In this conversation we talk about what polyglot programming is and why we shouldn't settle for the one true programming language. We also discuss how this approach is useful, specifically using Ruby on top of other platforms such as the JVM and the .NET framework.

Ola presents the an approach to use different languages for different tiers within an application. He suggests breaking applications up into the following layers:

• DSL Layer - one DSL per per technical domain, typically an internal DSL built in your application layer's language
• Application Layer - where the majority of your business rules are defined, typically a dynamic language implemented on top of your static language platform
• System Layer - the static language platform and runtime the application runs on, where performance optimizations can be made if necessary

We also discussed real world examples of this approach. And whether this approach adds additional complexity for IS organizations to manage. Ola has been described to me as "scary smart", and he does not disappoint in our conversation. I really appreciate him taking the time to talk to me about polyglot programming and had alot of fun talking to him.

Zed Shaw created quite a stir in the Ruby and Rails communities recently with the release of his rant Rails Is A Ghetto. Zed was the primary driving force behind Mongrel, the web server written in Ruby (and C) that is used by many to run their Ruby on Rails sites. He also spoke at RubyConf 2006 about security and another library he wrote: RFuzz.

So why would such a valued contributor turn on the community in such a public way? It turns out Zed has his reasons. In this podcast we talk about Zed's rant and the affect it had on him and those in the community. We also discuss his thoughts about subjects from what he wants to see from conferences to how to "fix" Ruby to sacrificing golden cows. Zed is always interesting to listen to, and I'm glad he was gracious enough to talk with me.

Zed has some points to make and does so with much colorful language. I normally bleep out expletives, but with Zed it didn't feel right (and there are so many it would have taken a long time). If you are offended by potty language, you may want to skip this one.

Listen as Evan describes how Rubinius started as:

There's this thing, it seems kinda cool. Wow, I typed it in, but I don't really know where it is going.

And eventually grew to:

It could replace MRI.

You can download the interview here.

Thanks again to Evan for talking with me. I really enjoyed our conversation.

Additional Interviews

You can watch Evan at the MountainWest RubyConf on the Ruby Implementers Panel from earlier this year. And you will soon be able to see his mid-morning "keynote" at this year's RubyConf where he discusses Rubinius.

Here are some additional interviews about Rubinius from Pat Eyler:

• Rubinius Interview
• Rubinius Serial Interview Episode I
• Rubinius Serial Interview Episode II
• Rubinius Serial Interview Episode III
• Rubinius Serial Interview Episode IV
• Rubinius Serial Interview Episode V
• Rubinius Serial Interview Episode VI
• Rubinius Serial Interview Episode VII
• Rubinius Sprint Interview

Scott was kind enough to take sometime to speak with me about Ruby's influence on him, his company, the .NET community and Microsoft. He has recently gained attention in the .NET community for blogging about his transition away from ASP.NET and towards Ruby on Rails. In out discussion he offers an intriguing glimpse into the inner workings of the .NET community and developer's relationship with Microsoft.

You can download the interview here

I'd like to thank Scott for talking with me and being patient while I took my own sweet time getting the podcast ready. I very much enjoyed talking with him and look forward to attending the ALT.NET conference.

• Differences between IronRuby and Matz? Ruby/MRI
• RubyGems
• Community contributions
• Continuations/ObjectSpace
• RubySpec
• Singleton/Eigenclass on top of the DLR
• Interpreted vs. Compiled
• IDEs
• Rails Compatibility
• IActiveScriptHost and PowerShell

You can download the interview here

Thanks again to John for discussing IronRuby. I look forward to getting my hands on the IronRuby bits on July 28th. Especially after Scott Hanselman refused to let me take the IronRuby bits at RailsConf! ;)

Additional Interviews

You can hear more about what John has to say about IronRuby here:

• Just Glue It! Ruby and the DLR in Silverlight
• A conversation with John Lam about the dynamic language runtime, Silverlight, and Ruby
• ruby for .net and an interview with john lam
• Talking Ruby and Dynamic Language Support with John Lam