to guide our lives the best way we know how. But the one thing we have struggled with through our 20 years of marriage is finding a church where we feel at peace.

In our nearly 20 years of marriage, we've had to move quite a few times. We lived and worked where God led us. We met many people, attended many churches (all protestant) and really feel that God has placed us in the depths of His will.

After moving to Michigan...again...10 years ago...we began meeting many people of different faiths. We've met, Atheists, Agnostics, Buddhists, Humanists, Wicca and...Catholics. Now, some people wouldn't put Catholics under the "Different File" because Catholics are Christians, ie: Worship Christ. But, as you can see by my previous "Evangelical" post...and (Part 2) subsequent post....they are considered very "different" by many Protestants.

I used to be amazed that anyone could possibly be Catholic and have a brain in their head.(I know...but it's the truth) I felt that Catholic people were easily led and not really bright enough to think on their own or they would surely be Protestant. This belief was largely based on my "knowledge" that they worship Mary, don't pray to Christ, talk to dead people, see Mary in pieces of toast and think a Priest can get them to Heaven by forgiving their sins. Just LOOK at the Total and Complete ignorance! Little did I know that the ignorance, was on my part.

Now that I have met PRACTICING Catholics, I am no longer able to deny that they have Christ as the center of their lives. I can no longer pretend that they go to Church on Sunday and live like heathens during the week. Yes, that is how I thought a Catholic lived their life, because that is what I witnessed of "Catholics" on television and in my real life growing up in the Bible Belt of America.

I now have very dear, close, friends who share their lives with me openly. I see their daily struggles, the way they teach their children diligently about how to have a personal relationship with Christ Jesus...I see it all. Their lives are held up for my scrutiny....for whatever reason...and they are unashamed to do so.

I am baffled by their openness to my questions, their ability to refrain from "sanitizing" their lives for my benefit. They haven't tried to live holier, speak more holy or put on heirs of family bliss to encourage my love of their religion. They just live life as they always have and allow me to see everything...the good, the bad and the ugly.

In the two years that I've been hounding them for answers, not one has openly tried to convert me to their religion. When I ask questions, I get answers or an occasional book to read...then we're back to talking about our children and/or laughing about a common interest. Each Catholic family I meet is different, yet loving, faithful and open to whatever intrusive questions I throw their way.

After much inner reflection and much prayer, it has become painfully apparent that I was prejudiced against them. I weighed Catholics unfairly in my mind, just as a non-Christian weighs all Christians against the fallen televangelists and crazies screaming on the sidewalks of a dirty city block. The picture of a Catholic that resonated in my mind is very different from the reality of a true, practicing, Catholic person/family.

I don't feel too bad about this predicament though, because I've come to find out that my friends have held many of the same prejudices against Protestants. :o) Even though this is the case, we've not had heated, knock-down, drag-out debates about theology. Why? Because, when all is said and done, we believe that we're all going to Heaven, so what's the big deal? LOL

It is within this dynamic that we've all been able to openly discuss our religious practices without fear and trembling. We just soak up the new information, that streams to and fro, like a dry sponge breathes in water. It's actually been fascinating to discuss our points of view and share the "other" Christian experience.

I'll try to touch on all of the topics of discussion that I've had with my Catholic friends since my last post(s). I should note that there are times when my questions are confusing for my friends, because Protestants and Catholics use different "words" to say the same things at times. I'll try to "translate" as I go along.

This is what I Understand from my Catholic friends and from my research.

When I say "Catholics Believe" I mean...

"This is what my Catholic friends...different families, different churches...not just one family... believe."

When I say "Protestants Believe" I mean...

"This is how I was raised and is true of the many Protestant faiths."

Wish me luck! :o)

Here goes...

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PRAYER:

Catholic church services are very, very (yes I used the word "very" twice) different from Protestant church services. Keep in mind that most Protestants lump Lutherans in with Catholics. We consider Lutherans to be "Catholic-Lite" so to speak. :o)

That being said, the normal worship service for a Catholic is made up of small prayers, preaching, Bible reading and the Eucharist. (Communion) I had the pleasure of attending a Mass recently because I was named "Godmother" (Sponsor) to my close friends' newborn baby girl. (Hi Elizabeth) During the church service (mass) I witnessed a lot of "chanting" (praying) by the congregation. What in the world is up with all the chanting back and forth during service? Don't they know that we don't talk in church?! :o)

My question to Heather (Elizabeth's mom) was, Why does everyone say things back and forth to the Pastor (Priest) during service? (My protestant friends know what my "real" question was...right? :o) My real question was..."Why do Catholics practice "vain repetition." )

"Vain Repetition" is spoken about in Matthew 6: 7-15 "And when you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they think they will be heard because of their many words. ⁸Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him. ⁹"This, then, is how you should pray: "Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. ¹⁰Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven. ¹¹Give us this day our daily bread. ¹²And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors. ¹³And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen."

Catholic Interpretation:

In keeping with the example given of the Lord's Prayer, Catholics keep their prayers short and to the point....like the lord's prayer. They believe they are doing what the scripture said to do by saying prayers meant for specific things...such as the Lord's Prayer that we are supposed to say. Essentially, "God knows what we need before we ask" so why go on and on and on....(like in protestant churches when people pray for 30 minutes or an hour or two hours..."using many words like babbling Pagans.") They believe God asked us to pray diligently, mean what we say and don't say words in vain. Cutting to the chase: They believe that Protestants may be the ones using "vain repetition" because they pray a long time, saying the same things essentially each time but in a different way...making their words "too many."

Protestant Interpretation:

Protestants don't want to repeat the same prayers over and over because they think that's the "vain repetition" that God was talking about. They are concerned that saying prewritten prayers over and over will make the prayers become "repetitive" thus "vain" thus not authentic. Even though God knows what we need before we pray for it, Protestants often need a "feeling" to be assured that God is working in their lives so they will continue to pray for a long time until they "feel" like God has heard them. That "feeling" is often thought to be the Holy Spirit. Some protestants believe we have to pray in church until the Holy Spirit has "spoken" to our heart...thus we pray and sing until that emotion is felt.

Both religions are working hard to please God, but doing so with very different interpretations of the scriptures.

Mary "Worshiping"

Protestants greatly ignore Mary because they are afraid they will offend Jesus by honoring her. They don't see a need to think about her, any more than they feel the need to think about Joseph, the Wise Men, Moses or any other person of the Bible. This is largely due to their belief that dead people are in the grave until Jesus comes back. Many Protestants believe that only God can "see" us down here on earth and hear us. It never, ever crosses a Protestants mind to talk with a Chrsitian who has already passed away, let alone ask them to pray for us, like we do with our friends here on earth. To a protestant, this is proposterous!

Side Note: The knowledge that there must be people in Heaven with God escaped me for many years. In my mind all the people who have died are waiting for God to come back so they can go up to Heaven for Judgment Day. I didn't think people went to Heaven until Judgment day. Now, I have to wonder if Judgment day is more than one day...maybe we all have our own judgment day? I wonder this because, the theif on the cross was with Christ "that day" in Paradise, Enoch and Elijah were whisked away to Heaven...so there are people up there. The next question: If people are up there, does God give them the ability to continue to be part of the Christian community?
Can they hear us and pray for us like when they were living on earth? Are they like our friends down here? Can they still pray for us as our brothers and sisters in Christ? so...there's that to chew on.

