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July 2nd, 2008

How Linux app install leaves one PC expert befuddled

Posted by Jason Perlow @ 5:00 am

Categories: Linux, Open Source, Software Infrastructure, Virtualization, Desktop, VMWare

Tags: Ubuntu, VMware Inc., Tool, Adrian, VMWare Tools, Linux, Productivity, UNIX, Open Source, Operating Systems

failadrian.jpgAdrian, you dumb arse!

At least that was my initial reaction when I read his “Linux’s dirty little secret” column about his struggles with installing applications onto a Linux distro. It was either the Linux Geek rage originating from the knowing that he didn’t Read the Fine Manual (RTFM) or the sheer jealousy of not getting 300+ Talkbacks whenever I post something on ZDNet like the fine Mr. Kingsley-Hughes. But I digress.

You can’t really blame Adrian, though. Adrian is a relatively new Linux user – he comes from the world of Windows, where you double click on a SETUP.EXE icon and minutes later, you’ve got an application installed on your system. With Linux, that’s not the case – different package standards between distributions and lack of standardization in software manifest tools has created a situation where on the most of the major Linux distros, you have Red Hat Package Manager (RPM) files and on others, namely Ubuntu and Debian, you have Debian Archives (.DEB).

Click on the “Read the rest of this entry” link below for more.

To add further complexity into the situation, the RPMs and DEBs used on one distro are not necessarily compatible with the RPMs or DEBs on another. And some software doesn’t come in a neat little package format – they come as good ‘ol compressed tarballs (tar.gz or tar.bz2). Case in point, if you want to use the very latest builds of anything from a Open Source project such as Mozilla or OpenOffice.org, and don’t want to wait for your distribution to spoon feed it to you over their network repositories, you need to un-Gzip or un-Bzip2 and tar extract the software to a directory and make manual symbolic links to the executables and launch icons on the desktop. Fun, right?

Granted, Adrian’s specific problem could have been solved by consulting Ubuntu Forums or going to VMWare’s fine Communities  web site, where the VMWare Tools installation procedure is documented in detail. VMWare Tools is unique because it was primarily designed to use with Enterprise Linux distributions, such as RHEL and SLES – and because it is so tightly integrated with the Linux Kernel, it requires that specific driver modules be built for each distribution’s kernel, at each specific version level. For RHEL and SLES, you just need to install a single RPM file and run the configuration script, as everything is pre-built — these distros don’t change that quickly, so VMWare is safe with only needing to build modules for them periodically. But in the case of poor Adrian and Ubuntu 8.04, where the distro is refreshed every six months, you have to un-gzip-tar the software, install the linux-source and linux-headers, and install the build-essential package which contains all the necessary compiler and developer tool dependencies to build the kernel modules. THEN he can run the installer script. Got it? Good.

Fortunately, the problem will eventually just “Go Away” — the VMWare Tools package was released into Open Source, and eventually, every distribution will just have it built-in, like the newly released OpenSUSE 11 which is already VMWare enabled. I suspect that within short notice, open-vm-tools as well as the Microsoft Hyper-V hypercall adapter modifications to Xen and the Sun xVM VirtualBox tools will all be available in Ubuntu and any distribution that wants to use them. My sources tell me even ultra-geeky Gentoo, the source based distro popular with embedded systems and boot CDs, has it available.

This is all fine and dandy for VMWare Tools, but it’s hardly a happy ending for the balance of Linux users. Yes, the Linux desktop experience is improving. Yes, plenty of software is available on the download repositories for a lot of distributions, especially Ubuntu. But until this stuff is totally foolproof, even seasoned PC experts like Adrian are going to be thrown through a loop.

Do we need form a concerted effort to make Linux applications easier to install? Talk Back and Let Me Know.

Jason Perlow (click to email) is a technologist with over two decades of experience integrating large heterogeneous multi-vendor computing environments in Fortune 500 companies. See his full profile and disclosure of his industry affiliations.