Catholics want to adore Mary and give her a place of honor in their lives because they are afraid they will offend Jesus if they don't acknowledge His Mother. They know that we are to honor our mother and father in Christ so, if Jesus was fully God and He was fully man on this earth also...making him our God AND our brother "in Christ"...we should Honor Our Mother in Christ. If she were standing in front of us, they reason, we would have a thousand questions about her life with Christ. If she were standing with Jesus, she would worship Him with us, but He may say, "meet my mother" also. She IS Jesus' Mother chosen by God. She conceived him from the Holy Spirit, she was THERE when Jesus was born, she raised Him and she watched Him die. She was at the foot of the cross agonizing. This is why they call her the Greatest Saint...cause she is. A Catholic can't comprehend NOT honoring her. The issue for Protestants is that we don't ever, ever talk to anyone but Jesus. We see any chatter between ourselves and someone in Heaven as worship. Catholics, however, talk with their brothers and sisters in Christ in Heaven all the time. To them, there is a Huge difference between honor and worship. They worship Christ. They Honor Mary.

Side Note: Some sects of the world do put Mary in a position of worship, but this is NOT what the Catholic church teaches. As with any religion, you will find people who go a bit "off-track" from the actual teaching of their religion. There is even a sect of Catholics who want the church to change their teaching so Mary can also forgive sins...but that is NOT what the church teaches and has been denied by council after council. Mary Worship is NOT something that is in the Catholic doctrine....though she is highly looked up to for her unique relationship with Christ.

ARE YOU SAVED?:

One of the first things I asked my friend Heather when we began our religion talks was...Are you saved? She said...I have hope that I am. I didn't understand that at all...AT. ALL. I said, "Well I am." She sort of squinted like she got a small jolt of electricity and goose pimples. Here's the deal...

Catholics have an issue with proclaiming someone "saved." They will rarely say that they are saved. A Catholic will usually say they have "hope in their Salvation." This just absolutely makes no sense to a Protestant. Most Protestants quote Acts 16:31 as their rock when proclaiming Salvation. Acts 16:31 "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou SHALL be saved." (not "might" or "hope to be" but SHALL)

The funky thing is that both Catholics and Protestants believe this. The difference is that Catholics acknowledge that even Satan "believes" in Christ Jesus. They understand this passage to use "believe" as a verb of sorts. A Catholic interpretation of this verse would say that it means that we must "have a relationship with Christ" and you shall be saved from Hell. HOWEVER...

Catholics have a very hard time with the idea that we are going to die, waltz up to Jesus in Heaven and say..."Hi there, let me in. You said I'm saved if I believe in you (and live for you) so here I am. I'm Saved." They believe that we are assuming MUCH when proclaiming that we are "saved..for sure" because Jesus says we will ALL be judged. Until we are judged, Catholics believe that we better say we "have hope" and strive to have a relationship with Christ so that when we are judged...JESUS will proclaim us to be Saved.

Catholics acknowledge that Jesus told people, who had gotten "saved" to "go and sin no more" thus leaving Salvation as something that must be "kept," "held to" and forever something to "strive for" while we live on this earth.

Protestants hold a slightly different view in that they hold the word "believe" to be the vessel through which Grace is distributed. Meaning, in the hour that a person truly believes in Christ and then decides to live for Him, they repent and are then "saved." Protestants also believe we have to have a relationship with Christ yet also believe that as soon as we repent that we can proclaim ourselves to be saved....all the while it is well understood that Jesus has the last say on judgment day.

To Sum Up:

Protestants proclaim that they are saved, with the understanding that we must continually live for Jesus to "keep" salvation.

Catholics believe they are saved, but don't have the "nerve" to announce it before Jesus does. :o)

SIDE-NOTE:

While I pondered this interesting dynamic, I couldn't help but wonder why Protestants will quote "Shall be saved!" loud and clear..because "Jesus said it!" but they absolutely refuse to quote, Matt: 16:19 "¹⁹I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven."

Why is that one so hard to believe? Jesus will give men the ability to heal people through faith healing but He won't give men permission to announce that a person's sins are forgiven? It's not like the Priest thinks "he himself" is forgiving sins. Even the Priest knows that Jesus is the one who is forgiving the sins...he is, however, quoting the words Jesus told Him to quote because He believes it...but I addressed this issue in my previous post...so I'll stop there.

TRADITION:

Most Protestants believe in "Bible Only" religion. They have found Jesus through reading His word and believe whole-heartedly that because they have found Peace and Salvation through the Holy Bible that there is no reason to uphold any religious tradition that may have been passed down through the ages. Most protestants don't look into traditions of our forefathers, don't acknowledge that there were different ways of worshiping before the Protestant Reformation/Rebellion and frankly don't care. To back up this mind-set, most protestants have experienced loving, close relationships with their protestant parents and know them to be strong Christians who have a relationship with Christ. Why would a Protestant even consider "another" religion when they "know" that theirs is the "right" one? Nobody wants to hurt their parents by abandoning the family religion...especially when they have seen that religion lived out in an honorable way.

Most Catholics believe in following the Bible AND tradition. They have found Jesus through both, and believe whole-heartedly that because they have found Peace and "Salvation" (buzz word for Catholics) through practicing age-old traditions AND reading the Bible, they have no reason to abandon either. To back up this belief, most Catholics have experienced loving, close relationships with their parents and know them to be strong Christians. Why would a Catholic even consider "another" way to worship when they "know" that theirs is the "right" one? Nobody wants to hurt their parents by abandoning the family religion...especially when they have seen that religion lived out in an honorable way.

Protestant Understanding: The term for believing in the "Bible Only" to find Salvation is "Sola Scriptura." Protestants quote Mark 7:13 to denounce the use of Historical Tradition as another way to serve Christ. In Mark 7:13 we can read what Jesus says to the Pharisees. "They worship me in
vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men.' ⁸You have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to the traditions of men."

That sound like a dire warning agains tradition doesn't it? Many protestants are worried about the teachings of the Catholic church because Catholics hold tradition to a high standard. Protestants have read Mark 7:13 and deduced that tradition is something to be avoided at all costs. Protestants don't want to touch tradition with a 10 foot pole because they don't want to worship in vain. Protestants think about the "rituals" (buzz word for protestants) that they have seen the Catholic church "do" (another buzz word) and they turn from the religion like it's Satan himself standing at the door.

On the other hand...

Catholics have also read Mark 7:13. They see that verse...and the verses that come before it. Here is the passage in it's entirety...

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Mark 7

Traditions and Commandments

1 Now when the Pharisees gathered to him, with some of the scribes who had come from Jerusalem, 2 they saw that some of his disciples ate with hands that were defiled, that is, unwashed. 3 (For the Pharisees and all the Jews do not eat unless they wash their hands, holding to the tradition of the elders, 4 and when they come from the marketplace, they do not eat unless they wash. And there are many other traditions that they observe, such as the washing of cups and pots and copper vessels and dining couches.) 5 And the Pharisees and the scribes asked him, "Why do your disciples not walk according to the tradition of the elders, but eat with defiled hands?" 6 And he said to them, "Well did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honors me with their lips, but their heart is far from me; 7 in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.' 8 You leave the commandment of God and hold to the tradition of men." 9 And he said to them, "You have a fine way of rejecting the commandment of God in order to establish your tradition! 10 For Moses said, 'Honor your father and your mother'; and, 'Whoever reviles father or mother must surely die.' 11 But you say, 'If a man tells his father or his mother, "Whatever you would have gained from me is Corban"' (that is, given to God) — 12 then you no longer permit him to do anything for his father or mother, 13 thus making void the word of God by your tradition that you have handed down. And many such things you do.

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CATHOLIC UNDERSTANDING: Catholics see that Jesus is telling the Pharisees not to "replace" what the Bible teaches by traditions. They see that Jesus isn't against holding to traditions that enforce Biblical teachings. Catholic's keep the teachings and traditions that were handed down long ago, that are in keeping with Biblical teachings and throw away the Traditions that contradict those teachings.

In summary:

Protestants are concerned that Jesus was speaking against all traditions so they won't practice any for fear of offending Jesus. (Except: Weddings, Baptism, Communion, Bowing at the altar...some also hold to traditions of wearing dresses, not dancing, not wearing jewelry...etc.)

Catholics trust that Jesus was trying to reinforce the Biblical traditions and flush out those that were trying to infiltrate Christianity from paganism. Thus Catholics practice the Traditions that reinforce Biblical Truth.

FAITH ALONE:

Most Protestants believe that people are saved by Faith Alone. This is to say that all we have to "do" to be saved is believe in Christ, ask Him to forgive us (maybe get baptised) and we are set. All of that is considered "Faith Alone" even though there's a lot to "do" to be saved by Faith. A small sect of Protestants believe that once a person does this they are saved forever, no matter what. Most others believe that we have to live our lives for Christ and keep striving to do His will in order to "stay saved by Grace, through Faith Alone." Protestants read Ephesians 2:8 to proclaim this "Faith Alone" belief. Most Protestants say they were "saved" the day they prayed to Jesus for forgiveness. However, they do pray often for forgiveness "just in case." :o)

Catholics understand Ephesians 2:8 to mean that when a person has Faith that Jesus is the one and only true God, that they can then accept His teachings. They believe that when we accept His teachings and start living our lives for Him that we will ask for forgiveness, get Baptized and begin taking the Eucharist. (communion) It is at this time that people are considered to be Christians/Catholics...thus followers of Christ. They believe that God's gift of Salvation is Free to all people, just as Protestants believe, and they believe that all we have to do is accept it to be "saved."

It is "how a person accepts Christ" that really creates the difference in these two religions. Catholics believe that we are actually at the Last Supper, (we, as humans, are confined by time but God is not...He created time, thus transcends time) so when they take communion (the Eucharist) they are actually right there with the disciples, with Christ, eating and drinking Him (spiritually) in order to spiritually strengthen ourselves weekly/daily. They also believe in praying to Jesus for forgiveness both outside and inside the confessional. So when a Catholic gets "saved" they...Profess their belief in Christ Jesus as the one and only savior, confess their sins/ask for forgiveness for their sins, Pray the Holy Spirit leads their lives, and they agree to assume the role of a disciple...(live their lives to fulfill God's plan for their life/strive to have a relationship with Christ) and are Baptised at their Confirmation. (I haven't seen this first hand but this is my understanding to date. I "think" Baptised for Catholics is water over the head...not dunking.) (UPDATE: A Catholic friend of mine told me last night...after I posted this...on Facebook...that it's personal preference. She and her family choose to be completely submerged because "it is more symbolic of the dying and rising with Christ.")

Essentially both religions believe that Jesus will inevitably be seen in the lives of Christians because of the works that we do in our lives. (the fruit of our beliefs will be seen) Ephesians 2:10 and James 2: 14-26 AND both religions believe we have to "do" some things to "get" saved but Protestants don't put much emphasis on "doing" things after the Baptism and Catholics emphasize the importance of taking communion and asking Jesus for salvation often.

COMMUNION/EUCHARIST

Protestants believe that Catholics sacrifice Christ over and over every Sunday....just like Jewish people sacrificed lambs to God. They think that the Catholic Communion (Eucharist) is a making a mockery of the Sacrifice Jesus made for our sins. They quote Hebrews 10:12 to state that Christ died once and for all for our sins. This is why many Protestants don't take communion very seriously. It's "just something we do to remember what God did for us, but it's just a symbol."(Hebrews 10:12 "But when Christ had offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God.")

On the other hand, most protestants also believe that "communion should be taken seriously because if we do not "believe" then we can take communion and damn ourselves to hell" 1 Corinthians 11:29 Knowing this...I have to ask myself...is "it" God's body or is "it" juice and crackers? I do know one thing...God takes "it" very seriously....somehow I doubt "it" is "just" juice and crackers.

Catholics believe that the Eucharist (Communion) is Jesus body and blood. They believe that the bread and wine turn into Jesus "sacramentally." (Spiritually) They DON'T believe that if we take DNA or look under a microscope that the bread and wine has turned to "physical" Jesus, but they do believe that He IS that bread and wine spiritually.

They believe that all through the old testament God was getting us ready to be able to take the Eucharist (last supper) even after Christ left the earth. They believe that Jesus was "the bread of life" born in Bethlehem, which means "House of Bread" and that He was offered on a plate, (manger) for humans (sheep) throughout time to come to the alter to receive Him as spiritual nutrients. They believe that God transcends time....He lives outside the "box" of time and we live inside the "box" of time. (Thank you for this analogy Mr. Ray)

Catholics found this belief, in part, on Revelation 13:8 "All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written in the book of life belonging to the Lamb that was slain from the creation of the world."

Catholics believe God was NOT taken by surprise that we sinned against Him. They believe that Jesus' sacrifice was known "from the creation of the world." Catholics also believe that Jesus actually saw each and every one of us (you and me) when He said... Luke 22 "19 And he took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to them, saying, “This is my body given for you; do this in remembrance of me.” 20 In the same way, after the supper he took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood, which is poured out for you."

When partaking of the Eucharist (Communion) every Sunday, Catholics believe we are actually transcending time...well, Christ is transcending time to come to us...that we can partake of the last supper in remembrance of Jesus until His return to earth. They are not "re-sacrificing" Him, they are accepting His one sacrifice and doing it until he comes back, just as He asked us to do.

To sum up: Catholics believe that Christ saw each and every person on earth when He took the sins of the world onto Him during his crucifixion and that He offers himself to us through communion, spiritually, to strengthen us...through time...until He comes again.