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Last night, I decided to do a full install of the 64 bit openSuse distro to my AMD X2 system. It took all of an hour or so to install the OS, and then use the 1-Click process to install my high end ... (Read the rest)
Posted by: jabailo1 Posted on: 07/21/08 You are currently: Logged In | Log out
YES!!!! John E Wahd   | 07/02/08
Applications ALWAYS install on Windows WITHOUT any sort of problem fr0thy2   | 07/02/08
Where did he say that? Any chance you could actually... ye   | 07/02/08
Well I'll argue against what he said... storm14k   | 07/02/08
Make that one ... MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
You are correct.. storm14k   | 07/02/08
Nothing to do with fr0thy2 post. (nt) ye   | 07/02/08
The original post... storm14k   | 07/02/08
But the OP did not say Windows programs ALWAYS install... ye   | 07/03/08
Firefox for one bigsibling   | 07/07/08
What he said mjolnar@...   | 07/03/08
Stop trying daengbo   | 07/03/08
They might install but to get them running correctly...... atari8bit@...   | 07/04/08
For once you are right...well 99% of them do...nt socialism=nowhere   | 07/07/08
Dificult installs are a detriment to Linux d4rkaine   | 07/17/08
Ever heard of the term "DLL hell"? MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
Yeah. frgough   | 07/02/08
Agreed ... MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
The registry is your friend ... dkawalec   | 07/02/08
It's you friend ... MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
lol [nt] dkawalec   | 07/02/08
Just what problems do you keep seeing with the registry? ye   | 07/02/08
Registry garbage 20kwfence   | 07/03/08
You didn't answer the question. ye   | 07/03/08
I've had frequent problems with it. D. W. Bierbaum   | 07/03/08
You didn't answer the question either. ye   | 07/03/08
Bad Registry? Dkunzma   | 07/06/08
@Dkunzma: Any supporting facts? ye   | 07/06/08
re: I've had frequent problems with it. Badgered   | 07/18/08
agreed kcredden2   | 07/02/08
DLL hell? Well, I have to admit... John E Wahd   | 07/02/08
Yes. Though that was, what? 10 years ago? GuidingLight   | 07/02/08
Yes, DLL hell is virus hell, try uninstalling a virus (nt) n0neXn0ne   | 07/02/08
Not as much an issue today with newer Windows Installer DevGuy_z   | 07/02/08
Ever heard of the term "Dependency Hell"? andrew53   | 07/03/08
Not even close. daengbo   | 07/03/08
Not entirely true kingttx   | 07/07/08
What Were You Using? daengbo   | 07/08/08
If I am not mistaken .... ShadeTree   | 07/02/08
Well ... MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
No advertisements ..... ShadeTree   | 07/02/08
Not if you agree to it in the first place jperlow  ZDNet | 07/02/08
Hopefully that is not to say.... xuniL_z   | 07/02/08
RE: Rage against Adrian lawryll@...   | 07/02/08
haven't you noticed that most *ix admins have similar attitudes code_Warrior   | 07/02/08
Imagine trying to landscape a hectare of garden fr0thy2   | 07/02/08
Imagine? MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
Another old China hand ? mhenriday   | 07/03/08
Ah... frgough   | 07/02/08
..... Linux User 147560   | 07/02/08
You need to open your eyes,,,,,, linux for me   | 07/02/08
Hadn't noticed that... storm14k   | 07/02/08
What about *nux systems then? xuniL_z   | 07/02/08
Sure I can enligten you :-) storm14k   | 07/03/08
Well, i never intended to...... xuniL_z   | 07/07/08
LOL! Sure they don't That's why I didn't just have to reboot... ye   | 07/03/08
User error... storm14k   | 07/03/08
Nope, no user error. Face it Linux isn't perfect. ye   | 07/03/08
I'd hope Im never on a project with YOU storm14k   | 07/02/08
So far I haven't seen much out of him...time will tell. nt socialism=nowhere   | 07/07/08
Developer problem with VMware ... MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
No different in the Windows world shawn_dude   | 07/02/08
Great post fr0thy2   | 07/02/08
Give me a break. frgough   | 07/02/08
Oh no !!! MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
Yawn. frgough   | 07/02/08
Show me the money ... MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
The OP (shawn_dude) referenced... ye   | 07/03/08
frgough-ting at the mouth again? (nt) n0neXn0ne   | 07/02/08
You might be right... storm14k   | 07/02/08
You've just proved my second point about frgough   | 07/02/08
RE:You've just proved my 3rd point about n0neXn0ne   | 07/02/08