Now here's the "big" differences in Protestant/Catholic interpretations regarding Communion/Eucharist:

John 6: "⁴⁷I tell you the truth, he who believes has everlasting life. ⁴⁸I am the bread of life. ⁴⁹Your forefathers ate the manna in the desert, yet they died. ⁵⁰But here is the bread that comes down from heaven, which a man may eat and not die. ⁵¹I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world." ⁵²Then the Jews began to argue sharply among themselves, "How can this man give us his flesh to eat?" ⁵³Jesus said to them, "I tell you the truth, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. ⁵⁴Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. ⁵⁵For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink. ⁵⁶Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me, and I in him. ⁵⁷Just as the living Father sent me and I live because of the Father, so the one who feeds on me will live because of me. ⁵⁸This is the bread that came down from heaven. Your forefathers ate manna and died, but he who feeds on this bread will live forever." ⁵⁹He said this while teaching in the synagogue in Capernaum. ⁶⁰On hearing it, many of his disciples said, "This is a hard teaching. Who can accept it?" ⁶¹Aware that his disciples were grumbling about this, Jesus said to them, "Does this offend you? ⁶²What if you see the Son of Man ascend to where he was before! ⁶³The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life.⁶⁴Yet there are some of you who do not believe." "

Catholics believe that verse 63 is meant the same way John used it before in John 8:15. They believe that "the flesh" actually means "Use of our human mind." Meaning that we think in human mind and not spiritually. They believe that Jesus words are spiritual and His communion (Eucharist) is what allows us to "remain in 'Him' and 'He' in us" spiritually. (be saved) Basically we are to take the Eucharist because that is how He gives us strength spiritually but the people of that time were thinking only of the physical.

Protestants believe that Jesus wiped out ALL of His previous words when he said verse sixty-three. They believe that he was being metaphoric in the previous verses and that communion isn't all that important. (except Lutherans...but again... "Catholic-light") :o)

1 Corinthians 11 " ²³For I received from the Lord what I also passed on to you: The Lord Jesus, on the night he was betrayed, took bread, ²⁴and when he had given thanks, he broke it and said, "This is my body, which is for you; do this in remembrance of me." ²⁵In the same way, after supper he took the cup, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in my blood; do this, whenever you drink it, in remembrance of me." ²⁶For whenever you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord's death until he comes.

To sum up:

Catholics believe that when Jesus said the word "is" that He meant "is"

Protestants believe that when Jesus said the word "is" that He meant "represents"

----------------

Well, Those are my new understandings. This is really a fascinating journey as I've been learning more and more over the past few years. The ideas and thoughts from both sides of the isle have mesmerized me. I have found that I believe a lot of what my Catholic friends believe because, as it turns out, their religion isn't as "different" as I once thought it to be....though I still have questions!! LOL

I'm NOT saying our religions are the same, but I am saying they are more alike than I once realized.

I do enjoy learning about many Christian points of view and would appreciate thoughts from readers as well. If questions and understandings are presented in a gentle spirit, I would love to read them in the comment section. If they are presented in a mean spirit, they won't make the cut. (nuff said)

My next quest is to find the history of how people worshipped before the Protestant reformation/rebellion. If you have any links about church history "pre"...both Protestant and Catholic... I'd love to see them. :o)

=========

UPDATE: I have found that there are some Catholics who do believe that the Eucharist is Christ's actual, physical body. Of course, as with any religion...especially one with a billion members...there will be LOTS of interpretations of the teachings of the Catholic Church. (questions 1353 and 1390) I should have said...the Catechism states that the Eucharist is Sacramentally Jesus rather than assume all Catholics believe one particular way about what 'Sacramentally" means.
UPDATE: POST NUMBER 1: EVANGELICAL ME AND MY CATHOLIC FRIENDS

UPDATE: POST NUMBER 2: THE WHOLE CONFESSING TO A PRIEST THING

UPDATE: POST #3: WHAT DO CATHOLICS BELIEVE?

UPDATE: POST #4: DO CATHOLICS PRAY TO DEAD SAINTS?

UPDATE: POST #5: THE WHOLE RELIGION THING

HOMESCHOOLING BOYS...AND....VIDEO GAMES IN HOME EDUCATION

2010-01-29T11:19:00.005-05:00

I was recently asked to give some advice about home educating Kindergarten boys. At first I wasn't sure I had any insight to give, but then it dawned on me; I have home educated 5 sons so far and I do have a few tricks up my sleeve to create a happy, fun homeschooling environment.

My best advice is to teach in short bursts for the written work and spoken lessons. Boys, especially, have a natural tendency to zone out or begin “playing” during long, boring lessons. When the child is doing worksheets or listening to his parent teach, it helps to allow the child to roll a car under his foot or allow him to hold a squishy ball or toy in his hand. It actually helps the child focus on the task at hand, longer.

Just think about yourself during a long boring meeting at work or during a lecture. How often do you fiddle with a pencil or jot down a note just to pass the time and allow your brain to zone for a second? Now imagine you are held "captive" and cannot leave because the speaker has forbidden you to move, make a sound or even look away for a second. THAT is how our children feel if we make them "sit still," "stop moving around," "stop playing with that pencil," "stay in your seat!" We are holding them captive, for all intents and purposes. In allowing the child to have a release for their mind, a little zone out toy like rolling a car or moving around a little bit, we are actually creating a more conducive learning environment. They are learning more because they aren't focusing on how they will "move" next, without getting caught.

Our children are people, just like us. And, just like us, they need freedom to learn. Our "sit still" tactics only make them want to move around more. (Just like I feel when church service lasts way longer than I had anticipated! LOL)

One of my sons actually sat on a large exercise ball while doing his written work. He would move about a little bit, but the work was completed in a better, quicker fashion because he could use one side of his brain to think and the other to move.

Now, mothers, remember that we are teaching, not dominating our children. Our focus in home education, hopefully, is to instill a love of learning for our children. We need to lose the notion that our kids will sit, listen and focus at all times. It's not going to happen. They will bounce on the ball, fall over and laugh their head off. That is part of the fun. At some point you may want to sit on the ball and fall over too. Having fun with our children and acting goofy with them, and in front of them, helps SO very much to lighten up our homeschool day. It shows the kids that we aren't stuffy, boring people and also creates an environment of relaxation for the kids to do work and feel comfortable doing their work at home.

Expect some play, expect some focused lessons and expect to value the time spent with our children. They are home for a very short time, and then they are grown, gone and on to live their lives. Along with reading, writing and math, hopefully they are learning a great sense of humor and a relaxed, stress free focus to carry into their lives.

Incorporating video games and computer time also help most children to keep focused and not “zone” out during school time. Games and computer time are great motivators when used as positive re-enforcement. When given more game/computer time for focusing during written lesson time we are encouraging education for longer periods of time in both the written lessons AND the game/computer lessons! That being said, it is important for us moms to play the games they are playing. We need to play the video games and the computer too. This is important for two reasons.

We need to know what our children are playing so we can assess how to "save" the game when "time is up" and how long a person needs to play the game to get to each level. Setting a timer for 15 minutes and expecting a child to turn the game off "right now" is truly frustrating if it takes 30 minutes to reach the next level or cut-off space so that all of their hard work can be saved for the next day.

Just imagine...We are baking a cake. (go ahead...imagine that you are making your very favorite cake and you have all the ingredients just waiting to be put together...Oh yummy!) We have been working on this cake for 10 minutes now and we have JUST tasted the mixture and it is SO good! All of the sudden, just as the oven is at the perfect temperature to put the cake in, we hear a timer (bell) go off. Then we hear our boss say that we have to stop baking the cake right now. Why?! Because...well, because time is up and baking a cake is fun so we have to be timed ya know! But, but...hey! We explain to our boss that it takes 30 minutes to bake the cake so now we have to throw out all of our hard work because the boss says we should only be allowed to do this fun activity for 10 minutes...even though it takes 30 minutes to actually DO the activity! Not only that but the boss won't even LISTEN to us explain WHY we need 30 minutes to bake the cake!

Too bad. We have to toss the cake in the trash and go to time out because we are being unreasonable and won't stop trying to explain. Yes, that's frustrating!; And guess what! Tomorrow, when the boss tells me I can have time to make a cake (have computer/game time) if I do my work well...I'm going to mess up my work on purpose and be a pain in my boss's hiney because making a cake (playing a game) is NOT FUN if I can't actually MAKE (play) the cake (game!!!)

The next reason we need to play the games our children play is so we understand the lessons our children are learning while playing the game. If it's educational, we need to know what is being taught so we can incorporate those lessons into the school day. If the game is a shoot-em-up, tactical game, we need to understand the reasoning and strategic skill our children will develop while playing the more fun games.

Even the most "fun" games have value. It's our job as parents to find the value and understand the appeal of the game for our children. Let's not forget that they are a wonderful way to bond with our children. My 17 year old son STILL speaks fondly of the times I would play Metal Gear just to beat his score when he was a pre-teen. Oh yes! I beat him and beat the game and I still rock! He has never forgotten those bonding moments.

For Kindergarten, written work for more than 1 hour per day is usually fruitless. Video lessons, playing outside, climbing…etc…are really the main focus for young children. Gross motor skills rule in Kindergarten. Fine motor skills will kick in as they get older and play video games longer. Using a pencil and crayons will help those fine motor skills develop, but over-use can really deter the child from wanting to do it for the rest of his life. Short, 15 minute, writing and coloring sessions are key to developing skills without creating a hate for using the skills.

I wish I had been taught in this fashion. I would have probably spent way more time doing work and much less time standing in the corner at school for “acting up.” :o)

ABUSE IS NOT A HOMESCHOOLING ISSUE

2009-12-17T16:53:00.005-05:00

A sad article was printed on the front page of the Detroit News, Today. The story is tragic; however, the spin that the reporter, Ron French, took is not only full of holes, it borders on complete stupidity. Were he my employee, I would almost assuredly fire him for obvious bias and lack of support for argument.

I can understand a knee jerk reaction from a lay person who did not do their due diligence on this matter, but I certainly didn’t expect this “spin” from a news reporter; especially in light of Michigan's current economic climate.

The sad case of child abuse, detailed in the "Lax Homeschool Laws put kids at risk," only underlines the fact that even when the child was in school, the abuse reports did NOT help her. Were there a question mark at the end of his title, it may have made more sense, however the way it stands, he's made quite a bold statement!

I suppose Mr French, would like the State to come into our homes to check on our children between the ages of birth – six years and during the summer months? They aren’t being “seen” by government schools during those points in their lives. Maybe he would like the Department of Human Services or the School Board to assign personal family case workers the moment a child is born so they can be "seen" and protected during the years they are not enrolled in traditional schools. If not, I failed to find any semblance of a point to his article.

As if his rant about "Lack of oversight" into families isn't ridiculous enough, Mr French seems to be calling for Millions of dollars to be taken from our State and Public Education system! During this economic time I cannot believe he even mentioned “testing” home educated children! Does he have any idea what that costs the States of the Union who have implemented this type of law? Even if the children are tested and they fail, the "powers that be" cannot force the children to go to school. All the school system could do is offer help to those who do poorly on the tests. That's it. Why would he suggest spending millions of dollars on homeschoolers when our children in the public schools need that money?!

Then there’s the sad truth that the SCHOOLS are failing! Even wonderful public schools have children who FAIL the tests. What is done about these children? What is being done about those in power in the school system? We all know the answer to that. Not Enough!

This case only underlines the following concerns...

1. Our Michigan schools need to be in better shape to educate the children they already have in attendance.

2. Neglect/Abuse reports made by schools are not the saving grace we hope they would be.

3. Protective Services was/is probably quite over-worked and did not follow up on the original complaints.

Those who really want to abuse their children will do it regardless of home education laws….unless he is indeed arguing that the State should be allowed to come into ALL OF OUR HOMES during summer break and early childhood. If not, this abuse case obviously has nothing to do with homeschooling or homeschooling laws.

COLLEGE AT 14 COMING TO FRUITION

2009-11-25T09:38:00.015-05:00

A reader recently left a comment on one of my other blogs on THIS post from a few years ago. I was pleased to see that this blog is still useful to homeschooling parents. I thought I would post the comment from Dinah and my response. I hope it helps a few more High School Homeschooling families on their path to success. :o)

COMMENT:

I love this blog - its very helpful in planning for our oldest to start homeschooling. I'm wondering however if there is any more up to date info! I don't see anything on here for 2009 - are you still homeschooling high school?
Dinah (MD)

MY RESPONSE:

Hi Dinah,

Our eldest son, Kazz, actually ended up graduating from our homeschool in 2008. I didn't keep up with "the plan" that I have written here because he began zooming through school, life got in the way and keeping this blog updated fell by the wayside.

He began attending our local community college at the age of fourteen. He turned 17 this past July and will graduate this December with an Associate Degree.

Here is the blog post I wrote about our "plan" back then and we ended up working it to the fullest and see the light at the end of the tunnel. :o)

December 19th, 2009 Kazz will walk across the stage to receive his College Associate of Business Degree. I have 4 more children coming up behind him...6 if we get to adopt our foster children. Our 12 (almost 13) year old son, Brise, is focusing on Essay writing, Pre-Algebra and other subjects right now in order to get ready for easing into college at the age of 14 also.

Here is one of my up to date blogs.

We use many resources from it,however, for High School I cannot say enough wonderful things about THIS SITE. It's fabulous!

Please feel free to join the Facebook Page for the Free Homeschooling 101. If you have any further questions I'll try to help as much as I can.

Thanks for reading! :o)
Shelly M.

HOW MUCH DOES ADOPTION COST?

2009-11-10T16:14:00.007-05:00

How much does it cost to adopt a child?

The total cost of adoption varies depending upon a number of factors such as the type of adoption, the agency through which you work, the state in which you reside, attorney fees and whether travel is required.

Range of Adoption Costs

Foster Care Adoptions $0 - $2,500
(Rates for other options further down in the text)

When becoming a foster parent, you are ALLOWED to ask for only infants. You get to choose the age, race, and sex of the children you want to parent. Yes, You can have an infant in your home within 6 months to a year if you REALLY want to be a parent.

We paid absolutely nothing to adopt our children. We've adopted three children who were in our care as foster children. We paid $250 (two-hundred fifty dollars) per child and was reimbursed those funds after the adoption was final.

Foster parenting is not only the cheapest route to take toward adoption, it is the most practical. It gives the parents a chance to "rent to own." Yes, that sounds vulgar, however, there ARE children who will not attach with certain parents and there ARE parents who have trouble bonding with specific children. It is important to understand that fact.

Foster Parenting gives the child and the parents time to build a relationship, test the waters and connect before committing to a permanent, life-long family relationship.