Well you certainly don't scratch a scratch... storm14k   | 07/02/08
..... Linux User 147560   | 07/02/08
Actually - they are p0figster   | 07/03/08
I would beg differ... socialism=nowhere   | 07/07/08
install on linux stdo57@...   | 07/07/08
Getting there ... but still needs work is very accurate - nt socialism=nowhere   | 07/07/08
Open Source software alaniane@...   | 07/07/08
Exactly True shawn_dude   | 07/08/08
RE: Rage against Adrian alaskareport   | 07/02/08
Linux is mainstream dumba$$ fr0thy2   | 07/02/08
keep sailing that river frgough   | 07/02/08
Hobbyist OS? MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
Hobbyist / Expert? GuidingLight   | 07/02/08
This is a Classic ... MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
Clarity is called for here! GuidingLight   | 07/02/08
Different breed of animal ... MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
Thank you, MisterMiester (you too n0neXn0ne) GuidingLight   | 07/02/08
..... Linux User 147560   | 07/02/08
LOL! Yes, Linux User 147560 GuidingLight   | 07/02/08
@: GuidingLight, ... light one candle and stop cursing the darkness n0neXn0ne   | 07/02/08
re: Hobbyist / Expert? rtfa   | 07/02/08
You MUST learn storm14k   | 07/02/08
Comparo for U Freebird54   | 07/05/08
He was, most likely, refering to John E Wahd   | 07/02/08
One word....Alien devlin_X   | 07/03/08
easier/simpler to perform installs k1nj0   | 07/03/08
My experince is a novice...but I would have to disagree...sorry. socialism=nowhere   | 07/07/08
Average user and non-average distro do not mix well ConcernedReader   | 07/06/08
I'm planning on moving from Ubuntu to Suse socialism=nowhere   | 07/07/08
Strawman frgough   | 07/02/08
No you're wrong ... MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
Ridiculous markbn   | 07/02/08
Well let's see .. MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
More "market share" data ... MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
One of these stats is VERY revealing. xuniL_z   | 07/03/08
Stop living in denial markbn   | 07/03/08
MS is a monopoly but it's not entrenched.. eMJayy   | 07/04/08
the title of your post says it all markbn   | 07/10/08
Yes, WinME sucked...bigtime. gypkap@...   | 07/03/08
yes, because supercomputers JamesDoyle   | 07/03/08
You dropped your paddle....... linux for me   | 07/02/08
Let's be fair now ... MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
Red hat frgough   | 07/02/08
circular logic alert ! n0neXn0ne   | 07/02/08
You are the real loser..... linux for me   | 07/02/08
Linux will never be mainstream for the desktop marks055@...   | 07/02/08
Thank God for that ... startx.jeff   | 07/03/08
But your going against the grain of socialism=nowhere   | 07/07/08
Confusion comes in misuse of word Linux hamobu   | 07/02/08
Ditto b.bob   | 07/02/08
Great points fr0thy2   | 07/02/08
re: Great points too n0neXn0ne   | 07/02/08
Lots!!! NetArch.   | 07/02/08
Don't forget k1nj0   | 07/03/08
The difference is frgough   | 07/02/08
Both are Linux. But if Windows is Windows... Letophoro   | 07/02/08
So--.. gypkap@...   | 07/03/08
Incompatibilty. Letophoro   | 07/03/08
Not the same slaskoske   | 07/07/08
Good Article jkohut   | 07/02/08
To my mind, jkohut - and others before him - make a valid point : mhenriday   | 07/03/08
Linux dirty secret croberts   | 07/02/08
Windows dirty secret fr0thy2   | 07/02/08
Put your bible away croberts   | 07/02/08
re: Put your bible away rtfa   | 07/02/08
re: Put your bible away Joe Dufflebag   | 07/03/08
BINGO!....right on the money. Shhh don't socialism=nowhere   | 07/07/08
This was about linux...and Linux has a ton of socialism=nowhere   | 07/07/08
You were right up to a point. storm14k   | 07/02/08
You forgot binary imcompatibility NetArch.   | 07/02/08
I really believe... storm14k   | 07/02/08
BIG ++ (nt) kingttx   | 07/07/08
Alien.. 20kwfence   | 07/03/08
Thank you for sharing the truth... storm14k   | 07/03/08
"Even" Gentoo? Yagotta B. Kidding   | 07/02/08
RE: Rage against Linux package differences 21_years_IT   | 07/02/08
You wish has been granted! devlin_X   | 07/03/08
I will never understand... storm14k   | 07/03/08
I know of one kingttx   | 07/07/08
SuSE handles RPM really nicely. bjbrock   | 07/02/08
You gotta be Kidding? jpr75_z   | 07/02/08
re: You gotta be Kidding? rtfa   | 07/02/08
RE: Rage against Adrian DannyO_0x98   | 07/02/08
We have a "Slider" ... MisterMiester   | 07/02/08
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