I've heard many adults say that they could "never" be foster parents because they would not want to give the children back. The cold, hard truth is that adults can handle it, so if you are one who says this...I respectfully ask you to...well....suck it up. YOU can handle it.

We, as adults, can choose to take children into our home, love them, care for them and share our home with them. We can choose to do so all the while knowing that our journey is so much easier than the journey our foster children are traveling.

We can choose when to stop being foster parents. They cannot choose when to stop being foster-children. They did NOT get to choose this. If the children can go through it unwillingly and without their blessing, we, as adults, can certainly share our love willingly and let them into our hearts for a season.

We can handle it because we have all the power...YOU have all the power. You can handle giving a child back and you can do something so strong and powerful with your life that you will no longer ask why you were put on this earth. You CAN do it!

If you even think you MAYBE, kinda, could think about foster parenting, please, check out your local DHS Foster Parenting Classes. Just commit to taking the classes. You don't HAVE to be a foster parent just because you took the classes. They are FREE and a wealth of information.

If, after taking the classes, you decide that fostering is not for you, then there has been no harm, but if you decide that you are brave enough to try it, there will be life-long pride for you and your family for doing so.

Licensed Private Agency Adoptions $5,000 - $40,000+

Independent Adoptions $8,000 - $40,000+

Intercountry Adoptions $7,000 - $30,000 (Source)

I know a family who adopted infants from Russia. They were beautiful boys. They were not brothers but were adopted by one family. After the first few years it became apparent that there was something very wrong with the children. This family paid tens of thousands of dollars to adopt the kids and then went through horrific agony trying to fix their children only to find that they are "unfixable."

They have life-long disabilities that will cost tens of thousands for the family to deal with throughout their entire lives.

Not only did the family pay to adopt, they now have NO recourse of action. Those children are their responsibility and they cannot get financial help anywhere.

If this were to happen to a family who adopted from foster care they would have a wealth of resources available. The Foster Care system has policies in place to help families deal with future situations that could arise. Adoptive families are offered help for the children. They will even pay the foster/adoptive parents money, monthly to help with extra costs of helping and raising the children.

Foster Care is a valid choice for finding a forever family.Parents, there WILL be children you know for a season but when God hands you the child that is meant to be yours for a lifetime, you will know that the road to finding them was one worth traveling.

Ready to take the first step? Click here

Really...it really is...

2009-11-05T20:16:00.000-05:00

Kole is 5 years old.

Kole today: "Mom, what is chicken made from?"

Me: "ummmm...chicken."

Kole: "No Really." (as he eats a chicken leg)

Me: "ummm...chicken...rrrreally."

Kole: "But what is it made from?"

Me: "Kole, they kill a chicken and we eat the skin and legs and stuff...you are eating a chicken. "

(Look of horror)

Kole: "Oh, That's so gross!"

MY CHURCH PET PEEVE...

2009-10-26T11:41:00.000-04:00

I have a pet peeve that I feel the need to mention. I know I'm not alone because I've actually met other Evangelicals who have experienced this.

First I would like to place a memory in here for my boys so that in the future, when they read this, they do not confuse the rant to follow as something they should actually put into practice. It is a rant and should be consumed with that knowledge.

First Here is my memory:

A memory I hold dear to my heart is one of a preacher who I really liked. (Pastor Howard Wilson) He came to my job to buy something to fix the church a bit and said something to the effect that he didn't see me in church last Sunday. Being that he was a nice guy and did talk to me other than just to ask this question I said with a smile, "Yeah, that's because I wasn't there." He smiled too and said something like, "Well I hope everything is alright." I don't know why, maybe because I'm me and like to tell the truth I said with a halfway embarrassed squinty nose , "I just didn't feel like coming." To which he laughed openly. It became apparent that no one had ever actually said that to him. I then said,"Do you ever feel like that?" He gave a sideways grin, paid for his merchandise and said, "That, my dear, is something I'll never admit to." "Oh that's right!" I said, laughing at that point "You get paid to be there!" He turned with a loud laugh and walked out cracking up.

Now this is the same pastor who roped me into being the central and only secretary for the entire disaster relief efforts for our town when the flood came through and devastated so many homes and uprooted so many families. I have to think that honesty is the best policy since he respected me enough to entrust that responsibility to me after that conversation had taken place. :-)

Now on to my Pet Peeve and Random Rant for the day...

One thing that annoys the crap out of me is when I and my family arrive at church and some random person comes up to us to say,

"Why weren't you at church the other day...last week...last night..."

Whatever the case may be.

OR

"We really missed you at church the other day...last week...last night..."

Then they look at you with the silent look of fake worry trying to prompt you into divulging the reason for your shameful church absence.

Did they really miss me? Did they really miss us that much? Aren't they really asking where we were? At least those who ask where we were are getting to the point. They are nosey and they don't care that we know they are nosey.

I've so often wanted to say something like...

"Well Janet I had to get some hemorrhoids removed and I just couldn't sit in the pew that day."
or
"Well Pete I had a hot date with my lover and just couldn't make it to church." *wink*

(Mom, I didn't actually say or do these things so don't faint!)

Now why would I really want to say these things? Because they are being so NOSEY! What if those were the reasons? What if there was some very embarrassing reason and you had to just stand there and make up a lie because they are so NOSEY!?

Now don't get me wrong, I'm not talking about your buddy who you usually sit with or your friend who would have liked to go to the ballgame with you. I'm talking about church acquaintances who mention this ridiculous comment because what they really mean is...

"I was at church and because I was at church, I noticed that you were NOT so I want to mention it to you in person, even though I would otherwise never talk to you. I have to ask this of you because you didn't get to see that I was in church, so I want you to know that I was in church and that you were NOT because I am now just that much closer to Heaven than you are because I was there and you were NOT there to see how holy I am because you are NOT."

Yes, I have a tad bid of unimaginable irritation built up. It must be from my childhood. I would see people, who would otherwise not give me the time of day, come to meet me at the church door just to ask that ever so unassuming question. I cringed as they came down the isle with that concerned look on their face. I could have just kicked them in the shin.

I wish I were the person I am now...that would have been a hoot!

Yep, that is a big time pet peeve of mine, to the point that I've named the affliction that these people suffer from.

It's called,

"I've become arrogant in my Christianity-itis" It affects those Christians who have become so sure that they know all there is to know about their religion that they have widened their judgement net to encompass those who are actually OF their same religious faith."

Gotta be the top of the heap there I suppose.

If you recognise yourself in this rant please put this clue in your pocket.
If you have never been invited to the person's home. Don't ask them why they weren't at church.
If you were only invited with a group of people. Don't ask them why they weren't at church.
If you think people need a reason to miss church. Don't ask people why they weren't at church because..

1. You may not like the answer.
2. If they had an emergency or tragic event and you don't know by now then it's none of your business.
3. You're being a busy body.

Instead you could say, "Hi there friend. I was thinking of you the other day and would really like to go to Starbucks to hang out sometime with you. " or "Hi there buddy, I was JUST thinking about you yesterday and was wondering if you would like to come over to hang out sometime."

If you don't feel like you can do that then BACK OFF! If you can do that and they say no then there's your answer. If they say yes, you are well on your way to connecting with a new friend.

(That's my rant)

SUDDEN RAMBLINGS OF AN EMOTIONAL MOMENT

2009-10-22T00:37:00.000-04:00

Some say that blogging has stripped away the privacy that was once so cherished in our society; The privacy that people carried in their souls for girlfriends, parents, family, lovers. I hear the nuance of this thought spoken from time to time as I listen to friends and family speak. There are times I understand from one word or two that the emotions being expressed cannot leave my confidence. Those are precious moments held dear to my heart. There are times when I read a blog and feel as if I should not know this information or as if I am a fly on a wall that was never meant for me. Those are the times I feel the unwritten. I see what was voiced by what was not typed. I stop and feel and sometimes cry. Just me behind the anonymity of my computer screen empathizing with an unknown stranger.

I will type tonight for my own sanity. It will mean nothing to some and something to others. The phrases may not connect or be rational at all to some. That, my friends, is irrelevant. At times, I write like nobody is reading and sometimes that means the reader goes away wondering if I've lost my marbles. That, too, is fine. Tonight is just that. I will write whatever I feel. Then I will leave it be.

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The Internet has opened up humanity in such a way that we no longer have to wonder if we are normal. We no longer need to agonize over relationships or family trials. The truth is right here, a mouse click away. The truth that we are all much more alike than we are different has given me a sense of peace that cannot be explained. For so much of my childhood and teen years I was an emotional wreck. I was a pleaser. I wanted people to like me. No, I needed people to like me. I look back now, at that girl and just want to slap her straight.

I read this last year. What was so straight forward in that writing pushed my mind into a tunneling free fall that I have not been on in a long, long time. I started to think of my love for my parents. My mind flashed with memories of my dad making huge outdoor toys for me and coaching my ball teams. I thought of my mother painting, cooking, waking me up for school. I crashed into the thought of my father unable to recall my name after a terrible reaction to a medication in the hospital. I remember my brother, still a teenager yelling, sobbing unable to understand that this is our father. I remember the look on my mother's face when dad regained his health and the joy we felt knowing he would be back to normal.

Since that time, I've held at bay many of my personal relationships. I worry that I will not be able to handle losing someone that I allow to rest in my soul. When someone makes their way in through the steel doors, barbed wire and swims that alligator infested moat, they pretty much have my loyalty for life. When I looked at the picture on that blog, I saw myself in my dads arms, my baby brother in his little blue suit coming home from the hospital and my mom taking a picture of us. Basically, I got a shock of flashbacks. Then the words from that post reminded me of the awful, awful feelings I've gone through trying to fit into my in-law's lives. The memories of the years of trying, begging, hoping to be included just flashed by my eyes. My thoughts raced. I don't believe I can fit them into a nicely phrased piece. I will spill them here as they run.

I've watched closely all of those who surround me. I see many faces, families and characters in my life. As time goes by, I've finally come to understand that it is inevitable that family will become distant. If we have a very tight knit family, the time comes when our grand-parents begin to age. We guard our hearts for the inevitable. As our parents age we guard our hearts even more. It's hard to verbalize our love for them lest we sound like babbling children. We have our own to care for so sitting at our father or mother's feet to hold their legs and fall asleep on their lap is not done. Voicing our worries must be halted to guard their hearts, their nerves. Every lab test and doctor visit stands hair on end. We wonder if this is the time we hear that our lives have changed forever. So, we visit and laugh and hold our tongues. We speak in whispers only the words we can force to our lips and hold all the others at bay. There is an elephant in the room and it's name is death. We sob inside knowing that one day, it will come and we will be left wishing we had sat at their feet and fallen asleep on their lap.

This is my view of family. However, I've witnessed families where tension grows with siblings, uncles, aunts, cousins to the extent that it becomes an elephant in the room. The tension grows to anger and the anger grows to hate. It seems, in the chaos driven families, that there are always one or two who are left out emotionally. There are always one or two who hold all the cards. There is always one who stands against the stupidity and one who plays the victim. There is that one who we wish would stay home for the holidays and that one or two we wish would come be with us just this once. It's all so very boring, so very, very normal I'm coming to find out....but for me, it was totally and utterly shocking.

As a child I had not lived through this kind of tension. I was sheltered from the chaos that some families create for themselves. I had one brother who is 8 years younger than I am and parents who love us more than we deserve. I've had to come to grips with the reality that some people live with and I have to say that it's been a sad wake-up call. It's hard to watch and was even harder to live through after I became part of such, but it has given me perspective that I never had before.

What I've observed is that in families that are not naturally close knit they are somehow emotionally tied together even when they cease to talk. They are the people who molded our childhood...even if they were never there. They know who we used to be and can piece together why we are the way we are today. No matter who we are though, we will have some members who fall by the wayside. We'll have some who cannot fit us into their rose colored mold. We'll have those who will tolerate us but never, ever accept us, let alone love us.

Here's the rub. Just because we WANT them to like us, does not mean that they will like us. We can beat our head against the wall trying to fit our heart into a square hole but it will never fit if we are only being tolerated! If we can understand that this is normal, we can then shed the "what ifs." We will have found the Holy Grail of peace. There comes a time when we mature enough to know who wants us around and who does not. When that time comes, we need to make the hard decision to walk away and give them their desire.

Listen, If we are being tolerated, we need to let them go. The people who will only tolerate us, but never love us, need to be set free. We are binding them and they are harming us. We can Love them, Pray for them, AND let them go. Allow them to live their lives. We can love them from afar. Though many times there is a need to be detached physically the emotional love does not have to be spared. We can take heart in knowing that those who have chosen to detach physically, were they sitting there having tea with us, would still be detached. They would just suck the life out of us while they tolerate our existence.

Those of us who have been tolerated know the hushed silence, the rolled eyes, the knowing glances that are thrown across the room. We've ignored them, tried to hold our personality at bay in the hope that one day, we will be loved for who we are, but, alas...this will not happen. After years of abuse, backstabbing and veiled cordiality I now know what it feels like to be free of their grip. Our family is better for it and I no longer have to worry about this thought or that word that may have been taken offense to...just because they could find a reason to take offense.

Toleration is not a form of love, it is self satisfying garbage that leads to blow ups and confusion. Should we be the in-law, the black sheep or the red headed step child, I say, Stand Up Firmly on your feet, Break Away from the falsehoods, surround ourselves with those who love us THE WAY WE ARE and do NOT allow ourselves to be only tolerated. They either love us as is, or they don't love us. We can hold God's love for them while respecting ourselves.

Whether we are facing a first born daughter who cannot let her older brother's wife into the fold or a birth parent who never found the courage to accept their decisions. We are normal. WE are worth more than toleration and they..THEY...are worth more also.

Let us let go. Let us live our life. Let us let them live theirs and stop wasting the minutes we have on this earth. Forgiveness is something we do for ourselves. We do not have to have them over for tea or even have them in our lives at all. We have tried and tried to be loved. We have tried and tried to smile, accept, enter their confidence. If it hasn't happened by now, it's not going to.

Wait for the picture to arrive in the mail. Wait for the letter. Wait for them to reflect. Wait. It is all in God's timing and if it comes while viewing them at the funeral or when they view us, so be it. We shall meet again and this time, He will be the mediator.

The family that God builds may have known us then or they may be those we find later in life. For the lucky few who truly have a bond, For the Lucky few who have the love that God built, they know who we are today and love us unconditionally. They accept us with all of our flaws and all of our baggage. They support us, call us just to hear our voice and we know they will never cease to be our backbone. But, for those who only tolerate us, If they don't feel joy when we arrive, if we have tried, and they do not love us, what is the sin in allowing the love to fill our hearts...from afar.

In the inscrutable designs of providence, time is the best sculptor.

I am the putty Father, time is your design. All of it Yours.

THE DEFINITION OF HOMESCHOOLING or AFTERSCHOOLING IS NOT HOMESCHOOLING! (Please! Get it right!)

2009-10-12T10:35:00.002-04:00

A friend told me recently that she is "homeschooling" her children after school. She told me they are doing something called "Afterschooling." I was taken aback by this revelation and believed her to be very confused.

Two weeks later, I was told by another parent, that they "homeschool during the summer." I gasped inside and probably, inadvertently, gave quite the scowl and indignant look.

I tried to recover my usual relaxed emotional state, however their comments....the very idea that they could even THINK that they are homeschooling...is beyond my ability to grasp. Their idea of what homeschooling is, is so flawed that I realized quite quickly that a definition for homeschooling is not only needed, it is demanded! I am here to set the record straight!

We don't "Do" Homeschool. We ARE Homeschoolers. Our children ARE homeschooled! Homeschooling is NOT done...It is Lived!!

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I will tell you right now that what those two parents are doing doesn't even belong in the same zip code as homeschooling. They may wish they were homeschoolers, but the reality is that they are not.

Is a homeschooler educated at home? Yes. Are all people who learn at home, homeschoolers? No. Because, homeschooling is a lifestyle.

HOMESCHOOLING: HOMESCHOOL: HOME SCHOOL:

Dictionary.com meaning: to teach one's children at home instead of sending them to school.

This is a nice beginning description but I must elaborate on this condensed, sterile definition.

Homeschooling is not only the act of teaching our child at home, but about the responsibilities parents and their family accept when we do not send them to a traditional school. We live a very different life than those who choose the traditional road. It begins with the choice to brave the legal hurtles and continues through the tears of worry and the triumphs of success. Homeschooling is about the road the entire family is traveling. We, as a Homeschooling Family, accepted the reality of our choices and live with the good, bad and the ugly that result from that choice.

There are some (not all) parents who blame the public school system when their child fails in a subject. There are some parents who take all the credit when their child succeeds. Homeschooling parents have only ourselves to blame either way.

We have the full weight of all the successes and failures on our shoulders; no matter what. ALL homeschooling parents have to carry this load. All of us. We can’t in any way, shape or form, be let off the hook. We are scrutinized more and judged more often than those who send their children to school. That is the lifestyle of a homeschooler.

The idea that my mother “homeschooled” me when she helped me with my homework is laughable, but there are some who believe that every parent who helps their child with homework is homeschooling. However, their children, unlike their wishful thinking parents, know whether they are homeschooled children or public/private schooled children. If someone were to ask the kids where they go to school they would say, Roosevelt or wherever. A traditionally educated child knows they have to go to school, sit, learn, then come home and sit, learn more.

To them, “homeschooling” may be a pain in the hiney because it’s above and beyond their “other” schooling lives. It is supplemental to their “real” education. “Real” meaning the day long life they lead away from home; the reality of their educational lives. Until the child is actually homeschooled they know they are actually Public Schooled children or Private Schooled children. They live it. They are being educated at school and enduring yet more forced work as a "supplemental" education at home.

I can see how the idea of homeschooling full time would make some parents uneasy. I’ve been there. I’m thinking that maybe these baby steps are how they allow themselves to warm up to the idea of actually jumping into the home education world. It’s a process of sorts like…Maybe if they say to themselves, “Ah, see, I’m homeschooling right now as I help with homework so maybe I can teach a subject.” Then they buy a bible class or history curriculum and teach that after homework and say to themselves, “See now I’m actually teaching from a book so maybe I can go on and think about taking the kids out of school” Then they think, “ Oh my goodness, no I can’t do that, that’s crazy so maybe I’ll just do it during the summer” and then they see that they can do it during the summer so one day they all of the sudden feel empowered and jump! Voila! Process Complete!

All of those ways allow the parent to “homeschool” gently (in their mind) in their home while coming to terms with whether they are capable (in their minds) of homeschooling full time. I understand the want and even the need to say the words, “I’m homeschooling.” It becomes a familiar word that the parent can “own” so they can eventually create the reality in their home. However, while they may indeed be on the road to homeschooling, they are NOT a homeschooling family or even homeschooling at all.

In those instances the family is "playing house" if you will. They are pretending to homeschool. They are hoping to homeschool. They are going through the motions of the mechanics of homeschooing but they are not yet homeschooling. They don't know what it means, how it feels or how they will be treated when they ARE homeschooling. They won't know until they ARE a homeschooling family.

Are "afterschoolers" learning at home? Yes. Are they “Homeschooled Children?” No. They are Public or Private schooled children who have parents teaching them above and beyond their traditional schooling. Their parents are educating them, as any parent should, but they are not homeschooling. They are teaching them, reading to them, helping their children along with their lives. They are parenting. They are helping to supplement the education they've chosen for their children. That's it. That is a beautiful family choice and great parenting, but they are not homeschoolers and they are not homeschooling.

The difference between a homeschooler and a private/public educated child is that homeschooled children are living a different life than the average bear. Homeschooled children are living their lives outside of an institutional setting. They do not sit in classrooms with a group of children and learn from a teacher. Homeschoolers learn at home, all the time….whether physically at home or on various outings…they are home.

Their lives are completely different than a traditionally educated child. A homeschooled child knows that their lives are very, very different than a public/private schooled child. If you ask a homeschooler where they go to school they will say, "I AM homeschooled." They won't say, I homeschool! They ARE homeschoolers. Homeschooling is so much more than being tutored. It is more than having a parent sit with their child to teach. Parents who do this are wonderful parents…but they are not homeschooling parents.

Homeschooling is about our lives as a family unit being untouched by the confines of those that would impose their rules on our family. We are able to move freely through our lives without checking our calendar to meet an institution time-table. Homeschooling is a pronouncement of difference, acceptance and pride. Homeschooling is freedom!

For a parent to say they are a homeschooler or are homeschooling, when they are sending their children to private or public school is unsettling to those of us who live the lifestyle because they are assuming that homeschooling is something that is done.They assume that our lives are not very different when, in fact, our lives are so very different. I am not saying we are better. I am, however, saying we are different. It is respectful to acknowledge that fact.

We are educating our children, full time, without a safety net handily in place each day. We took on the responsibility and we deserve to claim the name of Homeschooler! We will NOT give that name to every parent who opens a book and reads to their child. We are so much more than that! We do that AND everything the school does for those wishful thinking parents. Until you do it ALL, you are NOT homeschooling...you are parenting. Please, Acknowledge the difference.

Homeschooling is not done. It is lived!